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Posted: 9/5/2010 7:13:04 PM EDT
The following is my idea:
I am going to build a Bolt Action .30 Caliber Truck Gun
Specifications:
- .30 Caliber
- 16" Barrel with either compensator or flash suppressor.
- Five Round Magazine
- Base gun must not cost over $100
- Must be able to be stored under or behind the rear seat of a pick up truck.
- Ammo must be of cheap and pletiful quantity for the testing and subsequent load out once issued.
- Glass optics ok, but primary must be organic to the rifle and not easily changed.
- Milsurp is desired for this project.
- The milsurp must not be something that will destroy a historically sensitive piece.
- Action and Barrel will be stripped and repainted OD Green
- Stock must be modified from the original stock that comes with the rifle.

Actual Idea:
Base Rifle
- Mosin Nagant with regular length barrel

Barrel modification:
- Barrel cut down to 16" with muzzle brake or flash suppressor permanently attached to the end.
- Bayonet will not be neccessary.

Stock Modification
- The forend will be cut down to accomodate the shortened barrel.
- The muzzle end will protrude only a couple of inches from the end.
- The stock will be shortened and have a trap door that will open into a cavity to hold cleaning supplies and some survival items.
- The outside surface of the stock will be coated in black bed liner.

Truck Gun Rifle Gear
- Belt with cartridge holder and utilility combat blade attached.
- Load out will be 100 plus cartidges.

I am not intersted in being able to achieve moment of bad guy hits any further than 200 yards. 100 yards will be the most that I expect to engage at. I will attempt to make the stripper clip system as an aid to increasing the rate of fire when needed. Ultimately, I would like to take it to a three gun match after a familearity and train up is finished. I don't plan to win any speed shooting contests, but I do plan to be able to use this as a SHOCK AND AWE weapon to be used to get myself or family out of a bad day if needed.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 7:26:16 PM EDT
Well it's definately different. I love my Mosin and I know I want another one or two...or five sometime down the road. The Mosin M44's are pretty nice because they have a fairly short barrel, shorter than the 91/30 anyway. I personally don't have any problem with "bubba" modified SKS's and Mosins so I am looking forward to the end result of this project.
Good Luck!
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:10:37 PM EDT
on the m44 if you take off the front sight/ bayo housing, then cut off the bayo portion leaving the front sight.....you can then press it back on, drill a new cross pin hole in the barrel to hold it in place.....you now have a nice stub ahead of the barrel to thread for a flash hider and still shorten it up a bit. I did this minus the flash hider for my brother-in-law. it is a quick/ easy barrel bob that keeps the stock front sight.....which I like very much. the large globe/ post is very quick on target. the barrel ends up slightly longer than your stated 16" but at about 19" it is still very compact and handy.

advntrjnky
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 8:49:08 PM EDT
I really want to shorten the barrel to the legal title II firearm length. The flash suppressor is due to my anticipation of the fireball that will result when fired. What type of flash suppressor will fit on a Mosin Nagant? I will measure my 91/30 to see.
Thank You
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:24:43 PM EDT
Sounds like a fun idea.

You could look into a Spanish FR-8, It already has a short barrel and a G3 flash hider.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 10:30:47 PM EDT
I'll agree with the above poster, the FR-8 sounds about right for your needs. Although it would be cool to see what kind of Mosin you end up with after doing those mods.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 3:33:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/6/2010 3:38:20 AM EDT by cybersniper]
Sounds like a fun project. But maybe more work than its worth.

I know your list of parameters are for a milsurp rifle, but a used Savage or even Remington bolt action with synth stock in 308 can be found at garage sales and pawn shops for $300 or less. Would be alot less work for a more accurate rifle with less of a fireball. You wouldnt need the add the flash hinder. Barrels can be easily cut down or find a youth model which are already more compact. 308 ammo is cheap, milsurp ammo is available. Some, like the Savage, come with detachable mags for faster reloads. With hunting season comming ammo will be on sale and so will basic rifle packages. Just an idea.

Also, why set on a bolt action? A folding stock SKS para model seems to fit perfectly other wise.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 5:06:18 AM EDT
I see fail written all over this. I did see a stevens in .308 the other day with a 17" bbl and was fitted with a front site already.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 5:51:21 AM EDT
Not a bad idea at all. Might want to think about starting with a Stevens in 308, it would be much less work. However as we all know, that wouldn't be as fun!
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 6:34:26 AM EDT
doesn't Academy have stevens 200's on sale for less than $200 on a regular basis? you could get one of those in .308 and do whatever you want with it for cheap. and apparently they're quite accurate. if you get one that isn't, you can re-barrel it pretty easily.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 7:00:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By cookhj:
doesn't Academy have stevens 200's on sale for less than $200 on a regular basis? you could get one of those in .308 and do whatever you want with it for cheap. and apparently they're quite accurate. if you get one that isn't, you can re-barrel it pretty easily.


The Academy ones for $179.99 were only 7mm-08 (with a 1:11.5 twist ) and .270.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 10:03:43 AM EDT
So what's wrong with a fireball? Why bother with the flash suppressor... Realistically you're going to be shooting folks at very close ranges should the need arise.

