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Posted: 2/25/2013 6:05:57 AM EDT
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let me start by saying i am new to reloading. i have been doing this for about 6 months using a lee pro 1000 and now a rock chucker. i purchased a mixed bag of cleaned and primed 45 cases(fired once from what the ad said) and was loading them with 185 gr jhp. i am crimping and seating in one step with only 3 positions it is hard to do otherwise.i have had most cases take a taper crimp without a problem but i have had a few that i could simply push the bullet into the case mouth without any effort at all while the round before and after are perfectly fine. these are primed cases which i have for the moment set aside until i figure out why i cant get a crimp to hold the bullet.
i measured the outside of the case and it is` 470 before being flared, 476 after flaring and 470 again on crimping. the same holds true for both the cases that hold the bullet and the ones that dont i am ordering a lee fcd in 45 to see if that would help but im curious about any insight some might have on this. |
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You are flaring the case mouth too much, but that's not the only problem. Most of your bullet's tension comes from the resized brass, not any crimp you may apply after seating. I would make sure your resizing die is going all the way down to the shell plate/holder before buying a new crimp die.
The case mouth flare only needs to be large enough to just accept the bullet. Lead bullets need a little more than jacketed. Try a .469" final crimp after all else fails. I've used as little as .471" without problems. Your brass may be on the thin side. |
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Sized .45 acp brass should measure 0.468 @ case mouth. Flare should be set at a minimum of 0.472 for jacketed. 0.473 for lead and 0.474 doesn't effect neck tension when set shallow. Obviously your one problem is sizer die not set right. 0.476 is too much bell and I question how your crimp is set.
In plain English, you don't know how to tune reloading dies. Would you like some instruction ? dc. |
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Quoted:
Are all the cases the same brand? If they are it's a case problem. Case thickness varies with makers. Maybe, this can be corrected within sizer die. I run mixed .45 acp brass for some loads too. Dies are adjusted to accomadate all head stamps. Even Amerc. 
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i would definitely like some guidance on die tuning. no they are not the same brands it is a mixed lot of 500+ pcs of primed brass which i dont think i would buy again because i have found in 9mm i was able to set up everything and have no problems using the lee dies and their instructions. in this case i have 32 cases out 275 that i can simply push the bullet in the case after it was supposed to be crimped.
question about measuring .468 at the case mouth is this the inside diameter or the outside? i am measuring 470 on the outside of the case mouth. |
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as i have said i am new to this and will not do this again i have been told that the lee fcd will resize the case to factory spec after it was loaded so i am wondering if i simply place each round through the fcd will that solve this problem? as far as .468 yes i read the lee modern reloading and it gives the dimensions but that is not what was coming out and when testing the setup if i bear down any more on the dies i start to crush the case walls which i dont want to do either. i can back out on the flare a little bit but i notice that with this group of brass it doesnt seem to make much of a difference on the case that wont hold the round in place.
now strangely enough with the cases i have tumbled resized and primed on my own even if they are mixed headstamp it makes a huge difference. i am thinking there is a problem with these cases but i paid for them and am a bit nervous about removing live primers to resize them on my own so i have run the loaded rounds through a go/no go and they all chamber without a problem so i will probably use them and resize the brass later. now if the fcd resizes them for me i will be pleased, i have one ordered. i would like to know more about tuning the dies currently i follow lee's instructions on setting up the dies and i have no problems with the pro 1000 in spite of the horror stories i hear, the primer system is the weak point but once i learned to run it clean and dry it works like a charm, 3 positions is my weak point if i want to do something else like separate the seating and crimping i have to use a single stage or put the extra step in a different turret and run it like a single stage. obviously the more i learn the more i find i need to know so i am curious about what tuning the dies is. currently i am loading. 38 .357 9mm .45 for guns i own and shoot i will be loading 223 and 30-30 as i go forward and i am looking at buying a newer lnl ap as i go forward because i feel it offers what i would want in a reloader pretty much everything ive learned about reloading i have read, learned through trial and error, or asked a question on a forum and gotten help. in the datys before the internet i'd have given up by now, anyway im off to load some 38 |
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To resize the primed cases you do not have to remove the primers.
You are using a carbide resizing die right? If so no need for lube so no chance to contaminate the primers. Remove the decapping rod from your resizing die and then run the brass through. This will resize but not impact (pun intended) the primer. The decapping rod and pin is not required to resize 45 ACP cases. |
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I don't mess around if there's a tuning issue. Every die will be pulled, taken apart, examined, cleaned and put back together.
I have a Pro1000, set up differently than most. Index set as follows. 1.) Powder die 2.) Seater die 3.) FCD I size single stage and hand prime. Set up as you are. 1.) Sizer die 2.) Powder die 3.) Seat/crimp die Pull dies, pull apart and clean. The exercise here is familiarise yourself with dies. People sometimes don't want to touch a die once it's perceived to be set. We've had guys moan about a fail to gauge issue for days, before pulling a die. Don't be intimidated by reloading dies. You bought'em, so own'em. Powder die is the first die to set. Take a handful of sized brass, measure. Take longest piece to index, raise ram, thread die to case mouth, back case mouth off die and turn powder thru expander in small increments until case mouth is flared by at least 0.004. Next flare shortest case. This case should flare to an inside diameter at least 0.001 larger than bullet diameter. Increase or reduce flare as needed and lock die. The idea of flaring longest brass length first is insuring press ram extends fully without stalling on expander. This is where oal variances occur. So set expander to shortest brass and make sure ram isn't short stroking on longest brass. Leave long brass in index, under powder thru expander die. Take shortest length brass you used for bell, situate under seater die and back seater stem completely out. Raise ram, thread die down until touching case mouth, back off, turn die 1/4 turn and adjust in small increments until case mouth measures at least 0.001 under target crimp diameter. Flare short brass again, place long brass under ptx again then set oal to target height. There might be a little shaving if loading lead on this first bullet, don't worry with it. Shavings are caused from case mouth closing (crimp) as bullet is seating. Since you're adjusting oal with case mouth closed, shavings can occur. The idea of this exercise is setting die to crimp with case height variance. Crimp tension will be tighter on longer length, than shortest length. Case wall thickness will vary between head stamps too, meaning some bullets will be slightly post sized inside case. This is not a concern so much as outside crimp diameter allows cartridge to gage or chamber. This principle is the same REGARDLESS OF METHOD whether seating crimping in one operation or seating and crimping in two separate stages using two dies. The goal is to crimp shortest length to gage or chamber while making as light a crimp print as possible on longest piece. I could expand a little more, except for the fact someone will interject a point that could be put use within the context of seat/crimp operation. Last is sizer die. Saving this for last insures ram doesn't hang on sizer die. With PTX and seat/crimp station loaded, extend ram and run sizer die firm to index. Back ram down, secure die. Next we have to set neck tension. This is done with knurled knob, top of sizer die. I like to set sized case mouth at least 0.003 under target loaded case mouth diameter. Run index a few cycles, fine tune as needed. Own your dies and load safe, dc. |
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