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In the past i have shot lightning link and dias ar platforms and they were definitely fun 20 years ago.Today i have an ss in my sbr and to me it shoots the same way really cant tell the difference in feel or rate of fire. I just do it for a fraction of the cost.As far as reliability i havent had any issues.Dont think ill trust my life on it but wouldnt with a lightning link either. |
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Originally Posted By ark-and-spark: Are forced reset triggers affecting nfa pricing? Absolutely they are, no doubt about it. Edit to add: anyone who disagrees probably has NFA weapons. I have some pre-86 transferables- I spent a bit on them, but don't care if they de-value. I'd rather see automatics proliferate to enthusiasts who ordinarily can't afford them then sit in collections. I do think there are those who spent a lot on them that wouldn't want to see those investments lost and I understand, but fundamentally - I think its good to give up money than rights to all. Frankly the idea of the NFA tax being in origin "prohibitive" in cost is truly un-America and unconstitutional in spirit (my opinion) The idea that only the wealthy can have certain items and the poor cannot is not "equality". What were people thinking in 1934? - "I'm so glad those millionaire gangsters have to pay $200 tax on those Tommy Guns?" The only people that could afford them were gangsters!! Again in 1986 the same Sheeple fell for it again - "I'm so glad those KG99 and MAC-10 machine guns won't be killing Sonny Crocket" I saw how bad they were on Miami Vice |
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Originally Posted By lazyengineer: If I can get a 3-positiin conventional lever, for the price points mentioned, I'm interested. See this link: https://x.com/printingguns/status/1920229075064381608 Now are you interested? lol |
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Originally Posted By BMad316: in Florida have made FRT's illegal, transferable full autos are still legal. While I do have transferrable M16's and Posties (as an FFL / SOT), I would like to see the SS's made legal and hopefully drive some more interest in SMG matches. It is sad to see that most SMG match enthusiasts are dying off. Most of the younger generation lose interest when they hear the cost of a transferrable. These days, we allow semi auto PCC shooters to participate in our monthly SMG matches but they don't get to take advantage of target arrays where having full auto makes it really fun and challenging. Back when I first got into full auto it actually got boring blasting at dirt and even shooting cars or whatever at MG shoot events. Then when I started shooting matches, it changed everything as now I was wanting to get my cyclic rate down on all my MG's to around 600 RPM, I wanted the ability to pull single, double or triple rounds bursts on demand. I also wanted this slow cyclic rate to be smooth with little disturbance of the sight picture. Things that most people don't care about. These days, most PCC's are catering to bufferless designs that look cool but if they were full auto would run around 1000 RPM (like the Sig MPX that I had using a post sample sear). That gets old fast especially shooting in a match. I know we would welcome SS users at my FL match if they were legal and would hope to see that going on in states where they are legal. |
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Originally Posted By ark-and-spark: Are forced reset triggers affecting nfa pricing? Absolutely they are, no doubt about it. Edit to add: anyone who disagrees probably has NFA weapons. It’s not quite so easily distilled. The transferable MG market has many moving parts. There are collectors, shooters, and hybrid collector/shooters. SS/FRT will have absolutely no affect on collectors and varying degrees of affect on collectors /shooters. The degree to which they affect pure shooters depends on a number of factors, including budget, desire to own a real MG vs a simulation of a MG, among others. Then there is the MG itself. MACs will likely take a hit, but even so they are still selling when priced appropriately for market. Non-Colt RR M16s could in theory take a hit, but in actuality they don’t seem to have been affected. The economy is tenuous right now, interest rates are still high, there is uncertainty in the stock market. These all equate to slower sales of big ticket non-essential commodities. |
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Keep in mind there is an upside to a leveling of machine gun prices for those who have had the machine gun(s) for quite some time; and are contemplating selling. Less capital gains tax. As far as I know, unless one can avail themselves to a like kind purchase offset, the capital gains tax from the sale of a machine gun that has acquired significant value can be a strong deterrent to selling unless the funds are needed for other purposes. I get the impression that a number of current machine gun sales at auction are estate sales from heirs selling off recently inherited machine guns. Not legal or tax advice. MHO, YMMV, et. |
