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Posted: 4/27/2008 9:09:50 AM EDT
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I was wondering what you guys think would be better. a m1a or a M4 in .308? Are the M4's more reliable, more accurate,user friendly,more after market supplys. I want a gun that will shoot sub MOA @ 100 yrds, that doesnt need constant cleaning, thats reliable, and be some what accurate out to 500 yrds. thanks |
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This M14 will do everything you wish, but it will run more than double the cost of a LE 6920... The MK14 SEI Mod 1 shoots sub MOA @ 100 yards, needs little cleaning, it's ultra reliable, and it's very accurate out to 700 +/- yards. NATO ball, 150 & 168 grain TAP and M118LR are all good. 
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Clyde, I saw your post in the AR forum too. The M4 / AR15 carbine as opposed to an M14 / M1A is like asking, "Which is better, a Ferrari or a Hummer". They are both very different designs and shoot a different caliber. One can be as light as 6 lbs and the other is usually at least 8.5 pounds. One recoils pretty stoutly, the other just jumps a little. They are very different animals. What do you want it for and choose your weapon. I personally like them both. BUT, if I had to make a choice between the 2, I would want to know more about the parameters I'm working with. I think an M4 is a great SHTF weapon. I also think a Scout / Socom would fit that role very well. For me, the lighter the better, so the nod goes to the AR. BUT, it is obvious that a .308 is a much more powerful weapon. If I really thought I needed the power, I'd definitely find one as light as possible to hump. If I knew I was getting out of cars alot with it and needed it to be ready, I'd go with an M4gery. I mean, there are so many differences, they each have strengths and weaknesses. Getting both is really the only way to know what they really are. So if I was you, pick which one you want first and get one. And then down the road, get the other kind. There is no right answer and personal preference is really the main issue. H2O Man has both, but I can tell he favors the M1A platform. But he does have some AR's too. It is really hard to choose between the two, once you've had them. Some may find it easier for one reason or another. Personally, I think the M4gery is a handier, easier to use, easier to hump, more ergonomic and just plain easy and fun to shoot. But again, if I had to only have one and chose an M4, I think there would be times when I wished I had something more powerful. And the converse is true, if I only had an M1A, there would be times I was wishing for something lighter and easier to pack and shoot. My 2 cents.  Also, if you haven't shot both, try to find someone that will let you and you may know instantly which one you want more. Or it may not be so evident. But at least you'll have some experience. |
It seems like H20man is a sales rep. for SAGE, always showing off his new EBRs  Alright, I'll throw in my M1A Scout EBR too. JJrea, you know you like the M1A more, you're always in the M1A forum  As ARFCOM tradition, get both, I have a M1A & M4gery, both 100% reliable after about 1000rds of rounds, never falter. One is heavy and has the ooomph, the other is lighter weight and plenty of power for SHTF situations like NOLA floods, or Zombies. This was just last month, these three pigs were in a group, took the big tan w/ 2 quick tap to the boiler from 15yards, ran up to inspect, the middle one charged, put 4 quick 150gr Win. BST into him, 2 to the head & snout, 2 to the boiler. The 3rd held his ground, then charged, 2 quick rounds to the spine. The M1A can sure stack em...  My friend used my RRA M4gery on this boar, from 20yards, he's not best shot, 3 rapid shot, 1 hit the butt, 2 missed, the boar charged, he dumped about 15rds, 2 non-fatal hits, others missed  , boar still charging, he looked at me for backup, I put 3 quick shots to the body from the M1A, all connected and dropped it. In all honesty, SHTF urban scenario, I would grab the M4gery, lighter weight & more ammo, plenty power to take down two-legged felons/foes. |
Thanks! How much? ~ Priceless. All USGI TRW parts with a rare chrome lined SEI barrel built on a forged Norinco receiver. The stock is 1 of only 11 that SAGE, Int. released to the retail market.
Weight is an issue... my LE 6920 weighs in at about 9 lbs unloaded, my Mod 1 weighs about 11 lbs unloaded. Both can be lighter, but mine are full featured For further comparison, my full featured T56SHTF weighs about 10 lbs. unloaded ... 
LOL !! ... I couldn't handle the cut in pay.. |
I just like it over on this board because there's less BS. Not because I like the M1A better. Plus, you're leaving out the fact that you have shot some monsters with your M4gery and Q3131A. I think for you, the gray matter between the ears has more to do with your deadliness than the exact platform. You'd probably do well with whatever platform you got. But your old posts are enough to prove to me that an AR is a formidable weapon. Even on some pretty stout HOGS!!!! You should do a book of all your write ups!!!!!!!! It would be great!!!!!Glad to see you posting again. You been busy? I still have a little stash of Q3131A. I can only find Q3131 currently though. And it's not getting any cheaper. 
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Your 6920 wouldn't weight 9lbs if you just had a light on it, like you AK.
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Clyde, I forget to mention. I don't think either one is much more maintenance proof than the other and they both meet your requirements. Only thing is, what are you wanting to hit at 500 yards and do you need the extra energy for that requirement. AR's can be very accurate. In my experience, they are both about equal accuracy wise, although the longer sight radius on the M1A make is easier for it to be more accurate than a carbine. If using just the irons. But then again, the lack of recoil with an AR makes it easier to shoot accurately.
