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Posted: 8/28/2017 8:59:37 PM EDT
[#1]
External Boosters and their Pistons are not classified as silencer parts. Hence, why they're able to be sold at retail and w/o a tax stamp. End caps are silencer parts and must be dealt w/ accordingly. What you can do is make a rear cap with the largest thread you intend to use and build bushing to fit smaller pitches. The bushing/adapters are also not considered silencer parts.
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Posted: 8/29/2017 11:33:26 AM EDT
[#2]
Historically BATFE considers a tube, the endcaps, and everything they contain silencer parts.
So no, you can NOT make two different endcaps for threading onto different hosts. You could do as stated above, and make an adapter for the smaller thread size. You could also make an endcap with a much larger thread (like a gemtech multimount) and then make multiple adapters (or purchase commercially available if using the same thread as others on the market) for hosts. |
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Posted: 8/29/2017 8:02:18 PM EDT
[#3]
DM will also thread for Bowers VersAdapt inserts. Thats a fairly cheap option.
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Posted: 8/30/2017 1:17:43 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
DM will also thread for Bowers VersAdapt inserts. Thats a fairly cheap option. |
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Posted: 9/1/2017 10:43:57 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Historically BATFE considers a tube, the endcaps, and everything they contain silencer parts. So no, you can NOT make two different endcaps for threading onto different hosts. You could do as stated above, and make an adapter for the smaller thread size. You could also make an endcap with a much larger thread (like a gemtech multimount) and then make multiple adapters (or purchase commercially available if using the same thread as others on the market) for hosts. a "D" sized tube with one of the two endcaps being a "D" to "B" reducer, then the suppressor is complete. from there you can put what ever thread adapter on it you want. This is the exact concept of a Gemtech Multimount. ( I have one of these ) Any b sized adapter will fit it and is not considered a suppressor part. |
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Posted: 9/1/2017 11:14:07 PM EDT
[#6]
I have two barrel adapters but I use both as end caps at the same time, one on each end and swap them for each application. This way I don't have any extra parts. It seems kind of stupid, but I didn't want to risk tolerance stacking with threaded bushing type adapters and I didn't write the stupid rules.
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Posted: 9/3/2017 5:42:33 PM EDT
[#7]
Endcaps are part of the silencer as far as BATF is concerned.
On the other hand, you can have multiple adapters that fit the threads of your endcap. For example, my Form 1 can is in .22 and has a 1/2-28 threaded end cap. That works for just about any .22 barrel, but my Walther P22 has a metric thread on the muzzle. I have an adapter for between the metric barrel end nut thread and the 1/2-28 thread, which is apparently a typical approach for this sort of thing. |
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Posted: 9/8/2017 11:43:46 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Endcaps are part of the silencer as far as BATF is concerned. . |
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Posted: 9/9/2017 5:41:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But what about different direct thread endcaps that have another use other than suppressor use such as perhaps a solvent trap ????? Even if all it does is hold the parts in, an end cap is a "suppressor part" and not something you can switch out. |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 1:10:54 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But what about different direct thread endcaps that have another use other than suppressor use such as perhaps a solvent trap ????? |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 11:26:45 AM EDT
[#11]
My solution was to build three cans, with end caps of the same size, but each with a different attachment method. One is YHM, one 1/2-28, one 5/8-24. That way I can always have three complete cans, but can mount any single one of them to a variety of hosts.
I'm still not convinced it's illegal to have multiple DT adapters, but it was enough of a gray area that I wanted to stay out of it. |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 6:33:31 PM EDT
[#12]
I have considered building a rather large muzzle break that consists of a short tube with the same size/threads at the silencer tube and slots cut in the sides. Then, build various ends for that muzzle break in whatever thread/caliber I desire.
May or may not be legal, not sure. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 11:40:33 AM EDT
[#13]
Depends on how you do it.