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Originally Posted By amphibian: See this link: https://x.com/printingguns/status/1920229075064381608 Now are you interested? lol Originally Posted By amphibian: Originally Posted By lazyengineer: If I can get a 3-positiin conventional lever, for the price points mentioned, I'm interested. See this link: https://x.com/printingguns/status/1920229075064381608 Now are you interested? lol yes |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: I have an M10 and Suppressor that were Atlanta PD Demos. APD had done some testing and photo-ops for the the MAC catalogs. This supposedly was used to encourage sales of MACs to other agencies. They were sure to show a MAC-10 being fired from a police helicopter showing how one could lay down lots of firepower in the wake of the New Orleans Sniper in 1973 that was taken out "eventually" with helicopter police gunfire - https://www.uzitalk.com/forums/index.php?attachments/img_4545-png.40941/ Yeah, the movie "McQ" had art imitating real life. |
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Originally Posted By prebans: More than anything, the overall economy seems to be stagnating MG prices. MG/NFA prices are driven by rarity and scarcity. I.E. they are speculative. Have been for a long time. So they are out of reach for most of the shooting public. Republicans control all branches of government. There is no ban coming, so firearm prices in general are hugely suppressed. I don't know how much of the market was going to buy an M-16 lower, for example, and instead is choosing a FRT, and that has enough of an effect to bring prices down. Time will tell. Suppressors are going to run into the same thing soon. Everyone has one, (or 10), you can't really sell them, so short of removing them from the NFA, I think you're going to see a lot of headwind on some of the prices people are asking for. ETA - for everyone saying NFA prices are dropping, where? I haven't see reductions. For sure the prices aren't climbing, but I think that is guns in general. I'd LOVE to see NFA prices come down. |
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Originally Posted By amphibian: See this link: https://x.com/printingguns/status/1920229075064381608 Now are you interested? lol |
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Originally Posted By Alaska-Shooter: Sure. Will you post a link and I’ll check the thread out? I guess there are three now. This is one I started. This one is similar to the Harrison type. And this is another type that’s on the market. Any knowledge you can impart will be helpful and appreciated!  |
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Originally Posted By Alaska-Shooter: Thanks for the link. I responded. Reading those threads makes me feel lucky for how well mine have worked. I go very very slowly on the installs and don’t start removing metal until I’ve thought through it a few times. They are a little challenging for sure. Having a good understanding of how the FCG functions really helps since there are no specific instructions anywhere. That’s half the fun of it for me. The other half is when they come to life, LOL! |
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Originally Posted By ag04blast: A purpose built (without much effort) rig around an FRT will run like a well oiled machined and put a huge grin on almost everyone's face. Originally Posted By ag04blast: Originally Posted By Ryo: I doubt it. FRT has a different feel than the real thing. A purpose built (without much effort) rig around an FRT will run like a well oiled machined and put a huge grin on almost everyone's face. FIFY - Over the years, I've run across a few ham-fisted, can't walk and chew gum at the same time types. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Maybe.... I don't think the market on MG's are going to crash, but the value proposition of a new shooting dropping nice used car prices on mg is just not what it used to be. hell, 30k-50k is a downpayment on a house for most people. I've shot a ton of Full auto stuff and while its fun, I am not sure I would pay a premium for a full auto, and if I had the itch, there are always bump stocks, super safeties, and stuff like the SSA. Hell, for price of one MG, you could literally set up a SOT, go into business and make your own mg's |
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Originally Posted By Kuraki: I've shot a number of MGs. I could afford just about any commonly available transferable, and planned to acquire one eventually. Since getting a couple FRTs I have quit considering a transferable, doesn't even enter my mind. A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. |
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Originally Posted By lazyengineer: A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. Originally Posted By lazyengineer: Originally Posted By Kuraki: I've shot a number of MGs. I could afford just about any commonly available transferable, and planned to acquire one eventually. Since getting a couple FRTs I have quit considering a transferable, doesn't even enter my mind. A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. Too risky for me, like real estate. I know the second I buy an MG or real estate as an investment, the ban will be lifted or the ground will erupt. 
