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Posted: 2/3/2003 2:28:08 PM EDT
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... Are these Chinese knockoffs worth having in your inventory? I've heard some discouraging stories about Springfield M1As lately and I'm just wondering if they are reasonable alternatives. ... Do you like yours? |
| www.smithenterprise.com Go into the Tactical site, then the "info" page, then the "M-14 information" page. There is also some interesting info at Fulton Armory's site. Head space may or may not be a problem depending on who you talk to. The Chinese M-14's are head spaced for 7.62mm NATO. Problems seem to arise when people check the headspace with .308 Win. gauges. I have a Poly Tech that has had Ron Smiths bolt conversion (by previuos owner). Other than the receiver and barrel, it is now entirley U.S.G.I. parts. I have never owned a stock Chinese M-14S but for the right price, I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if I was in the market. They can't be any worse than what S.A. Inc. is putting out lately and are IMO potentialy much better. |
one of the guys i shoot with has an m21 clone built on a preban norinco reciever. reciever is sturdy and built to spec. all his work was done by smith enterprises and is top notch |
| My son has a polytech M14 and has had no problems with it. He has fired around a thousand rounds through it without any malfunctions. It hold good groups too with lake city and Hirt ammo. I have a Springfield M1A I bought a couple years ago and I love it and wouldn't trade it for anything but I would not hesitate to buy a polytech if the price was right. Just my humble opinion. |
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Winston....I have used a few of the PRC M-14 knockoff and I have noticed they actually work much of the time....BUT I would NOT own one for the world....you get what you pay for... They do not accept a lot of G.I. parts...especially the smaller parts ( the ones you always end up replacing ) and the metal on many of the guns is noticeably softer. Personally, I think it would be a good idea to snoop around for a used M1A..especially the older ones. I think it is possible to find good "new" M1A rifles also, you sort of have to know what to look for and wish upon a falling star the night before you buy one(just for luck). If you have the cash, the wisest idea is to have Fulton Armory build one...or Arrington Accuracy ( they are in Scottsdale ). Again, stay away from the Chinese knockoffs. |
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As Chinese receivers are "forged" they make excellent M-14s, follow Sukebe's advice, check out Smith Enterprise, as they re-heat treated and tweaked mine and I was very pleased w/ it. They can generally be had for very good prices and with proper tuning by an expert can be very reliable and servicable weapons. Mike |
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Why buy something you have to tweak THAT MUCH??? Try repairng a rear sight component on a Chicom gun...you'll have a heck of a time getting parts to fit. To insure your face doesn't get blown off you have to send the damn thing to Smith to get a GI bolt installed and the reciever RE-heat treated. There is no economy in that at all....NONE. Now mind you, I absolutely hate Springfield Armory more than any comapny on the planet but I would STILL buy an M1A before I would buy something made buy slave laborers...PERIOD. If your gonna get burned at least get burned by a company that does have a warranty and does (generally) live by it. |
| As I mentioned above, my Poly Tech was sent to Smith Enterprises by the previuos owner for a bolt conversion. It was tested for hardness and did not require heat treatment. As I stated, everything but the barrel and receiver are U.S.G.I.. The gas cylidner lock is Chinese only because the threads are metric, same with the flash suppressor nut. The only part that required even minor fitting was the op-rod. This is normal for any M-14 type rifle. All it required was a couple of minutes with a dremel to smooth out the action. I only had one so I had to make it fit. If I had a bin to choose from I would have been able to find one that would drop in. The rear sight, trigger group, gas system, stock, hand guard, barrel band, bolt stop, clip guide, operating spring and guide, connector pin, front sight and flash suppressor all fit fine. I have the Chinese parts as spares. Some of the parts were replaced before I got the rifle, I replaced some others. Not because I felt it needed them but because I wanted to. Desertmoon has admittedly never owned a Chinese M-14 clone. He knows not of what he speaks. "insure your face doesn't get blown off" I've not seen one genuine, reliable documentation of a Chinese M-14 with a catastrophic failure. "Slave labor" I see where he's coming from. It can't be good if it's made in China. Who makes the best AK-47 clone? Poly Tech. |