And personally, I'd leave the bayonet on the M44... Then you've got one very effective spear/club once you're out of ammo/jammed. I've even got a few fixed on my home-defense weapons. Sure can't hurt.

Link Posted: 9/6/2010 12:08:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By txsgar15a2:
I really want to shorten the barrel to the legal title II firearm length. The flash suppressor is due to my anticipation of the fireball that will result when fired. What type of flash suppressor will fit on a Mosin Nagant? I will measure my 91/30 to see.
Thank You


if you go down to 16" any flash hider will fit, because you need a lathe at that point.....if you modify the front sight/ bayo mount like I mentioned you can use a threading die and alignment tool to thread it either 14x1mm LH because of the step left where the front sight is pressed on. if you cut it back to 16" you don't have the option of using the original front sight unless you have a lathe and turn the muzzle end of the barrel down. if you want minimal cost/ hand tools/ easily done at home.....you can only get down to about 19". any shorter than that and the cost goes up considerably......if 16" is really your goal do what the others mentioned and get something more modern because it will be cheaper in the long run.

advntrjnky
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 12:44:47 PM EDT
No matter what, you know PICS ARE MANDATORY!
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 4:27:10 PM EDT
Heres my trunk gun. Stock length barrel, though. Definitely minute-of-troll acurracy at 100 yards and I'm only out about $125 if it gets abducted.
Link Posted: 9/6/2010 8:36:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 92muddyXJ:
No matter what, you know PICS ARE MANDATORY!


As if this really needs to be said.

TAG
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 6:01:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By kennyrock12:
Heres my trunk gun. Stock length barrel, though. Definitely minute-of-troll acurracy at 100 yards and I'm only out about $125 if it gets abducted.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c202/kennyrock12/DSCN0924.jpg


Was that a m44 or a m38?
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 8:11:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2010 8:18:33 AM EDT by Combat_Diver]
The M44 has a 20" bbl. Here's my Polish M44 and a 1904 dated 1891 Russian Tula Scout Carbine.



The scout carbine was cut down by a gunsmith in Texas back in the early 90s. Barrel is somewhere between 17-18" and has two ports cut into the barrel. It still has a beach ball size muzzle flash but the steel butt plate doesn't slam into your shoulder.


The carbine orginally had a 3x Bushnell Phantom Pistol scope on it but it did not hold up to the recoil (reticle broke and windage knob sheared off). This was about the 500rd mark. Mount is a 3/8" rail brazed to the rear sight block. Gun sat unused and without any finish left. Around 07' I went to a gunshow and purchased the NCStar green/red dot. Added some Krylon paint and the sight. Gun still shoots 4" groups with the large red/green dot with surplus ball at 100m and retains the stripper clip guide. Had $40 in the gun, $35 sight and a few bucks for the paint. Also wears an old M16 1" nylon sling.


CD
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 3:28:58 PM EDT
I like it ^
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 4:44:46 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 5:00:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By UZI4you:
Sounds like a fun idea.

You could look into a Spanish FR-8, It already has a short barrel and a G3 flash hider.


I saw an FR-8 at a gun show once... Really neat looking Gun...
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 7:23:57 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mike_nds:
Here's a Spanish 1916 in .308 I reworked for a friend of mine many years ago.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-1.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-2.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-3.jpg


what stock is that in? it's not a SR mauser stock.....Remy 700?

advntrjnky
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 8:18:40 PM EDT
Combat Diver:
Good concept gun! How do you determine the angle and size of cuts at the end of the muzzle like that?
How much will I lose in accuracy if I go all the way to 16" barrel length?
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 9:33:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2010 9:36:28 PM EDT by RobertV77]
Any commercial rifle you could purchase will perform better than the rifle your planning and you will not completely ruin you resale value with the first cut. None of the mods you are planning will make the rifle perform better and many you are planning will make it perform worse. You could buy a m44 throw it behind the seat and be ahead of the game.
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 11:50:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RobertV77:
Any commercial rifle you could purchase will perform better than the rifle your planning and you will not completely ruin you resale value with the first cut. None of the mods you are planning will make the rifle perform better and many you are planning will make it perform worse. You could buy a m44 throw it behind the seat and be ahead of the game.


This ^
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 1:33:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 1:40:04 AM EDT by Combat_Diver]
Originally Posted By txsgar15a2:
Combat Diver:
Good concept gun! How do you determine the angle and size of cuts at the end of the muzzle like that?
How much will I lose in accuracy if I go all the way to 16" barrel length?


That I don't know as I don't do the work. But it looks like he just used a dremel tool and cut down to a certain depth. There's still rifling under the cuts. Remember 2" j frames are accurate to 100yd. Most of your accuracy will also be your muzzle crown. Mine is no more then a 200yd gun anyway as the red dot is 8 MOA. Anything past 200 will be covered by the dot.

Good luck on your project. Remember the Russians only built 36 million MN alone. There are fewer Savage 110s built. My carbine is 106 yrs old and still servicable. Very few sporting rifles have the stripper guide and very few custom modes to add one($$$).


