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Posted: 1/28/2002 3:19:40 PM EDT
Ok, after reading many posts here of people who would be afraid to bank their life on an AR15 it made me wonder, who here has an AR15 that doesn't jam?

Don't get me wrong, there is no doubt that an AK will function with more junk in the receiver than an AR15. No doubt.

But does that make the AR15 "unreliable"?

I've owned three AR's and besides using bad ammo (Wolf) or bad mags, I have yet to see mine jam. And believe me I've got them pretty dirty, on one occasion putting 600 rounds of dirty surplus ammo through my M4 in an afternoon.

I think the big key here is buying rifles or uppers that are milspec (i.e., chrome lined chambers and such). I really think it makes a big difference.

So what's the verdict.

Does your AR15 jam:

A. Everyonce in awhile.

B. All the time.

C. Never.

Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:25:43 PM EDT
I've had my Bushy A2 for 4 months now and it only jammed once the first time I used it. The internals were too dry. After 600 rounds it hasn't done it again. I haven't tried many different rounds though, only PMC 55gr and Federal 55gr bhtp.
Bill3508
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:27:23 PM EDT
My duty AR (Bushy shorty) has never jammed..yet.
That said, we train extensively with dummy rounds to be proficient in clearing phase1 and phase2 malfunctions. I have enuff confidence in both my rifle and my skills to handle any jams that might arise even at the worst time.
Don't forget cover & concealment!
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:30:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2002 3:31:24 PM EDT by geezhound]
I have 2 homemade AR frankenguns that only jammed when I was using USA mags.

In the year or so since I aquired some USGI mags, they never jam.


Maybe 2000 rounds each.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:37:52 PM EDT
I have two bushmaster M4's and have yet to have a jam yet with either one due to the rifle itself. That being said I feel that most so callled "jams" are realted to either poors mags or substandard ammo. my .02
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:39:33 PM EDT
Bushy M4 - >1000 rounds, no jams
Bushy M4 #2 - >3000 rounds, no jams
Oly A2 SUM - >300 rounds, no jams
Colt SP1 - <100 rounds, no jams

RRA Varmint rifle - >600 rounds, and this one "jams" quite often. Only on the first round in the magazine, it will send the first round into the recever, and instead of being directed into the barrel, it smashes the bullet back into the casing a little, and stops the carrier.

I never have figured it out... or tried much for that matter. It only does it on Black Hills blue box ammo (about all I shoot out of it) and does it maybe one out of every 4 mags. I only use 2 different 20 rounders in this rifle, and it may be mag related. To be honest, this is nowhere near a "SHTF" or milspec rifle, so I haven't cared. After the first round on a full mag, it is 100%

Had a 16" Olympic carbine that would fail to extract on a hot barrel every once in a while, but only when shooting mil-surp ammo.

I think the key here is "how many MILSPEC rifle actually have reliabilty issues?"

Granted, there will be some... but I would venture the vast majority of people who have had issues were on rifles that were not mil spec.... or lubed according to the TM.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:41:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2002 3:42:20 PM EDT by Dano523]
Use clp only!!!! It will prevent the gas chamber fouling up due to the cleaner in CLP. The chamber will still foul, but the CLP will turn it to a slim instead of a solid mass.

Don't use cheap mags, the lips do not hold there shape.

With that said, Your AR is less likely to jam.

Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:46:37 PM EDT
I've had a total of three stoppages all of which were due to ammo. The extractor ripped the head off of a case and then jammed the next round into the rest of the case still in the chamber once. The other two were wolf ammo welding themselves into the chamber.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:49:19 PM EDT
I ran roughly 1000 rounds through my preban Bushy on Friday in -8F weather. The only jams I had were Beta mag related (still having FTF problems with it, will try a new feed tower next time out). USGI mags run like a top no matter what ammo I run through them.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:49:40 PM EDT
3600 rds no jams and I run a wet gun and use grease on the carrier.
GG
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 3:55:37 PM EDT
Oly PCR 20" kit on a RRA lower. About 500 rounds, only jam was a handload that was neck sized only. DUH. Error on my part. Works great with FL resized stuff and remanufactured stuff.

