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Posted: 1/8/2010 8:53:35 PM EDT
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I've had some problems with the majority of my reloads. They all shoot and group perfectly, but the problem lies within cambering.
I must specify that this problem only exists with my reloads and does not happen at all with factory ammo. The rifles I am using are AR15s I built. The head space on the rifles are in spec with a go gauge. The problem I am having is when a round chambers, its really tight and hard to eject the unfired round. Some times I have to slam the stock down while pulling the charging handle. Usually after cambering and extracting the unspent round, it chambers and extracts without a problem. The barrels I am using are chambered in Wylde and 5.56 NATO chambers. I reload to these specs: Case: 5.56 LC 08 or 07 Case length: 1.749-1.750 Bullet: 77gr SMK/70gr TSX OAL: 2.255-2.260 I lightly chamfer the outside and inside of the case mouth so I wont scape off the thin copper jacket. Also, does TAC make the rounds in the mags look really tarnished (turquoise greenish) if I shoot suppressed? Cause thats whats happening. Any answers? thanks |
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About 98% of problems like this are sizing problems. A Wilson case gauge will run you about $25 and save a lot of headaches.
If you don't have one, take a 9mm or .40s&w case, and insert one of your sized 223 cases into it so the shoulder of the .223 is on the case mouth of the pistol case, then measure the length between the bases of the two cases. Repeat with a new 223 case and compare the numbers. |
| I assume you are using a full length resize die and it is screwed down to firmly contact the shell holder. Do you have a case gauge to check a resized case for proper headspace? Some bullets loaded too long can grab the lands and be hard to withdraw but 77gr SMK at 2.26 should not be a problem. I am not familiar with the other bullet you are using. I hope you are not trying to crimp the bullets. Overcrimping can deform the shoulder. |
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Quoted:
+1 about the case gage and another easy fix is a lee factory crimp die, no more bulged shoulders. +1 here. I'm 99% sure that your not setting the case shoulder back far enough. If your sizing die isn't setting the shoulder back far enough, it may chamber, but be hard to remove the unfired rounds. A Wilson/Lyman/Dillon/Hornady case gage will help diagnose and fix this. Turning your sizing die down another 1/16th to 1/8th turn will probably fix the problem, if you don't have a case gage handy. Another possibility is that if you are over-crimping your bullets, the case shoulder will buckle and bulge. Properly setting the seating / crimp die will fix this, as will using the Lee factory crimp die. Since you're shooting SMKs you're probably not crimping though, Can't help you with the TAC / suppressor question. |
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Just screw your sizing die down 1/4 turns at a time until the case chambers and extracted without effort, you might have to screw it down to where it cams over pretty hard to get enough setback if your chamber in indeed short but in spec.
I had this problem with a 6.8, even after bumping the shoulder back .003-4" it would still stick when chambered, I finally had to bump the shoulders back .006" to get them to chamber and extract without any resistance. Buy a Hornady headspace gauge kit that goes on your calipers that way you can get and average of what the shoulder length is on your fired brass and then see how much you had to set the shoulder back for it to chamber correctly, this will aid in setting up your sizing die for two or more different guns greatly since they will both have different headspace. I also have the drop-in gauges and they will not tell you the difference between your chambers and exactly how much the shoulder needs set back(.004" back is what your after from fired), and the two different chambers will be different so you can see just how much difference their is, one might be pushing the shoulder out .006" and the other .008" so you will need to set your sizing die for the longer one(the .008") and after sizing you will have .004" in that gun but only .002" in the other gun but should work for both guns. Oh and you didn't say if the reloads where sticking in both guns or just one? |
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I am using a Lee resizing die. Next time i sit down at the table I will adjust the die. I use an RCBS automatic case trimmer adjusted to to 1.50". I use calipers to find out the case length an OAL. i had the same problem with lee FL dies they would not consistently size cases correctly. even screwed all the way down hard to chamber and extract i ended up getting a set of RCBS FL dies and no problems since i shoot 95% reloads thru my AR , would never buy a LEE rifle die again |
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Generally the problem is caused by cartridge headspace that is about one or one-and-a-half thousandths too long. Before cranking the die down, lube the inside of the case mouths, then size a few. When the expander ball is withdrawn from the case, it stretches the case shoulder, undoing part of the sizing operation. A carbide expander ball may cure the problem, too.
After trying lube, then turn the die down. You should shoot for about 0.002 inches of cartridge headspace for reliable function in AR's. |
| 99% sure you are not setting the shoulder back enough, the other 1% is the seating die adjustment. If you are using the Lee seating die and you did not back the die out of the press on full turn after it came in contact with the shell holder you may be putting a slight buckle in the case. Failure to back the seating die out one full turn will engage the unwanted crimp feature and may be your problem. |
| I had the same problems you have it was from crimping the bullet it would deform the case just a little on cases that were a little longer and jamb up the rifle .I trimed my cases more often and stoped crimping and never had trouble again. You could use a small base die to just to be sure |
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Quoted:
Generally the problem is caused by cartridge headspace that is about one or one-and-a-half thousandths too long. Before cranking the die down, lube the inside of the case mouths, then size a few. When the expander ball is withdrawn from the case, it stretches the case shoulder, undoing part of the sizing operation. A carbide expander ball may cure the problem, too. After trying lube, then turn the die down. You should shoot for about 0.002 inches of cartridge headspace for reliable function in AR's. You have a sizing problem. Could be what AeroE describes, or die not screwed down enough. You are trimming correctly, and I doubt the Lee FCD is the problem. 
