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Posted: 9/3/2010 7:08:33 PM EDT
My E4 is going to be relegated to a home defense gun or shtf, a range toy out to 150, etc.

Right now I just have Troy BUIS on it and at a loss for an optic. I really wish I could have some magnification for the range, even at only 150 yards, but magnification is silly for HD. Briefly considered acog with a T1 mounted also, but then added up costs, both financial and weight wise on the gun and strarted thinking maybe just an RX30, though that big ole 6.5 moa is going to be a pain at 150 yards.

Any thoughts? And if I am heading down the road of an rx30.... What mount and where to get?

Thanks!
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:15:25 PM EDT
I don't like the RX30. I had one, and the dot was just too weak in my opinion. For that money it could be better. It's too finicky about lighting conditions, even with the filter on. It wasn't junk or anything, just old technology, better things available today. DMS1 might be a good compromise for range and CQB. It's a 1.5-4x, donut in a dot reticle. Something to look at anyway.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:23:54 PM EDT
Illuminated reticle 1-4x scopes are very versatile. I have a TR24G but the DMS-1 and Leatherwood's model are much more affordable.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 7:27:22 PM EDT
I'd say get the T1 or H1 for home defense, with a LaRue QD mount, and then something inexpensive like the DMS 1-4 (true 1x) in a QD mount for the range. After all, the range optic doesn't have to survive the end of the world, it just has to survive the trip home. It's only the HD optic that must work on time every time.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 10:28:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 4:21:28 AM EDT by GregCandR]
I am pretty new to optics. But for my first one I went and bought a M4 clone from Primary Arms for $89 on my AUG A3. The mount it comes on has a lower 1/3 co-witness to my BUS. It has 4 different reticles and 7 brightness settings. I easily hit 100 to 200 yard targets and gongs at the range with it. They also have a 1-4x24 illuminated scope that is very similar to the DMS-1, for $119. Just something to consider if price is a major concern.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=325&t=190818

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/Spitfire9/AUG/th_6.jpg
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 4:35:51 AM EDT
I gave the RX30 a serious look when I was considering my primary optic. I ended up not going with the RX30, because I had questions about my ability to see the dot when using my weapon light. A 200 lumen+ weapon light can wash out a dot if it's not bright enough.

As far as magnifiers go you should look at the Vortex VMX3. For the money it's a pretty good little magnifier and will give you 3x magnification for a very reasonable price.


Link Posted: 9/4/2010 11:13:11 AM EDT
IMHO the RX30 is the best KISS optic currently available (no batteries, switches or adjustments to worry about) but as mentioned previously you can still experience reticle washout under certain lighting conditions. The 6.5moa dot is usable out to 200yds, the new RX34 w/4.5moa dot would allow for more precision.

The Aimpoint Micros have the typical Aimpoint ruggedness w/insane battery life at a significant weight savings. However, the small 20mm tube can be slower to acquire the reticle from awkward positions w/sloppy cheekweld than the RX30's huge 42mm objective but the reticle is user-adjustable for varying light conditions.

For HD you're more likely to experience reticle washout w/the RX30 when using a taclight at close range so for your particular needs I'd suggest one of the Aimpoint Micros (or C3 if you're strapped for cash).
JMHO...
Tomac
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 1:02:24 PM EDT
T1 Micro w/ KAC mount. The mount comes with spacers for 3 different heights. The T1's battery life is so long, it should be described in half-life.


Link Posted: 9/4/2010 1:22:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 1:22:59 PM EDT by Treebark]
Hmmm, I do plan on having a light available so the washing out of the RX30 (and I assume the new RX34 as well) does sound like an issue I hadn't thought of. Looking more and more like one of the aimpoint micros. Any reason to get the H1 over the T1? I also hadn't thought about a cheaper 1ish-4ish scope on a QD to put on/take off for range trips, though a cheaper magnifier may do the trick as well.

Excellent advice all, and very much appreciated!!

Link Posted: 9/4/2010 9:06:24 PM EDT
H-1 is significantly less expensive than the T-1 w/no night vision capability. Specs say it's not quite as rugged as the T-1 but unless you jump out of helicopters for a living I doubt you'd ever need the extra ruggedness (IMHO).
Tomac
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 6:20:44 AM EDT
Another thing to keep in mind about the NVD-rated Aimpoints is that every time you turn the dang thing on you have to rotate through the first nine settings in order to get a visible dot. That gets annoying very quickly. Granted that some people probably keep their's on 24/7, but I'd rather not.

Yet another thing to consider is that mounting a NVD behind an Aimpoint sucks. The FOV is awful, not to mention the degraded performance. Much better to head-mount the NVD, and use a laser for aiming. JMHO...