M@
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:25:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/28/2002 4:26:22 PM EDT by gus]
The only AR I've ever had that jammed (other than crappy mags) was a DPMS frankengun I bought years ago for $400 (pre-ban! Then again, this was before the ban). Anyway, the problem was the previous owner had installed the wrong spring under the ejector. Stovepiped every round!! Had it figured out and fixxed within an hour. Sold the rifle in 1997 for $1000!
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:31:07 PM EDT
I had a pre-ban Eagle 20" A2 that I put over 2,500 rds. through without a single jam. Used Remington UMC, Thermold, GI and Orlite mags.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:36:45 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Shadowblade:
I ran roughly 1000 rounds through my preban Bushy on Friday in -8F weather. The only jams I had were Beta mag related (still having FTF problems with it, will try a new feed tower next time out). USGI mags run like a top no matter what ammo I run through them.



I have had same problem with my RRA lower and a preban SGW lower, but my bushmaster shot it just fine. I have since recleaned the BetaMag and have yet to retest it.

Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:42:26 PM EDT
Neither of the current AR's I have, are having any reliability issues. One is a target/varmint rig on a PWA lower, only problems I ever had it with it was mag related. The other is an SBR on a PWA lower, once I got the usual SBR bugs worked out it's ran like a champ. Two things with AR's, one is mags mil-spec only, and the other is lubricant use what ever floats your boat but it's a machine with moving parts and thus requires lube.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:42:39 PM EDT
All jams I've had in either of my AR's were because of crappy ammo.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:52:49 PM EDT
What I have learned is that you need to know the system throughout. My problems have all been operator / maintinence related. But they have mostly disappeared since I have learned how the firearm works and how to properly care for it.

I had the same problem as Gus, the wrong extractor spring was installed. Also, none of my mags have green followers so occasionally I have a FTF on the next to the last round.

A loose carrier key caused me some grief for a day and a half at the HMHS shoot a year ago, and mis-aligned gas rings got me once.

I know better now, I just need to break down and buy some green followers.

Mario

Link Posted: 1/28/2002 4:59:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:05:38 PM EDT
I hjave never had my gun jam on me. I did jam once when my girlfriend was shooting though. However I wasnt l;ooking too closly so I calk that one up to operator error and dont count it.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:13:55 PM EDT
When I first got my Bushmaster flattop I could not get through a single mag of ammo without a jam....turned out those bozos at the factory didn't pin the gas tube in to the front sight. After I completed assembly of the rifle, everything has been fine since.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:21:51 PM EDT
I have a colt pre-ban and have never had a jam. (even with crappy ammo)
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:41:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By kujo929:
I have a colt pre-ban and have never had a jam. (even with crappy ammo)


same here 2000 rounds without a single jam.
COLT rocks
HUNTER FROM ARGENTINA
OUT.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:42:31 PM EDT
I've shot thousands of rounds through various ARs, including an uncle's '71 SP1, my post-ban Match Target, my pre-ban Sporter Match HBAR, an M4gery built on that pre-ban receiver with a Colt upper, a Bushmaster post-ban, and an Armalite HBAR M-15 with stainless barrel. Not a single jam with any of those rifles. This was all range work though, I've not gone slogging through swamps and such with an AR. My backpacking rifle is that M4gery. It's gotten pretty dirty when out in the woods for a couple weeks and still functions just fine, but I've never had it get really gucked up.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:49:13 PM EDT
Two Bushies, one an M4gery and the other a C-7A1 clone. Maybe a couple of dozen SA battlepacks throught the both of them so far (~7k rnds). I mainly use 20rnd USGI mags loaded full up (they were designed to take 20 so mine take 20).

So far each rifle has had maybe three fail-to-feed malfunctions each, cleared with a quick SPORTS drill with no probs. These usually occur either on the first mag or toward the end of a range session. I've never had more than a single stoppage in a given trip to the range, though.

