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3/14/2015 8:44:10 PM EDT

I've recently switched to XBR 8208 for my precision reloads in my 18" suppressed AR, .223 Wylde SS barrel from WOA. I'm using Benchrest primers, and Nosler 77gr BTHP with cannelure, COAL 2.255" with light crimp.

I worked up a batch, and was getting awesome groups with pretty good velocity. My best group was with 23.1 gr of XBR 8208, which gave me a 0.797" 5-shot group with avg 2694 fps, std dev of 31.6. This is still .1 grain under published max load (worked up to it from the bottom).

The problem was that I'm getting either ejector marks or case head swipe. There isn't much if any displaced brass. On the shiny case on the bottom, you can't see or feel anything. It was the first one fired, and the suppressor dirties up the rest from there. With one or two you can barely feel something with your finger nail. The rest are just "cleaner" at that spot.

So, do I need to back off? I've read some differing opinions on case head swipe, and ejector marks on AR loads. I know I'm at the upper limit for 5.56/.223 Wylde, and I want to stay safe.


3/14/2015 9:03:49 PM EDT
[#1]
If it were me, I'd call that the limit.
3/14/2015 9:35:35 PM EDT
[#2]
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Quoted:
If it were me, I'd call that the limit.
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I'd agree with that; I'm not going any further.  Mostly trying to figure out if that 23.1 load is safe to shoot.
3/14/2015 9:48:23 PM EDT
[#3]
Weak ejector spring?  Primer strikes look good, no flow.  I see these marks with 25.0gr of h335. Jm2c
3/14/2015 11:37:55 PM EDT
[#4]
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I'd agree with that; I'm not going any further.  Mostly trying to figure out if that 23.1 load is safe to shoot.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
If it were me, I'd call that the limit.


I'd agree with that; I'm not going any further.  Mostly trying to figure out if that 23.1 load is safe to shoot.


I'd back it off a bit, but I rarely push max loads. It looks like you're being careful about brass consistency, etc - I'd pay very close attention to case head separation (use the paperclip trick), and expect that brass to wear out pretty quickly (I'd be surprised at more than 4 or 5 firings). When I see pressure signs, my personal SOP is to back off at least until I'm not seeing them anymore. If you want to ride the limit, you'll have to be pretty particular about paying attention to your variables.
3/15/2015 5:36:45 AM EDT
[#5]
primers look well rounded , sure it's not a timing/gas issue ? where are the cases landing ?
3/15/2015 5:55:00 AM EDT
[#6]
I run 23.5 xbr with the same projectiles. Do not have this issue. then again im running a 14.5 unsupressed
3/15/2015 7:52:53 AM EDT
[#8]
Wow...... I just want to post here to say that this website & forum is the most helpful thing I have ever seen. It has really opened my
eyes up to the genius & technical aspects behind semi-auto service rifles. In my earlier years I was a die-hard bolt action purist.
The internet has really made it easy for help & finding information. Years ago all we had to go to were manuals, books, magazines,
word of mouth from friends & others, & being lucky enough to run into custom gunsmiths who knew all of these things.
3/15/2015 9:33:53 AM EDT
[#9]

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Great link.



This is a good short read for all of us AR-15 handloaders. Thanks for posting.



 
3/15/2015 6:50:02 PM EDT
[#10]
I am having the same swipe issue with XBR.  75gr hpbt, lc brass, wolf primer (the non magnum softer cups) and 23.1gr XBR.  1/7 twist 16" ml 556 chamber barrel. Brass land at 4 oclock

I don't get the swipe with 556 pressure loads with various other powders. But max 223 xbr loads do.   My primers look good, nice rounded edges. I have had loads with other powders flaten my primers but not cause head swips.

My 1/8 twist 16" ml ss does not have this issue and its supposed to have a tighter chamber.
3/15/2015 8:49:33 PM EDT
[#11]
IMO XBR is a little to fast for the heavy 77gr bullets, causing a slight timing issue resulting in head-swipe. YMMV
3/15/2015 9:14:43 PM EDT
[#12]
I get a little extra pulse from the XBR and it flattens primers a little sooner than some equivalent loads.  Not a problem but just an observation.
3/15/2015 10:20:09 PM EDT
[#13]
Great article. So what should be changed 1st, buffer or spring? So if i am getting pretty bad swipes, go heavier, correct? My brass seems to be ejecting at 2 o clock.
3/16/2015 10:16:57 AM EDT
[#14]
IMO your over gased with that powder and shooting suppressed. Have you shot this load with out the suppressor ?
3/16/2015 12:12:46 PM EDT
[#15]
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IMO your over gased with that powder and shooting suppressed. Have you shot this load with out the suppressor ?
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No this gun stays suppressed 100% of the time.
3/16/2015 7:04:00 PM EDT
[#16]
You might want to look into an adjustable gas block then. As a heavier buffer will not change the dwell time between the projectile passing the gas port and the bolt coming out of battery enough to matter. IMO
3/16/2015 10:18:54 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote History
Quoted:
Great article. So what should be changed 1st, buffer or spring? So if i am getting pretty bad swipes, go heavier, correct? My brass seems to be ejecting at 2 o clock.
View Quote

Neither. By the time the buffer starts moving, the bolt has already rotated and the brass is swiped.  Correct an overgassed gun with an adjustable gas block.
3/17/2015 8:53:31 AM EDT
[#18]
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Neither. By the time the buffer starts moving, the bolt has already rotated and the brass is swiped.  Correct an overgassed gun with an adjustable gas block.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Great article. So what should be changed 1st, buffer or spring? So if i am getting pretty bad swipes, go heavier, correct? My brass seems to be ejecting at 2 o clock.

Neither. By the time the buffer starts moving, the bolt has already rotated and the brass is swiped.  Correct an overgassed gun with an adjustable gas block.

For the bolt of come out of battery the carrier has to move back about 1/2". Having said that I don't think even an H3 buffer will slow it down enough.
3/17/2015 10:42:48 PM EDT
[#19]
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For the bolt of come out of battery the carrier has to move back about 1/2". Having said that I don't think even an H3 buffer will slow it down enough.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Great article. So what should be changed 1st, buffer or spring? So if i am getting pretty bad swipes, go heavier, correct? My brass seems to be ejecting at 2 o clock.

Neither. By the time the buffer starts moving, the bolt has already rotated and the brass is swiped.  Correct an overgassed gun with an adjustable gas block.

For the bolt of come out of battery the carrier has to move back about 1/2". Having said that I don't think even an H3 buffer will slow it down enough.

Thanks. This is happening on my 308 AR with a 10.5 inch barrel. Shooting 150 gr hornady fmj using 40.0 gr of imr 4064. Was thinking of backing down on the powder a bit to see if this would help.
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