Dillon case gauge. This is the good pic. Case below top of gauge, above bottom step. 
This is the bad pic. End of case above top of gauge. |
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Quoted:
I doubt the Lee FCD is the problem.
?? Is he using the Lee Factory Crimp Die? Are you FL sizing, crimping, SB dies, etc. ???? Not much info in the post as to the method used. Have you done one step, then tried the brass, then another, then another to figure out which step is screwing you up? This may be helpful in tracking down the problem. Also, any brass coming out of an AR with a can will be nasty looking. You should see some using D68 or 2200. NASTY. |
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Also from what I have heard, ( haven't gotten to this yet, as I do not have a semi auto rifle yet) if you have more than one semi auto rifle let's say a colt ar in 5.56 and a stag arms 223 the brass you fire from each rifle should stay with that rifle and not to swap the brass between the rifles. From what I have learned so far is that the chambers will be slightly different even between 2 rifles chambered for 223 or 5.56 etc and when you fire, the brass basically fire forms to THAT chamber. So when you resize it will be easier for the brass to fit back into the chamber of the rifle that fired it.
Maybe someone else can explain this better?? |
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I had the same problem. I was able to remove the decapping assy. from the die and resize the loaded rounds. Problem solved.
Some where along the line I picked up this idea that the size die should be screwed down to touch the shell plate THEN BACKED OFF A HALF TURN That was my problem. The bitch for me was , I checked some rounds in my rifle and they worked fine. So I loaded about 400. I guess some of the brass (the ones I checked) didn't need the sizing as much as the ones that stuck. Lesson learned....ready for the next lesson 
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Quoted:
Just screw your sizing die down 1/4 turns at a time until the case chambers and extracted without effort, you might have to screw it down to where it cams over pretty hard to get enough setback if your chamber in indeed short but in spec. I had this problem with a 6.8, even after bumping the shoulder back .003-4" it would still stick when chambered, I finally had to bump the shoulders back .006" to get them to chamber and extract without any resistance. Buy a Hornady headspace gauge kit that goes on your calipers that way you can get and average of what the shoulder length is on your fired brass and then see how much you had to set the shoulder back for it to chamber correctly, this will aid in setting up your sizing die for two or more different guns greatly since they will both have different headspace. I also have the drop-in gauges and they will not tell you the difference between your chambers and exactly how much the shoulder needs set back(.004" back is what your after from fired), and the two different chambers will be different so you can see just how much difference their is, one might be pushing the shoulder out .006" and the other .008" so you will need to set your sizing die for the longer one(the .008") and after sizing you will have .004" in that gun but only .002" in the other gun but should work for both guns.Oh and you didn't say if the reloads where sticking in both guns or just one? |
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You have a sizing problem. Could be what AeroE describes, or die not screwed down enough. You are trimming correctly, and I doubt the Lee FCD is the problem.
Dillon case gauge. This is the good pic. Case below top of gauge, above bottom step.
This is the bad pic. End of case above top of gauge. + 1000  this is the correct answer.
I like the DILLON case guages best because they are stainless and don't immediately RUST like some other brands also, LEE rifle dies work fine when they are adjusted properly. |
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Quoted:
Also from what I have heard, ( haven't gotten to this yet, as I do not have a semi auto rifle yet) if you have more than one semi auto rifle let's say a colt ar in 5.56 and a stag arms 223 the brass you fire from each rifle should stay with that rifle and not to swap the brass between the rifles. From what I have learned so far is that the chambers will be slightly different even between 2 rifles chambered for 223 or 5.56 etc and when you fire, the brass basically fire forms to THAT chamber. So when you resize it will be easier for the brass to fit back into the chamber of the rifle that fired it. Maybe someone else can explain this better?? This only applies to NECK SIZING.....when you full length size a case. the FL die doesnt care what gun it came out of, it will return the case to SAMMI specs....now if the brass was fired from an out of spec chamber (read LMG) then there may be a problem with the die not being able to fully size the case, hence small base sizing dies. Man I could only imagine the extra work I would have to do, sorting cases by number of firings, by headstamp, then by rifle....I'd have like 50 sandwich bags full of different sorted brass. 
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I had this problem before, the first time I reloaded for .223. Exactly the same except the chambered rounds would work, fire and eject, only they wouldn't eject manually. I'm pretty sure it had something to do with resizing. I haven't had the problem ever since. I'm not sure what changed.
Let us know what, if anything, fixes it. |
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