Just for the record my SAR-1 has jammed too. It just took a vice and a rubber mallet to pry the bolt open...
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:50:21 PM EDT
My ARs had jammed a few times, but that was due to a faulty magazine. As long as I use good magazines, I have excellent performance from my ARs.

ArmaLiter
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 5:55:28 PM EDT
jam free here.armalite m15 a2 20"
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 6:15:17 PM EDT
My AR has jammed a twice with an Adventureline mag that I have. both were on different occasions with the same mag(I marked it). I now use it exclusively with my FNC but I barely shoot it. I do notice that it doesn't drop free from the FNC, and all others do. since then I developed some disdain for adventureline mags. they are all in my FNC case. Other than that perfect. and 2 jams in about 3000 rounds is not to shabby I think. not too mention 200 rounds of 22LR in my last outing.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 6:26:51 PM EDT
About 14 years ago I had a SP1 that I fired about 2000 rounds through. It was not kept exceptionally clean, but I never had a jam. My new M4gery has not been fired yet, but I expect the same performance. Hell, Ive never used the forward assist!
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 6:29:09 PM EDT
The only time my Bushy has ever jammed is with a Ciener .22 conversion. I've used Fed. AE .223, Radway Green SS109, Korean Surplus 5.56, and S.A. Surplus.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 6:38:13 PM EDT
Out of 5 ARs, all assembled by myself, I've only had one that ever had any problems. That one is using an 'FN' non-chrome lined bolt carrier, and the barrel is an A2 barrel that I cut down to 18" with a Dremel to get rid of the threaded muzzle. It was having some extraction problems at first but as that POS bolt carrier breaks in the rifle has been reliable. I put 200 rounds through it the other day without a hitch.
Link Posted: 1/28/2002 6:46:10 PM EDT
mine only jams when I use USA mags or my nylon brass catcher. If I do not use either of these my gun does not jam. I would bank my like on my Bushy shorty with my Thermold mags!!
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 3:06:44 AM EDT
out of two franken ar's i have gotten less than 5 failures to feed. that was ONLY with umc ammo. nothing else - on a hesse lower even!!!
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 4:39:46 AM EDT
My Bushmaster M4 had FTE problems when it was new due to the carrier keys not being staked. That has long since been corrected and I have had no problems whatsoever with my rifle. I have 100% confidence in this rifle. I have a few thousand rounds through it and also now only buy Lake City ammo which I have found to be the sweet ammo for this rifle. I achieve my best accuracy with that stuff.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 5:16:23 AM EDT
I have a Preban Colt. It has never even thought about jamming. I have used many different mags, and all kinds of ammo! I think it actually prefers Wolf!
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 5:24:05 AM EDT
1,500+ jam free rounds of all types in my postban A2 target model Bushmaster

300 or so rounds in my jam-o-matic Frankengun. 16" Oly PCR on a Bushmaster lower.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 5:31:45 AM EDT
no problems except with pmp ammo or broken extractor spring. clean it and it'll treat you right.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:16:04 AM EDT
Three jams in 1,000 rounds on my only AR15 that gets shot with any frequency. Two were due to a dry bolt carrier - gun failed to go into battery. Corrected the problem by lubing the bolt carrier (the forward assist was useless by the way). Third problem was a bad magazine - the follower stuck allowing the rounds to come loose and rattle about.

I consider the dry bolt carrier to be a case of operator error.

I have seen at least two other AR15s that I owned that had gun-related issues.

One was an all Bushy postban lower that I assembled myself. It had problems with the trigger pin walking out under semi-auto fire. It eventually settled in with a little bit of work and ran problem free.

The second was a pre-ban Bushy/who knows? that was built with all kinds of godawful surplus parts I can't begin to identify. I bought it to get the pre-ban; but it was a mess - the hammer and trigger had been stoned to the point the rifle doubled, the safety wouldn't flip between safe and fire - practically all the lower parts had to be replaced and I didn't even mess with the upper but sold it as is.

I think the primary source of "AR15s are unreliable" stories are parts guns sold at gun shows and a residue of Vietnam-era stories.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:27:20 AM EDT
When I ordered my Colt in '91 I got an Eagle or Ramline 30 rd mag to go with it. The one that works in AR's and Mini-14's.