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Originally Posted By lightguy: I'm seriously considering selling everything. Its just a matter of time before there will be FRTs for everything but a Chauchat. That's my thought too. I sold my last machinegun earlier this month; I'm now without a machinegun for the first time since 2002. I do have three FRTs now though. |
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Originally Posted By lightguy: I'm seriously considering selling everything. Its just a matter of time before there will be FRTs for everything but a Chauchat. I don't recall seeing anything for the 10/22 platform, and bump stocks for 10/22s were (are?) notoriously poor operating. And for that matter, from what I read, the current speed trigger devices for the AR platform often work rather poorly/require changed AR parts for even poor .22LR operation. As it is now, one still sees some users experiencing difficulties even with M16 and full auto Uzi .22LR conversions. Due to the low power available, I suspect that speed trigger .22LR operation might continue to be a challenge for all platforms. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Originally Posted By lazyengineer: A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. My MGs are 2-3x their value in the decade that I’ve owned them. I’m happy with that return. Sure i shoot them. But I would have that same cost even with an FRT. Transferable MGs are just one of many alternative investments, just like art, wine, classic cars, sports cars, Pokémon cards, etc…you are correct about regulations, potential of bans and so on. It’s a high risk but potentially high reward. Also it’s an investment you can enjoy! No one is saying to cash out your 401k to buy a MG. But if you have a fully funded 401k, your home is paid for, your cars are paid for, your kids college fund is looking good and somehow you still have money left over after also paying Uncle Sam, then why not enjoy a fun hobby like owning transferable MGs? I get that it doesn’t make sense to own a $30k MG for someone with a net worth of $100k, that’s 30% of your wealth. But if you have $1mil NW that MG is only 3% of your NW. The avg MG owner 30 years ago was a blue collar guy who shot it off his back porch. Today it’s a white collar person who probably lives in a gated community. Not saying it’s bad or good, just the reality of it. I’m glad the FRT is out there, but I just don’t see it impacting MG prices Let’s use sports cars as a thought experiment. Imagine Kia came out with sport car that was a clone of a Lamborghini Huracan. The Kia looked the same, could do 0-60 in 3.0 sec instead 2.5, had 600hp instead of 630, and cost $75,000 instead of $350,000 Would it sell well? Absolutely! You might even see a couple parked on your street. Would wealthy super car owners sell their huracans and buy the Kia? No fucking way. There is pride associated with owning the best item possible. And there are people willing to pay exorbitant amounts of money to have that couple extra horse power, or even to own the car that has the lambo logo instead of the Kia logo on their super car. It’s the same reason an Olympic arms M16 costs $27k but the colt M16A1 costs $35k, the M16A2 costs $40k, and the M16A2 marked “auto” runs over $50k. There are people out there willing to pay twice as much for a MG that shoots identical but has slightly different markings on the lower. |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
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Well... I looked into trying one, and ordered one to tinker with from Performance Triggers, since it works like a standard selector. That was 3 weeks ago, and now they aren't answering emails, not answering their phone calls, and not returning messages. So... Right - we've seen this act before. Maybe not then! I'll give them a few more days, then I guess give up and call my CC company to reverse the charges. Not the best-run source right now: I had also ordered a few other things, which they then refunded as out of stock, but the trigger was also out of stock, and no refund on that. Just a "we'll let you know if more than 2 weeks!" 3 weeks ago. And now radio silence. The not-answering-phone part isn't encouraging. We'll see. I'll probably just call it quits and wait to see how all the legal lawsuit crap settles before revisiting this - if ever. I guess I missed out on the Cease-and-Desist letter stuff, and they're just hiding. That's what it looks like. |
