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Posted: 3/8/2008 9:36:41 AM EDT
| Has anybody personally handled the MP7 personal defense weapon from HK? I see a couple of accessories available online, but not the weapon itself. Is it military issue only at this time? Is there a civilian model on the way? Can't wait to try one on. |
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I fondled one at shot show. IMHO a .17hmr pistol. Pretty neat little gun never the less. H&K reps said there will not be a civy version. I know of one guy on the board who has shot one, I have not had a chance to talk with him on his impressions. IMHO Knights Armament PDW and FN ps90(sbr) are better choices. I'm really hoping KAC brings their pdw to market. |
I shot one, it was pretty cool, very controllable on F/A, no muzzle rise at all. Itd be ok to replace a pistol but I dont know how it would do on a person, probably if you dumped the whole mag into him he would die, which would be pretty easy to do with it. The one I shot had an eotech on it, which was a bit big, one with an aimpoint micro would be a sweet sidearm. |
In the footage I watched, just a couple of those 4.6 rounds turned a Kevlar PASGT helmet into a straw hat -- thoroughly penetrated conventional body armor, as well. I definitely wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of that pea-shooter. 
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It's kinda like being stabbed a bunch of times with an ice-pick. It's not the ideal stopping power in a serious engagement, but for personal security/defense, it's deterrent enough.  If HK does release a civilian version, it will involve three tons of ABS plastic molded into an aesthetically nauseating shape. |
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Well, when I was growing up on the ranch, my dad explained the effectiveness of high-velocity versus low-velocity in this fashion: "Which scares you more, a needle traveling at 500 mph, or a brick traveling at 50 mph?" For sheer destruction, I'd avoid the big, slow brick. 
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Here is a good read as it is as relevant for the 4.6 as it is for the 5.7. www.10-8forums.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=64299&an=0&page=0#64299 |
| HK has stated they will not sell this weapon to civilians and I'm sure if they did decide to they will fiddle around and take some velocity away from the round so that it will not go through armor. Just like FN did with the FN FiveSeven . The round is very effective at what it was designed to do though ,which is pierce armor. |
Whoa. So you killed a bunch of heavily armored BGs in close quarter combat? I don't envy you, bro. Were you in such close quarters that the MP7 was absolutely necessary, or could your M4 have worked as well? |
It was a video game... |
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I fired it a few years ago at the HK factory range in Germany (they give free tours to military on request); It was a fun little gun to shoot; I actually liked it better then a P90. I think for the role of pistol replacement (not a front line weapon), it would work...... |
| I handled one at the SHOT show, it was a pretty neat little package, it's very compact with the foregrip folded and the stock retracted...not much bigger then a Mark 23 actually and very comfortable fully deployed. The fact that the round didn't pan out at all not withstanding it would be a fairly neat replacement for a pistol, but it's not a primary weapon, it's not even really sub gun if you ask me. It's a machine pistol with a stock, that's it. |
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The MP7 is a moot issue at this point for me. The PS90 is already available for folks that want a PDW and soon (both fingers crossed) we'll have the Magpul PDR, which if they can keep recoil and muzzle flash down will pretty much be my pick for a PDW type weapon. We've seen a lot of USA LEO departments adopt the PS90 and not very many have gone with the MP7 (in fact I don't know of any that have, but I'm sure they're out there). The Marine Corps ordered a decent number of MP7s for T&E, but they must have been either unimpressed with the weapon or found some sort of collateral issues with it. I just hope that Magpul keeps playing with the PDR and is able to bring it to production. When you consider that the 5.56x45mm is the standard round for the US Military and the fact that we have a limited amount of helicopters in Afghanistan right now logistics is a key concern. I think that even if the MP7 or 416 for that matter makes it to the market it will be a day late and a dollar short. There are just far better alternatives for better value out there already in my opinion. |
You probably will not see any testimonals of it at this point. As far as I know only Germany is taking the MP7 to Afghanistan (seen pictures of them using and it a video of them at a range there with it). They aren't seeing a lot of direct combat and serve mostly a support role with highly restrictive ROE put in place on them.  Sucks when you consider how high caliber the German Military is and yet in a nation of 82 Million people they have probably around only a 1,000 in Afghanistan or less without all their famous armor. Hell, the Canadians are the only way the LEO2 ever got to see action in Afghanistan. Of course, it's all internal politics and has nothing to do with the German soldiers. |
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The Brugger + Thomet MP9 seems to be a better platform and there are effective 9mm armor piercing rounds available too now. There really isn't much reason to use the proprietary calibers. The Swedish Bofors M39B 9x19mm cartridge will supposedly penetrate 50 layers of kevlar at 50m range or 20 cm of wood or 7 cm of brick. At the cost of increased barrel wear. Being able to use the 9mm AP, FMJ, HP, frangible, ballistic tip, and winchester white box is going to be the death knell for guns like the P90, MP7, and Knights PDW. The Magpul PDR uses full power 5.56mm so it might be the best choice of all, if it ever comes out. |
I can testify to that. The M39B is a hot load. It does cause more wear on the gun than regular ammo but the Glocks used by the military work just fine even whith tens of thousands of rounds through them. |
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