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I am short on time here, but to answer sixgun's question, I have had two VERY bad experiences with their products and their service lately, which is the complete opposite of the Springfield Armory that I used to deal with. I believe (and I have the experiences of others to back me up on that) that Springfield is turning out overpriced crap on the civilian market to make up for money that they are probably losing in the L.E. and Military market. I used to reccommend S.A. to everyone, but as of late of feel VERY betrayed by them so I havebasically sworn vengence upon them. If I can take away 3 dollars from the bottom line of Springfield Armory then I will move heaven and earth to keep those f8cks from getting those three dollars. I would love to see the Springfield factory smote into dust by the hand of God himself...but I am not to sure the Big Guy is all that much into the Ol' Fire n' Brimestone stuff of the past. you could say I am a bit bitter about the whole thing. I don't take betrayal all that well. Suk. I do promise to get back on track with this...forgive me for hijacking the thread. |
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O.k. Sukebe, you mention that except for your barrel and receiver the rest of your gun is G.I. That's cool, and if it has been checked and okayed, then better still. My first point technically is: why should you have to do that?...a gun should work when it walks out the door. Period. It should be safe...period. ( hence, of course, my CURRENT disgust with Springfield) Check out the Kuhnhausen 30 cal service rifle manuel ( essential ) and read the results of his hardness tests on the Chinese weapons. Guns magazine did a simple head to head ten thousand round test of the Springfield and the Polytech in the mid nineties. Both weapons were bought from gunstore and then the testers were reimbursed after the fact...so no hand picked rifles there.....take a guess as to which rifle lasted only 495 rounds? The Springfield not only completed it's test but actually improved in accuracy at around the 6000 round mark. The poly tech caught fire at around 300 and something rounds and then finally seized up by round 495. By that time the headspace was already approaching the no go point. Now, as I have said, I have shot a few polytech M14's and I have honestly found them reliable and accurate for the AMOUNT OF TIME I USED THEM. I often wish I would have bought a FULLY CHINESE ( NOT a rework!! )one just to give it a run against a Springfield in the long term use catagory. I haven't. I still would NOT trust one. I am sticking to that...just like I don't eat Mexican food in a restaurant owned by a white guy, I don't buy an American weapon from a people who could care less about grand artisanship. (Let us leave the beauty of Ancient China out of this, there is NO COMPARISON). That may sound "blunt" but it is honest. The hilarious thing about this entire discussion is that Springfield has made my point MOOT. Considering the absolute CRAP that Springfield has been turning out lately ( as they rest so lightly on their laurels ) I probably would be BETTER OFF TO BUY A CHINESE GUN and have it reworked. In reality, I would save my nickles and dimes and have either Smith or Fulton or Arrington Accuracy build one for me on a forged reciever like an Entreprise ( I am ssuming they are good...I really don't know on that one). so, there's my opinion and I am sticking to it. ya get what ya pay for... ( and if ya buy from Springfield they throw in a nice a$^ f*$#in' for free ) I couldn't resist that!!!!!!!! |
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... Well, I bought one. I figured for about $500 I couldn't go wrong, even if I have to put a $300 reliability package in it. ... I also got two (30) round non-USGI mags that are guaranteed to function flawlessly, so I'm kinda excited about trying them out this weekend. |
Excellent buy! I'd buy one today for that price. Before you put any money into it get the headspace checked. You may be pleasantly surprised. Make sure whoever checks it uses gauges for 7.62mm NATO. Let us know the results. CMP still has U.S.G.I. parts if you feel the need to change some. Coles has the best deal on U.S.G.I. mags www.coledistributing.com. Ask about the 10 for $310.00 deal not advertised on the site. If you experience some reliability issues with the after market Mags., try some G.I. mags before you get discouraged. |
I have a Polytech, and it's a fantastic weapon: "Why buy a weapon that needs all that work done to it?" I bought it because I wanted the BEST COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE RECEIVER ON THE MARKET. It's forged. Closer to GI than the Springfield.  I got it with the intent of having Smith do the conversion. I never even put a round through her. Sent it to Smith, they machined it to fit a USGI Bolt, they heat treated it, parkerized it, it's perfect. I'd never trade it for a Springfield. My rifle is superior. |
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