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Originally Posted By lazyengineer: Well... I looked into trying one, and ordered one to tinker with from Performance Triggers, since it works like a standard selector. That was 3 weeks ago, and now they aren't answering emails, not answering their phone calls, and not returning messages. So... Right - we've seen this act before. Maybe not then! I'll give them a few more days, then I guess give up and call my CC company to reverse the charges. Not the best-run source right now: I had also ordered a few other things, which they then refunded as out of stock, but the trigger was also out of stock, and no refund on that. Just a "we'll let you know if more than 2 weeks!" 3 weeks ago. And now radio silence. The not-answering-phone part isn't encouraging. We'll see. I'll probably just call it quits and wait to see how all the legal lawsuit crap settles before revisiting this - if ever. I guess I missed out on the Cease-and-Desist letter stuff, and they're just hiding. That's what it looks like. If it's for the Atrius, there's postings in the Facebook groups with customers giving their order numbers and announcing when they're shipped. |
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I suspect that some machine gun accessories will take a hit. In particular, for MAC 10, M11-380, and M11/9 submachine guns the desirability of an upper to shoot 5.56x45 could well diminish as such an upper generally costs more than an AR-15 plus a Rate Of Fire trigger mechanism. And with an AR-15, one can easily implement recoil and rate of fire adjustment hardware such as improved buffering. While pistol caliber uppers for the MAC 10, M11-380, and M11/9 submachine guns are less costly than rifle caliber uppers, such uppers generally lack the adjustable recoil and rate of fire capability of the AR platform. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: I have both FRTs and MGs. I believe its merely a matter of time before FRTs are put out to the NFA pasture by some form of regulations. Bu Bank on it. The question, will they be backdoor NFA forbaranced like SBR's/Armbraces were, when that happens? |
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I have both an MG and FRT. Was impressed with the FRT and wanted to put them in my 300BLK but they don't run very well with subs. The FRT causes just enough friction on the bolt that already doesn't have a whole lot of pressure moving it to make a very reliable 300BLK to turn into one not nearly as reliable (no problem with the supers). I know I can get it to run fine with more gas and less spring but then I have a problem with supers. This is where my full auto receiver works well. I have since moved my full auto from a 10.5 inch .223 to an 8.5 inch 300BLK and put the FRT in an SBR lower with the 10.5 inch .223 upper. So, there are some use cases were FA lowers are going to work much better than FRT. Now bring on the drop in triggers for the AKs! |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: I have both FRTs and MGs. I believe its merely a matter of time before FRTs are put out to the NFA pasture by some form of regulations. Bu I feel the same way - the misinformation political ads for the primaries are already scaring the sheeple with the coming "full auto carnage in the streets" because of FRTs making all guns into machine guns. |
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Originally Posted By triode: I feel the same way - the misinformation political ads for the primaries are already scaring the sheeple with the coming "full auto carnage in the streets" because of FRTs making all guns into machine guns. I'm surprised Rim Waltz' Murder-bot contractor didn't use a short rifle or suppressor to add to the peculiar timing. I |
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Originally Posted By Recoil737: I have both an MG and FRT. Was impressed with the FRT and wanted to put them in my 300BLK but they don't run very well with subs. The FRT causes just enough friction on the bolt that already doesn't have a whole lot of pressure moving it to make a very reliable 300BLK to turn into one not nearly as reliable (no problem with the supers). I know I can get it to run fine with more gas and less spring but then I have a problem with supers. This is where my full auto receiver works well. I have since moved my full auto from a 10.5 inch .223 to an 8.5 inch 300BLK and put the FRT in an SBR lower with the 10.5 inch .223 upper. So, there are some use cases where FA lowers are going to work much better than FRT. Now bring on the drop in triggers for the AKs! From what I've read, .22LR operation appears to be somewhat sketchy with an FRT or SSS system. I'm not planning on getting an FRT or SSS to complement or replace the machine gun .22LR conversions/uppers that I already have. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Originally Posted By SecondAmend: From what I've read, .22LR operation appears to be somewhat sketchy with an FRT or SSS system. I'm not planning on getting an FRT or SSS to complement or replace the machine gun .22LR conversions/uppers that I already have. MHO, YMMV, etc. The .22’s take as much work to make functional as they do with MG’s. I’ve dialed in my Uzi and M16 conversions, as they weren’t drop in to put it nicely. My mileage varies, in that, a dedicated .22 Super Safe AR pistol is my next project. |