Therefore, your money is probably better spent not getting the more expensive night vision capable model. I wish I hadn't...

As far as the RX-30, I put one on my STG 556 yesterday (to try it out), but took it off. The FOV is awesome, but since I intend for the rifle to be mainly a home-defense piece, the wash-out issue was a deal breaker. So, it went back on the Sig. It sat too dang high off the rail, anyway.

I ended up putting the Leupold Prismatic on it, without any risers, and it looks like it is going to be a keeper.

I have yet to put a single round through this rifle, so take it all with a grain of salt
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 7:15:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/6/2010 7:23:22 AM EDT by joedirt1977]
Originally Posted By GySgt_D:
Another thing to keep in mind about the NVD-rated Aimpoints is that every time you turn the dang thing on you have to rotate through the first nine settings in order to get a visible dot. That gets annoying very quickly. Granted that some people probably keep their's on 24/7, but I'd rather not.

Yet another thing to consider is that mounting a NVD behind an Aimpoint sucks. The FOV is awful, not to mention the degraded performance. Much better to head-mount the NVD, and use a laser for aiming. JMHO...

Therefore, your money is probably better spent not getting the more expensive night vision capable model. I wish I hadn't...

As far as the RX-30, I put one on my STG 556 yesterday (to try it out), but took it off. The FOV is awesome, but since I intend for the rifle to be mainly a home-defense piece, the wash-out issue was a deal breaker. So, it went back on the Sig. It sat too dang high off the rail, anyway.

I ended up putting the Leupold Prismatic on it, without any risers, and it looks like it is going to be a keeper.

I have yet to put a single round through this rifle, so take it all with a grain of salt


What the hell are you waiting for? Go shoot that thing. As far as the NVD issue, GySgt is spot on. If you are going the NVD route, an IR laser is the way to go. Mounting a NVD behind the Aimpoint is tunnel vision extrordinaire. I suppose it's better than nothing, but it's far from ideal. I have first hand experience, and IMO the added cost is just not worth it.
ETA: As a funny side story, my buddy runs a local gun shop, and Saturday an angry customer returned an EOTech. He was upset that the night vision settings didn't allow him to see in the dark.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 9:38:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By joedirt1977:
Originally Posted By GySgt_D:
Another thing to keep in mind about the NVD-rated Aimpoints is that every time you turn the dang thing on you have to rotate through the first nine settings in order to get a visible dot. That gets annoying very quickly. Granted that some people probably keep their's on 24/7, but I'd rather not.

Yet another thing to consider is that mounting a NVD behind an Aimpoint sucks. The FOV is awful, not to mention the degraded performance. Much better to head-mount the NVD, and use a laser for aiming. JMHO...

Therefore, your money is probably better spent not getting the more expensive night vision capable model. I wish I hadn't...

As far as the RX-30, I put one on my STG 556 yesterday (to try it out), but took it off. The FOV is awesome, but since I intend for the rifle to be mainly a home-defense piece, the wash-out issue was a deal breaker. So, it went back on the Sig. It sat too dang high off the rail, anyway.

I ended up putting the Leupold Prismatic on it, without any risers, and it looks like it is going to be a keeper.

I have yet to put a single round through this rifle, so take it all with a grain of salt


What the hell are you waiting for? Go shoot that thing. As far as the NVD issue, GySgt is spot on. If you are going the NVD route, an IR laser is the way to go. Mounting a NVD behind the Aimpoint is tunnel vision extrordinaire. I suppose it's better than nothing, but it's far from ideal. I have first hand experience, and IMO the added cost is just not worth it.
ETA: As a funny side story, my buddy runs a local gun shop, and Saturday an angry customer returned an EOTech. He was upset that the night vision settings didn't allow him to see in the dark.


HAHA..that's classic. Hey, it says right on the button "NV." lol
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 11:33:37 AM EDT
Originally Posted By GySgt_D:
Another thing to keep in mind about the NVD-rated Aimpoints is that every time you turn the dang thing on you have to rotate through the first nine settings in order to get a visible dot. That gets annoying very quickly. Granted that some people probably keep their's on 24/7, but I'd rather not.


The only reason I got the T1 over the H1 is that I got it when eBay/MS Live was having the 40% rebate thing. I got it for about $360 brand new.

I don't find it annoying rotating it through the NVG settings, because I've only done it a couple times. My T1 has been on at least level 7 for the past 3-4 years. I never turn it off, and it's still on the battery that was installed at the factory. Supposed to have something like a 50k hour battery life on level 8!
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