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Posted: 9/17/2014 10:20:22 PM EDT
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I apologize for the stupid question, but in all my searching I have not come up with a solid answer yet. I see a lot of people saying to go ahead and SBR a lower or two while the turn around time is so fast right now even if you don't have all the parts to build yet. I am wanting to send in a couple of Form 1's to SBR two of my stripped lowers that are sitting in my safe right now. I know I want to build one of them into a 300BLK with a 8-9" barrel and the second lower I don't know what I really want to do with it right now. My question is this:
Since I only have the stripped lowers right now, what should I put on the Form 1's to get them approved while the process is having such quick turn around times? I have a trust that I know is good to go because I just received my stamp back for my suppressor I submitted back in March. However, this will be my first time e-filing and my first time doing an SBR. Again, sorry for the question but I couldn't find a solid answer by using the search. Thank you for any help with this guys! |
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Do you have one already? Or at least a pretty definite plan?
The form is to "make" the firearm. That's a one time action. Once that is done, you can run whatever upper you want, regardless of caliber or barrel length. So, you could fill out a dozen Form 1s and put 300 as the caliber, 8" as the barrel length, and 27" as the OAL. When approved, build the lower and attach your 8" 300BLK upper. Then take it off. You've met the letter of the law in every way. I know people that file every single one as a 10.5" 5.56, because they know they'll always have one of those uppers in the safe. After the fact, if it makes you feel better, you can send a letter to the ATF notifying them of the caliber, barrel length and OAL you ended up with...but there's no requirement to do so. |
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Thank you BigWaylon. This is the information I have been looking for. So now my plan is this:
Lower #1: 300BLK with 8" barrel and collapsible stock Lower #2: 5.56mm with 10.5" barrel and collapsible stock Now my question is: Does anyone know what the overall length of each of these builds would be or where I can find out since I don't have all the parts on-hand right now? Thanks for the help! 
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Quoted:
Thank you BigWaylon. This is the information I have been looking for. So now my plan is this: Lower #1: 300BLK with 8" barrel and collapsible stock Lower #2: 5.56mm with 10.5" barrel and collapsible stock Now my question is: Does anyone know what the overall length of each of these builds would be or where I can find out since I don't have all the parts on-hand right now? Most builds will basically be barrel length plus 19", assuming no permanently attached muzzle device. Collapsible stocks must be fully extended for the OAL measurement. |
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I thought muzzle attachment was considered part of OAL? Having seen some guys who have been in the business a while, their measurements could be called approximate... I would err on the side of shorter as being longer than the paperwork seems less insidious... It only counts if it's permanently attached, which you usually don't have on an SBR. It's why you can buy a 14.7" upper with an A2 pinned and welded and get to the 16" minimum. ATF has specific guidelines as to what counts as permanently attached, and a muzzle device torqued down with or without a crush washer or shim doesn't even come close to qualifying. |
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Quoted:
Most builds will basically be barrel length plus 19", assuming no permanently attached muzzle device. Collapsible stocks must be fully extended for the OAL measurement. Quoted:
Quoted:
Thank you BigWaylon. This is the information I have been looking for. So now my plan is this: Lower #1: 300BLK with 8" barrel and collapsible stock Lower #2: 5.56mm with 10.5" barrel and collapsible stock Now my question is: Does anyone know what the overall length of each of these builds would be or where I can find out since I don't have all the parts on-hand right now? Most builds will basically be barrel length plus 19", assuming no permanently attached muzzle device. Collapsible stocks must be fully extended for the OAL measurement. Thanks. This estimate will be very close to accurate. I just took one of my completed rifles and pinned a stripped upper to it with no barrel and fully extended the Magpul CTR stock that's on it. It measured almost exactly 19" from the end of the stock to the end of the barrel nut threads. Thanks again for all of the help! |
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Quoted:
Thanks. This estimate will be very close to accurate. I just took one of my completed rifles and pinned a stripped upper to it with no barrel and fully extended the Magpul CTR stock that's on it. It measured almost exactly 19" from the end of the stock to the end of the barrel nut threads. Thanks again for all of the help! You could've also taken a completed rifle and measured the barrel with a dowel to the closed bolt face and then the OAL, and subtracted the two. 
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Quoted:
You could've also taken a completed rifle and measured the barrel with a dowel to the closed bolt face and then the OAL, and subtracted the two.
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Quoted:
Thanks. This estimate will be very close to accurate. I just took one of my completed rifles and pinned a stripped upper to it with no barrel and fully extended the Magpul CTR stock that's on it. It measured almost exactly 19" from the end of the stock to the end of the barrel nut threads. Thanks again for all of the help! You could've also taken a completed rifle and measured the barrel with a dowel to the closed bolt face and then the OAL, and subtracted the two.
HAHA! I didn't even think about doing that and I literally have a long dowel sitting right beside me at my desk right now.  Oh well, I guess I'll know for next time now. I'm gonna try to get my trust scanned to an electronic file tomorrow so I can hopefully get everything turned in soon. Thanks again for all the help.
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Quoted:
maybe misunderstood, barrel length should definitely exclude a muzzle attachment unless pinned, but OAL should include the muzzle attachment regardless correct? No. Same rule on muzzle devices for both measurements. It only counts if permanently attached. 2.1.3 Rifle. A rifle is a firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and designed to use the energy of an explosive in a fixed cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled barrel for each single pull of the trigger.11 A rifle subject to the NFA has a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length. The ATF procedure for measuring barrel length is to measure from the closed bolt (or breech-face) to the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device. Permanent methods of attachment include full-fusion gas or electric steel-seam welding, high-temperature (1100°F) silver soldering, or blind pinning with the pin head welded over. Barrels are measured by inserting a dowel rod into the barrel until the rod stops against the bolt or breech-face. The rod is then marked at the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device, withdrawn from the barrel, and measured. 2.1.4 Weapon made from a rifle. A weapon made from a rifle is a rifle type weapon that has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length. The overall length of a firearm is the distance between the muzzle of the barrel and the rearmost portion of the weapon measured on a line parallel to the axis of the bore 2.1.3 indicates the permanent muzzle device is used for barrel length, so the "muzzle" for 2.1.4 is now the end of the barrel/muzzle device setup. |
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