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Originally Posted By Dakota_Don: The .22’s take as much work to make functional as they do with MG’s. I’ve dialed in my Uzi and M16 conversions, as they weren’t drop in to put it nicely. My mileage varies, in that, a dedicated .22 Super Safe AR pistol is my next project. Originally Posted By Dakota_Don: Originally Posted By SecondAmend: From what I've read, .22LR operation appears to be somewhat sketchy with an FRT or SSS system. I'm not planning on getting an FRT or SSS to complement or replace the machine gun .22LR conversions/uppers that I already have. MHO, YMMV, etc. The .22’s take as much work to make functional as they do with MG’s. I’ve dialed in my Uzi and M16 conversions, as they weren’t drop in to put it nicely. My mileage varies, in that, a dedicated .22 Super Safe AR pistol is my next project. My experience with .22LR full auto has been positive, out-of-the-box except for the Uzi conversion where I had to finish ream the chamber. The .22s are: the aforementioned 2007 Vector conversion (one of the last ones they sold, and I think that their tooling was worn); for M16 - 2010 CMMG conversion; a 2024 Colt branded Atchisson pattern .22 conversion; 2018 CMMG 4.5 in. bbl. and 9 in. bbl. uppers; and a M11-380 Fleming .22 upper (needs to have 10/22 mags that have the correct bolt clearance). Good magazines; and in spec parts (which, from what I read, for ARs seems to be an occasional problem) appear to be key. Good luck with your dedicated .22 Super Safe AR pistol project! Sounds like a fun buzz gun. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
| I have considered the same questions. I think the lightning link may take the hardest hit, Kinda hard to tell with the RDIAS- they tend to be kinda stupid rare it seems but the FRT is really filling that role at fraction of cost. If the short act passes, it’ll hurt them both a little more because it removes another advantage of a MG. Registered converted receivers will probably hold fairly well-ish in the long run but they too are in my grey undecided area. M16 roll marked I think are gonna stay pretty safe as a niche collector item. In the long run I think legislation will make the FRT another NFA item or ban them. It won’t likely be under this administration but I tend to think it’s coming. All opinion of course |
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I like both MGs and FRTs, but one judge can ruin the whole thing - In my lifetime I've gone from Assault weapons and magazines ban and back and forth like after Sandy Hook, etc. The Pendulum will swing back some how when they are cheap - get what you want. Are there any Beretta PM12s that emerged into transferables when the LEO guns pre-86 could be considered transferable? Can't FRT a semi version of that (they don't exist) but I want one. Some full autos will not be replaced. |
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Originally Posted By ark-and-spark: Are forced reset triggers affecting nfa pricing? Absolutely they are, no doubt about it. Edit to add: anyone who disagrees probably has NFA weapons. I have not seen any evidence that NFA pricing is affected by forced reset triggers. Truth is determined by measurement. The NFA dealer prices are all sky high. The stock market is doing poorly, and MG prices never go up during a recession, or even a semi-recession. People get nervous, they stop buying toys. But even so, I have not seen any rollback in prices of NFA guns. |
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Originally Posted By ShaggyNuckles: Maybe.... I don't think the market on MG's are going to crash, but the value proposition of a new shooting dropping nice used car prices on mg is just not what it used to be. hell, 30k-50k is a downpayment on a house for most people. I've shot a ton of Full auto stuff and while its fun, I am not sure I would pay a premium for a full auto, and if I had the itch, there are always bump stocks, super safeties, and stuff like the SSA. Hell, for price of one MG, you could literally set up a SOT, go into business and make your own mg's The USA is full of people who are in their 50s and 60s, they have no kids college to pay for, their house is paid off. The man is a dentist, the wife is a lawyer, they're pulling down $450k per year. People like that have $25,000 per month take home to spend. My guess is that the prices of MGs will slowly continue to rise until all the wealthy Boomers are priced out of the market. Which is going to be a while. |