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The LaRue 7.0, LMT SOPMOD and AA EOTech add up to about 9 lbs. on the Colt. I could shave a few ounces with a T-1 from Aimpoint, but I want a 2 MOA dot  Heavy recoil does effect accurate follow up shots, but the M14 is a pussy cat to shoot accurately. |
That poor rifle.  It needs a reasonable stock and a little loving to make it feel good about itself again. If you don't like the recoil, put a USCG brake on it and you'll be golden. That's all it took on mine. Why do people insist on taking a nice weapon and making it look like a prop from the movie Fifth Element? |
Well, ditch the optic altogether and put 6 pos stock back on there and get back to me. You don't have an optic on your AK. That was kind of my point. Either way, they can be a lot lighter than 9lbs.  |
Judging books by their covers ~ Some love the look and some don't . . . I could care less.
As far back as I can remember traditional, or as you say "reasonable" has never appealed to me. The modifications that I have chosen do enhance the rifles performance - that's what I'm after. Looks are not even a secondary concern for me. Besides . . . these ain't no beauty queens. |
I currently run a AA EO on the AR, it was removed for the picture. I am stripping it down and lightening it for my girl, the original Colt butt stock is back on the rifle, the LMT is set aside for a second AK. She can have the LE if she likes it, otherwise it will just sit in the vault or sold off and my girl will shoot the Winchester Model 94 .357 mag carbine I have |
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Ar15 for sure. Lighter, better ergos, just as if not more reliable (in sand), faster follow ups, person can carry more ammo, etc. My favorite AR of mine with an ACOG is around 6.5 lb. ETA: I see h2o ETA 2: Better for what? I just assumed SHTF, but what is the purpose of this discussion? |
Thanks, I think I haven't posted in about 5mos, been pretty busy playing & modding my little American made badass toy Had it for about 1.5years, reliable, and love the all American hp & torque, no Japanese turbos  As for the Q3131A, I bought 2 cases before they got expensive & rare, got to love America, the freedom to buy all the guns & ammo one can afford, and throw in some displacement while I am at it... All the libs can go to hell if they don't like our beloved USA. The weights of my RRA M4gery w/ ARMS SIR fully loaded about 10#, where as the M1A EBR setup about 14#. No replacement for American displacement ! 
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Nice Viper but there certainly is a replacement for displacement. I dropped a pair of American turbos on a 440. It doesn't get the looks of a Viper but it'll hold it's own against the modded cars. Insurance is MUCH cheaper too.   
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It's just personal taste and mine is for the M14/M1A. People can and will say what they feel stands for everyone as they just don't think beyond on what they like, but for me the M14/M1A has better ergo's, a stronger steel design, excellent room to expand on with stock and accessory options and just a better running system through more rounds and less maintenance if needs be. I have found the piston AR variants to be more similar in the operating system as I have a POF AR and experience with others besides mine, but I wouldn't take it in a fight or survival over my M1A and am actually selling it off now for another M1A too.  |
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Dang, nice cars everyone!!!!!!!!!!! I agree that it is personal preference. That why I said for ME, the lighter the better. And an AR of any config is lighter than any M1A with the same amount of stuff on it. And if you leave the stuff off, you have a really light package. The only item I see as a necessity for defense and SHTF is a light. |
I like being a little different. That's why my Poly is in a purple USGI 'glass stock. Here's a pic from several years ago. It's got new glass now.  People have made some comments about the color but when you look at the target you can't tell what color the gun was.
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A glamor shot of the SAGE Scout EBR, the SmithEnterprise CoastGuard muzzle brake makes this M1A shoots like a pussycat, and this platform has rails for your optics, light. lasers, even plenty of real estate left to hang Christmas ornaments too   Feets, Very nice build, twin turbos on V8, blow off valves, so sweet, always love the retro-muscle cars, wished I had the know-how to rebuild something like that, I'll just stick to modding simple stuff like M1A & M4gery... I am sure you've seen pics of the Dodge retro Challenger w/ a 6.1Hemi car to be for sale soon, very muscular retro-lines -- 6.1Hemi  
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Correct, Thx JJrea. Upside down Chevron reticle, tri-power (FiberOptics light gatherer, very bright when there's any hint of sunlight, or manmade lightsource, backup battery, and glow tube). Very robust, after about 1K rounds, nothing has broken loose yet. I like it more than my Aimpoint on my M4gery. |
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While I'm sure the proverbial dead horse has been beaten already on the topic of M14 v. AR15, it comes down to your intended use and what you're willing to spend. The M14 is a battle rifle, the AR15 is an assault rifle. Each hold distinct roles within tactical doctrine and as doctrine changed there was a transition from the battle rifle to the assault rifle. Once you figure out where on the doctrinal continuum your intended use falls you'll have a better idea of which type of weapons system fits your needs. That said, I have one of each. I love my AR's for what they can do and I love my M14s for what they can do. Each has different capabilities and strengths. None of my M14's are modified to the extent that you see here (the most "modified" M14 I own is a 18.5" bush length rifle with a early ARMS18 and Aimpoint micro-t sight) but they fit the bill for what I'm looking for. If your budget only allows one or the other I'd go for an AR platform in 5.56mm. Ammo is cheaper, parts are plentiful and you'll be into the system for less of an initial start up cost allowing you more money for range time to improve your skills. If the budget isn't that tight I'd look at an AR15 and also a M14 platform before a .308 AR. Several of my friends who have .308 AR's have had problems with them (granted they were all armalites, so I can't speak for the other manufacturers), but the reliability issues and lack of interchangeable parts is the biggest negative that has kept me away from a .308 AR. Just my two cents. |
Thank you gentlemen. John |
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Kitty... I've dropped one of the USCG brakes on the Poly. It definately works wonders. As for the Challenger, I'm very aware of it. I work in the auto industry but we handle Mercedes/Porsche/Maserati/Bentley/Rolls. I'm also on the board of directors of a very large and very active Mopar club. The new Challenger going to be pretty cool. |
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