CD

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 3:25:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By glazer1972:
Originally Posted By kennyrock12:
Heres my trunk gun. Stock length barrel, though. Definitely minute-of-troll acurracy at 100 yards and I'm only out about $125 if it gets abducted.
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c202/kennyrock12/DSCN0924.jpg


Was that a m44 or a m38?


It was a nice Polish M44 that in my young and stupid days I cut the bayonet lugs off of. I only paid $65 for it and didnt know Mosins back then.

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 5:11:08 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 11:40:24 AM EDT
thanks!

advntrjnky
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 10:31:06 AM EDT
This sounds like a great winter project, i picked up a mitchells k-48 mauser complete kit a few years back and never touched it, its still in the box , grabbed it at a pawn shop for 150. out the door. it may be to nice to do it in. but it seems you cant give them away,

good luck ,, have some fun,
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 10:58:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/9/2010 10:59:18 AM EDT by bradpierson26]
if I was able to have/needed a truck gun, I think a stevens 200 in .308. Redfield 2-7x33mm scope in QD rings. The barrel would get cut to 17" and I would permanently attach a YHM 7.62 flash hider. I would also get a smith to install a backup peep sights or something similar. I would also need a synthetic sling with leather or heavy duty nylon edges to prevent fraying and an eagle cheek pack - the ones that hold 5 catridges on the outside and have a zip up pocket. In the pocket would be a small Swiss army knife, a 1oz bottle of remoil, a lighter, and some 550 cord.
I would probably paint it to. maybe not camo, but probably flat black.

Im not sure what bullet I would load it with though, maybe 150g Federal Fusions....
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 11:07:20 AM EDT
If I were going to build a .30 cal bolt gun for the truck I would copy thereisnospoon's Ishapore.

Link Posted: 9/9/2010 3:47:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By txsgar15a2:
I really want to shorten the barrel to the legal title II firearm length. The flash suppressor is due to my anticipation of the fireball that will result when fired. What type of flash suppressor will fit on a Mosin Nagant? I will measure my 91/30 to see.
Thank You


7.62x54 has a lot of slow burning powder in the case. Your not going to touch the fireball out of a 16 inch barrel with any flash hider. Since its not going to serve any useful purpose I would buy what ever looks best to you.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 5:53:58 AM EDT
What in the hell is it with people using Mil-Surps to create "truck" guns?

My truck gun is a Henry AR-7. I paid $75 for it. It's small, compact, semi-auto, has three magazines loaded plus an extra 100rds. It sits in a package no bigger then a standard first aid kit under the seat.

I carry my pistol on me 24/7 along with a couple of spare magazines. That's my go to "oh shit" gun. Not some rifle that's gonna sit behind my seat. The .22LR is in the truck more for impromptu plinking, not fighting off the next McDuffie Riot in Miami.

I have discussed the idea of truck/trunk combat arms. While they are good ideas; they're not rapid. That's what our pistols are for. You're in a vehicle. You either do two things.

1. Get the fuck out of the area ASAP.
2. Get the fuck out of your vehicle ASAP.

Vehicles are bullet magnets. Only place on a vehicle that can provide cover is the engine block and the front wheels. Everything else is sheet metal and plastic. Rounds will go through it like a hot knife through butter.

Your vehicle gives you the chance of escape. If a bunch of idiots try to block your path like they did to Reginald Denny during the L.A. Riots; slam on the gas and run them down if you have to. Because if you stop. This will happen to you.



Take some good course and study. Standard SOP for vehicles is to get out of the problem. Not stop and fight it. Don't worry about scratching the paint or putting a dent in the fender. SLAM ON THE GAS and UN ASS THE AREA ASAP.

Link Posted: 9/10/2010 6:56:39 AM EDT
I also carried a Charter Arms AR7 as a truck gun back in the mid 80s. However, there are other areas where a centerfire might be needed say out on the southwest border region (have drove from San Diego, Ca to San Antonio, Tx a few times with a 1917 along side me). I remember back in the early 90s that I got stuck in Atlanta during some riots and only had my Colt Officers and 3 mags on me since I was traveling. Would have liked to have a long gun in the hotel with me also.

CD
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 7:38:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/10/2010 7:39:27 AM EDT by mike_nds]
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 10:24:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By mike_nds:
Here's a Spanish 1916 in .308 I reworked for a friend of mine many years ago.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-1.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-2.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-3.jpg


That is the most bad ass rifle I have ever seen! Seriously. How much did that cost to do? Would you do it again?
Link Posted: 9/15/2010 7:32:33 AM EDT
I don't have a picture of mine, but it looks exactly like this. I suppose if I felt I needed a truck gun, this would be the one.


Pawn shop sporterized Enfield No.4
XS scout mount
cheap scout scope
Ramline synthetic stock
spray paint

I maybe have $300 in it. I was thinking about adding a aftermarket trigger, but not sure if I want to add another hundred bucks to the project.
Link Posted: 9/15/2010 10:58:04 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/15/2010 11:02:05 AM EDT
Originally Posted By mike_nds:
Here's a Spanish 1916 in .308 I reworked for a friend of mine many years ago.

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-1.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-2.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/Scout-3.jpg


Thats awesome!
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