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Originally Posted By lazyengineer: A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. I don't see any reason to sweat over an NFA purchase. You would have to have a GIANT kaboom to completely ruin a machinegun. Like a stick of dynamite sized kaboom. Weapons are built sturdy and there are lots of gunsmiths who can fix cracks and bulges. If you had a pristine Colt Thompson and squibbed a ring into the original barrel, you might knock $15k off the collector price. But people don't use those kind of collector pieces as shooters. I don't see anything out there that suggests that MGs will be banned any time soon. They are very heavily regulated, extremely expensive and NEVER used in crime. And the USA is loaded with gun owners from one end to the other. Put it into perspective: The average new car price is $48,000, which nobody bats an eyelash at. And that purchase is guaranteed to lose money. New cars typically depreciate by 20-30% within the first year of ownership. My neighbor just bought a $70,000 Bronco. About the same time, I just bought a RR Colt for $27k and new Chevy SUV for $40k. In 5 years, who do you think will be ahead? In the next 5 years, he'll lose about $42,000 on his truck. I will lose $24,000 on mine. If jackbooted UN soldiers come to my house and take away my RR Colt, I will lose $27k. If they don't, I would make at least $5k if I sold it. We are not at the price level yet where solidly middle-class people need to sweat over the purchase of an UZI. Most collectables aren't really "investments". Because an S&P500 fund would perform way better. On the other hand, having a hobby that turns a profit is kind of nice. My dad went to the doctor with a sore throat, was diagnosed with cancer, died like 3 months later. There are no guarantees in this world. I try not to waste my money, but I have no qualms about buying NFA stuff. |
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Originally Posted By amphibian: +1. I'm in FL too. I do hope that they are made legal in FL. While I do have transferrable M16's and Posties (as an FFL / SOT), I would like to see the SS's made legal and hopefully drive some more interest in SMG matches. It is sad to see that most SMG match enthusiasts are dying off. Most of the younger generation lose interest when they hear the cost of a transferrable. These days, we allow semi auto PCC shooters to participate in our monthly SMG matches but they don't get to take advantage of target arrays where having full auto makes it really fun and challenging. Back when I first got into full auto it actually got boring blasting at dirt and even shooting cars or whatever at MG shoot events. Then when I started shooting matches, it changed everything as now I was wanting to get my cyclic rate down on all my MG's to around 600 RPM, I wanted the ability to pull single, double or triple rounds bursts on demand. I also wanted this slow cyclic rate to be smooth with little disturbance of the sight picture. Things that most people don't care about. These days, most PCC's are catering to bufferless designs that look cool but if they were full auto would run around 1000 RPM (like the Sig MPX that I had using a post sample sear). That gets old fast especially shooting in a match. I know we would welcome SS users at my FL match if they were legal and would hope to see that going on in states where they are legal. im mainly interested in 22lr. ammo for rest just "too damn high!!!" |
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Originally Posted By SecondAmend: My experience with .22LR full auto has been positive, out-of-the-box except for the Uzi conversion where I had to finish ream the chamber. The .22s are: the aforementioned 2007 Vector conversion (one of the last ones they sold, and I think that their tooling was worn); for M16 - 2010 CMMG conversion; a 2024 Colt branded Atchisson pattern .22 conversion; 2018 CMMG 4.5 in. bbl. and 9 in. bbl. uppers; and a M11-380 Fleming .22 upper (needs to have 10/22 mags that have the correct bolt clearance). Good magazines; and in spec parts (which, from what I read, for ARs seems to be an occasional problem) appear to be key. Good luck with your dedicated .22 Super Safe AR pistol project! Sounds like a fun buzz gun. MHO, YMMV, etc. in my mind, the lil 22 conversions for vz61 are "ideal" kinda purpose built with decent czech parts....but probaly some stuff i havenet considered yet... |