That mag jammed on the 27th round every time. Take it to the bank. After about the 5th or 6th time I sold it to a coworker for $10. It ran flawless in his Mini.

I guess the two POS' were made for each other.

Now my rifle runs 100% with USGI and Thermold mags. Never a jam since parting with that other mag.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:29:49 AM EDT
Colt HBAR preban (R6700CH). Using USGI mags, and off the shelf ammo, NO stoppages.
No special cleaning, no TLC. Just CLP, and a bit of grease on the face of the hammer.

I can induce em with USA mags. I won't run reloads, unless they're mine.

Meplat-
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:36:34 AM EDT
I've owned several ARs and made many changes in configuration to them since the 1970s. The only jam problems I ever had was with an upper I built up. It had something wrong with a shaved gas block. That thing just would not work. I replaced the gas block and no more problems. FWIW, I did not ever have a jam with my M16A1 when I was in the US Army. Best. Watch-Six
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:42:01 AM EDT
I'll add to all this--
My Pre-ban Bushy with ~2000 rounds has been perfect since I got rid of the USA mags. I use USGI, Thermolds, and mostly Orlite mags without any problems. Ammo I use is SA surplus, S&B steel cased (normally), and a little Wolf, all without problems!

That being said, My Bushy is my SHTF gun, and I would trust my life to it!
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 7:51:07 AM EDT
Colt Pre-ban HBAR Match >1500 rnds, no jams to date.
2 past Colts in the 80's never jammed
1 homemade Palmeto lower shorty (1979) jammed every clip (suspected pins out of alignment)
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 8:05:58 AM EDT
Out of the 800+ rounds I've fired in mine, I've had two rounds that didn't fire (Sellier & Belloit, so that's excusable), and then I had one roud of Winchester that fired, but for some reason didn't cycle the bolt all the way. Aside from that it's been flawless. So basically I've never had a problem with anything other than ammo. I've got a Colt Match HBAR.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 11:41:01 AM EDT
I had one, a J&T kit, that never jammed. I have a couple of Bushmasters that each jammed twice each when I fist got them, but no jams since then.

Another kit (M&A) jammed all the time when I got it, but I played around with it a little and it worked flawlessly after that.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 11:51:45 AM EDT
C) Never Use only function tested good magazines and good quality ammo. Become thoroughly aquainted with your chamber cleaning brush. If you don't ever clean the bbl-Ok, but use that chamber brush everytime regardless of # of rounds fired. It keeps my Armalites going strong.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:04:04 PM EDT
I have 4 of them. They all go bang everytime.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:13:17 PM EDT
My first 300 rounds it jammed alot. Freaked me out, as you can imagine.
But now after 2500 rounds, its jammed probably twice, and that was using wolf ammo.
Look, the AR isn't a foolproof weapon, but you with even alittle maintenance, and even halfway good ammo, it will function properly.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:16:00 PM EDT
PWA pre-ban lower with Colt upper. Jammed (all sorts) with crappy USA steel mags and FTF with Thermold mags. Runs like a top with USGI mags.

Bolt will fail to close if I let it get too dry. Keep it lubed and it will run all day. I'm in the middle of a test for lack of cleaning. I'm at 600 rounds without cleaning and no failures yet.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:37:41 PM EDT
When my BM was new it jammed a few times in the first 200 rounds (short stroke). Since then (appr 2500 rds) it has not. I use mostly winchester white box and South Afr nato surplus. I also use colt 20rd mags. I have 6 30rd mags to keep my range bag full. I do clean the gun after every trip to the range-I have to many USMC relatives to risk a dirty gun.
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:42:15 PM EDT
AR-15
700 rounds
0 jams


SAR-2
200 rounds
1 jam
Link Posted: 1/29/2002 12:44:14 PM EDT
My never jammed too. (No USA mag in this house)
I trust it with my life.

But than again.. my rifle never left the comfort of a safe or range.
Never saw combat, rain, dust, mud.
I'll always keep a cleaning rod handy, just in case...
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