Example: 
Red piece #1 is an end cap, only one allowed At spot #2, the tube holds the baffles in. Gray piece is a thread adapter. Baffles won't fall out without it. Most cans have 1/2" or 5/8" internal threads, in this case the green, blue and red parts are a complete can with a 1.25" external thread (#3) Gray piece could be pinned and welded to the barrel at spot #4. Or you could start out with a big enough barrel blank and have that thread at the end. Not a silencer part but equivalent to the gray piece: 
Has a common thread to attach to a barrel, and a less common thread to attached to a specific silencer. But really, just make your can to permanently be threaded for the bigger muzzle, and buy or make something like this: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/muzzle-devices/thread-adapters/thread-adapter-1-2-28-to-5-8-24-prod54364.aspx Edit: Well ok, I don't know if any of this shit is actually required. But if you think it's required this is one way to do it. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 11:31:21 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depends on how you do it. Example: https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/59227/can_pic-307282.jpg Red piece #1 is an end cap, only one allowed At spot #2, the tube holds the baffles in. Gray piece is a thread adapter. Baffles won't fall out without it. Most cans have 1/2" or 5/8" internal threads, in this case the green, blue and red parts are a complete can with a 1.25" external thread (#3) Gray piece could be pinned and welded to the barrel at spot #4. Or you could start out with a big enough barrel blank and have that thread at the end. Not a silencer part but equivalent to the gray piece: https://media.midwayusa.com/productimages/880x660/Primary/284/284904.jpg Has a common thread to attach to a barrel, and a less common thread to attached to a specific silencer. But really, just make your can to permanently be threaded for the bigger muzzle, and buy or make something like this: http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts/muzzle-devices/thread-adapters/thread-adapter-1-2-28-to-5-8-24-prod54364.aspx Nothing as far as I know. Pure internet myth...like the "ok to build it shorter but not longer" myth. |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 1:40:29 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Exactly what does the "hold the baffles in" discussion have to do with it? Nothing as far as I know. Pure internet myth...like the "ok to build it shorter but not longer" myth. The Multimount design is acceptable to copy for how it's setup. No difference in how it works. With the MM you can have as many endcaps as you want, or as many different boosters as you want. They are an UNREGULATED item. if they were regulated Gemtech would have had their shit pushed in by the ATF long ago. I know this is a tech forum. . . But you guys seriously think the ATF is standing over your shoulder waiting to try to come up with any excuse to fuck your life up. Copy an existing design from a big company and you will be fine. |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 8:12:16 PM EDT
[#16]
Big Waylon, please correct me if I'm off base with any of this...
I think it's important to keep in mind that major silencer manufacturers can and have "done things" that you and I might run into ATF trouble with. My read is that any structural part of a suppressor is a "suppressor part." It may or may not hold baffles in, but there's some sort of necessary function to that part, making it somehow special to that suppressor. The whole point of the flash hider/silencer mount is not (necessarily) to allow you to use the silencer on multiple firearms, but to allow you to remove the silencer from that particular firearm. Gemtech, AAC, YHM, and other brands of silencer mounts are essentially the same thing as the thread adapter I mentioned in my earlier post. The part that the mount fits in the suppressor is a suppressor part (whether it holds in baffles or just whistles "Dixie") and you can only have one of these per suppressor, while the XYZ suppressor mount is unregulated. |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 10:28:07 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Big Waylon, please correct me if I'm off base with any of this... I think it's important to keep in mind that major silencer manufacturers can and have "done things" that you and I might run into ATF trouble with. My read is that any structural part of a suppressor is a "suppressor part." It may or may not hold baffles in, but there's some sort of necessary function to that part, making it somehow special to that suppressor. The whole point of the flash hider/silencer mount is not (necessarily) to allow you to use the silencer on multiple firearms, but to allow you to remove the silencer from that particular firearm. Gemtech, AAC, YHM, and other brands of silencer mounts are essentially the same thing as the thread adapter I mentioned in my earlier post. The part that the mount fits in the suppressor is a suppressor part (whether it holds in baffles or just whistles "Dixie") and you can only have one of these per suppressor, while the XYZ suppressor mount is unregulated. My only point on my "holding baffles in" question was that it was a myth that gets repeated. That's not the reason you could buy some adapters/end caps without getting a separate stamp. I hope the reply to my question by Getnlwr was directed at the thread in general, and not my reply specifically. I'm not over complicating anything...but I'm also not trying to make decisions for anybody else. There's zero consistency with the ATF and what they decide is acceptable or not. The "necessary function" argument seems to be completely dependent on who you ask on which day. The reason you can buy some components individually is they can be used elsewhere. For example, I have an adapter that SiCo made that never was sold to the public...it takes an Octane endcap on one end and any adapter mount on the other. The adapter mount doesn't hold baffles in...but he endcap does. Yet you can buy both items without a stamp. It's all complete nonsense. |
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Posted: 9/16/2017 2:47:05 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's all complete nonsense. |
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Posted: 9/17/2017 3:16:59 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I hope the reply to my question by Getnlwr was directed at the thread in general, |
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Posted: 9/24/2017 3:09:04 PM EDT
[#20]
I just built my cans around sd tacticals' griffin taper mount d tube adaptor. Then you just buy griffin armament taper mount muzzle devices for all your hosts. They come in all the common thread pitches.
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Posted: 9/25/2017 8:40:06 PM EDT
[#21]
SD makes a pig cover that fits all of their thread adapters. Would that give the alternative use for different adapters making then essentially not suppressor parts?
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Posted: 9/26/2017 11:17:40 AM EDT
[#22]
The only true "safe" adapters to use are the ones commercially available.
If you can buy a part that has been determined to not be a silencer part, and use it how it was intended without modification, you will obviously be fine. Whether or not you can then make your own exact copy, or a similar copy, of that part (thread adapter, swappable endcap aperture, etc.) to use on a form1 suppressor is pushing into the grey area. Being able to legally swap parts like endcaps between different suppressors is pushing into the grey area. It is highly unlikely ATF or anybody else will ever pursue a case of illegal possession of an unregistered silencer in these cases, but that doesn't mean they couldn't. Historically ATF has always been on the side of more restriction, and it has taken court rulings to keep them in check. |
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