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Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: I don't see any reason to sweat over an NFA purchase. You would have to have a GIANT kaboom to completely ruin a machinegun. Like a stick of dynamite sized kaboom. Weapons are built sturdy and there are lots of gunsmiths who can fix cracks and bulges. If you had a pristine Colt Thompson and squibbed a ring into the original barrel, you might knock $15k off the collector price. But people don't use those kind of collector pieces as shooters. I don't see anything out there that suggests that MGs will be banned any time soon. They are very heavily regulated, extremely expensive and NEVER used in crime. And the USA is loaded with gun owners from one end to the other. Put it into perspective: The average new car price is $48,000, which nobody bats an eyelash at. And that purchase is guaranteed to lose money. New cars typically depreciate by 20-30% within the first year of ownership. My neighbor just bought a $70,000 Bronco. About the same time, I just bought a RR Colt for $27k and new Chevy SUV for $40k. In 5 years, who do you think will be ahead? In the next 5 years, he'll lose about $42,000 on his truck. I will lose $24,000 on mine. If jackbooted UN soldiers come to my house and take away my RR Colt, I will lose $27k. If they don't, I would make at least $5k if I sold it. We are not at the price level yet where solidly middle-class people need to sweat over the purchase of an UZI. Most collectables aren't really "investments". Because an S&P500 fund would perform way better. On the other hand, having a hobby that turns a profit is kind of nice. My dad went to the doctor with a sore throat, was diagnosed with cancer, died like 3 months later. There are no guarantees in this world. I try not to waste my money, but I have no qualms about buying NFA stuff. Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: Originally Posted By lazyengineer: A lot of people mention the investment value of a transferable. While I'm sure there is something to be said about that economically, and you bet that's what I'd be telling family members. But really, that sounds very high-risk to me. Way way too regulated, value is way to susceptible to unknown future regulation - in either direction, way too limited a subset of potential buyers, and also it's at significant risk of damage from usage. Due to the high round count wear and just a kaboom is going to be higher risk - nobody is shooting premium Lapua ammo through an MG. At current prices, an NFA MG is nowhere on the table for me at all. I don't see any reason to sweat over an NFA purchase. You would have to have a GIANT kaboom to completely ruin a machinegun. Like a stick of dynamite sized kaboom. Weapons are built sturdy and there are lots of gunsmiths who can fix cracks and bulges. If you had a pristine Colt Thompson and squibbed a ring into the original barrel, you might knock $15k off the collector price. But people don't use those kind of collector pieces as shooters. I don't see anything out there that suggests that MGs will be banned any time soon. They are very heavily regulated, extremely expensive and NEVER used in crime. And the USA is loaded with gun owners from one end to the other. Put it into perspective: The average new car price is $48,000, which nobody bats an eyelash at. And that purchase is guaranteed to lose money. New cars typically depreciate by 20-30% within the first year of ownership. My neighbor just bought a $70,000 Bronco. About the same time, I just bought a RR Colt for $27k and new Chevy SUV for $40k. In 5 years, who do you think will be ahead? In the next 5 years, he'll lose about $42,000 on his truck. I will lose $24,000 on mine. If jackbooted UN soldiers come to my house and take away my RR Colt, I will lose $27k. If they don't, I would make at least $5k if I sold it. We are not at the price level yet where solidly middle-class people need to sweat over the purchase of an UZI. Most collectables aren't really "investments". Because an S&P500 fund would perform way better. On the other hand, having a hobby that turns a profit is kind of nice. My dad went to the doctor with a sore throat, was diagnosed with cancer, died like 3 months later. There are no guarantees in this world. I try not to waste my money, but I have no qualms about buying NFA stuff. good reply of course. Honestly, the NFA investment regulatory risk is in the other direction. Imagine how much a $30,000 1980's NFA select fire AR15 would be worth if new ones could be had with simple $200 NFA tax stamp on a new production $500 PSA M4? Which effectively, is what forced resets do, according to some at least. Then we get posts about people struggling to make them work, so I kind of wonder about that. but we shall see! If FRT become commonplace, I rather doubt they will be so for long before a legislative change happens. Only reason FRT is legal is not because of 2md amendment, but because Congress used the word "actuation" in their bill. |
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Originally Posted By jaqufrost: I'm going to be purchasing that as soon as it's available. Originally Posted By jaqufrost: Originally Posted By amphibian: See this link: https://x.com/printingguns/status/1920229075064381608 Now are you interested? lol Who is the manufacturer of it? I've been wanting a FRT but want an actual 3 position lever. |
Joined:
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Posts:
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EE: 100% (16)
SD, USA
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Originally Posted By NIevo: Who is the manufacturer of it? I've been wanting a FRT but want an actual 3 position lever. If you want some outside reading, go here and check it out. It’s a new forum and there’s some good info. |
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Originally Posted By criio1: If it's for the Atrius, there's postings in the Facebook groups with customers giving their order numbers and announcing when they're shipped. Originally Posted By criio1: Originally Posted By lazyengineer: Well... I looked into trying one, and ordered one to tinker with from Performance Triggers, since it works like a standard selector. That was 3 weeks ago, and now they aren't answering emails, not answering their phone calls, and not returning messages. So... Right - we've seen this act before. Maybe not then! I'll give them a few more days, then I guess give up and call my CC company to reverse the charges. Not the best-run source right now: I had also ordered a few other things, which they then refunded as out of stock, but the trigger was also out of stock, and no refund on that. Just a "we'll let you know if more than 2 weeks!" 3 weeks ago. And now radio silence. The not-answering-phone part isn't encouraging. We'll see. I'll probably just call it quits and wait to see how all the legal lawsuit crap settles before revisiting this - if ever. I guess I missed out on the Cease-and-Desist letter stuff, and they're just hiding. That's what it looks like. If it's for the Atrius, there's postings in the Facebook groups with customers giving their order numbers and announcing when they're shipped. I forget which model, but once again - beware, as sure as shit, I used a card I rarely use, and it got hacked. Gun industry is THE WORST at CC security. I don't really suspect the company of shenanigans. I do suspect them of sloppy digital security, it's just an industry standard. |
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Originally Posted By NIevo: Who is the manufacturer of it? I've been wanting a FRT but want an actual 3 position lever. Attached File |
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Originally Posted By triode: I feel the same way - the misinformation political ads for the primaries are already scaring the sheeple with the coming "full auto carnage in the streets" because of FRTs making all guns into machine guns. Originally Posted By triode: Originally Posted By cherenkov: I have both FRTs and MGs. I believe its merely a matter of time before FRTs are put out to the NFA pasture by some form of regulations. Bu I feel the same way - the misinformation political ads for the primaries are already scaring the sheeple with the coming "full auto carnage in the streets" because of FRTs making all guns into machine guns. It's not a new thing, there's 5 or so years of videos/accounts of LE encountering stolen glocks with illegal switches including officers/deputies being wounded or killed, anyone remember the Marshals who were killed in CLT a year or so ago? The temu switches are all illegally imported/sold, what are they gonna do? Make them more illegaler? Not trying to be a smartass in a tech forum but it's funny how the law is only applied to certain parts of the population based on location and socioeconomic status. Will FRTs eventually become regulated? I'd bet yes after the first "mass" where it's confirmed one is used by anyone other than hood rats. 
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