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Posted: 9/6/2007 5:11:30 PM EDT
| Is it a very nice rifle? How much is it? Is an AR just as good? I don't know anything about it. Any advice would be appreciated. |
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I personally think it's a very nice gun. Make sure you get one with a serial# AFTER 4500 and you're sure to get a nice gun. There were some cosmetic issues with early production guns but SIG has addressed them all, and will address them if you got an early gun. Some people just don't like them because it doesn't look the same as the swiss gun, but all of the "look" differences are far outweighed by the advantages it has over the swiss rifles (ar mags, LOP stock) not to mention that it has genuine swiss parts (highly suspected - they're basically identical with the same markings but it hasn't been confirmed by SIGARMS)in it's operating mechanism which is where it counts. EVERYONE who has shot mine loved it, and 99.999% of actual owners swear by the gun. |
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Depends on how much experience you have with Swiss Arms AG and Schweizerische Industrie Gesellschaft carbines and products. The more experience you have with Swiss Arms AG products the better The less experience you have with Swiss Arms AG and Schweizerische Industrie Gesellschaft carbines then you won’t have a reference point for ranking the 556 against its distinguished predecessors the 556 does not feature the Swiss Arms precision seal ensuring the weapon is held to highest quality and build standards. I would advise you to find a way to handle and shoot Swiss Arms AG carbines prior to paying for a 556. 
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+1 My range report |
VB3 - Perhaps the two can't be compared in the sense that you speak of, however, there are a lot of similarities and characteristices inhereted by the less desirable 556. What does a Sig 551 cost? $10,000 ? $20,000???? Aside from the name, nostalga, and swiss seal, how much better do the "genuine" swiss guns actually shoot than the 556 costing a fraction of the cost at $1200? I've got to admit, I have never been a Sig fan for reasons I wont get in to, but to give the rifle a fair, impartial, and honest assessment to potential buyers, I have to say that I really like it and feel that it is a good value for one wanting a rifle with much influence and characteristics as the genuine swiss rifles. My Sig 556 is reliable, accurate, easy to clean, has a great trigger and takes my ar mags to boot. Please tell me, and the rest of the world, what would guns bearing the "Swiss Arms Precision Seal" that you speak so much about, costing thousands more dollars, do that the 556 wont? Will it Yodle? Talk? Lay Golden Eggs? |
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Haha - VB3 strikes again to crap on the 556. Maybe he's spent so much time here since he's been banned from talking about the 556 on sigforum. Really - the 556 internals are <identical> and ALL reviews have said it's extremely reliable. I don't think I've even read of a single issue with firing or accuracy. |
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I have one. It's accurate, reliable, has a trigger nothing short of amazing, decent ergos, and is relatively affordable. I've not heard of many reliability problems with them. It's heavier than the AR-15, but I carried my around all day at a three-gun shoot and it didn't bother me. It seems to have less recoil than my AR, but my AR has an 11.5" barrel and seems to have heavier recoil than most of the others ARs I've shot. I really wish I would have waited to buy one of the later generation 556s or better yet wait for the TPD AUG. It's not without it's flaws though, primarily the rail on the top, which - on every example I've seen, is too large and to meet Picatinny spec and the screw heads stick out of the top by just a bit, so many optics mounts or BUIS won't fit on them. Some early examples had bad finish, canted rails, and poorly designed pistol grips, but fortunately all of these problems have been solved in recent runs. My suggestion is to inspect before you buy. I wouldn't order one without seeing or handling it first. |
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I love mine and sold my 16" AR because the Sig beat it out for my purposes. The XCR and AR piston uppers are doing very well too and it would behoove you to try and shoot them all if you can. But from my experience, you will not be disappointed with the Sig 556. I always have to post a pic.  I will take some "glamor shots" this weekend in all positions and outside in some grass.  |
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I have one and love it. My friends that have shot it like it a lot too. It is a bit more nose heavy than my AR's but it's every bit as accurate and enjoyable to shoot. They really are nice rifles. ETA: And guys lets keep this one on topic and not let it veer off into another train wreck. Uncle_ho I tried to send you a IM or email and youhave them turned off. |
| I have not bought any 'tactical' rifles yet, and I was just sounding the waters before I buy one. I was thinking about buying a Stag AR because they come in left handed (I am a left handed shooter), but I have decided that I will just suck it up and buy a right handed rifle if I don't end up getting an AR. Are there any problems that the 556 would cause a left handed shooter? How much did you guys pay for yours? I don't want to break the bank. |
I shot mine left handed last weekend. The brass ejection is so positive and so far forward you'll be just fine. You should be able to manipulate the charging handle just fine, and the safety is ambi |
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What is your purpose for the rifle? How much do you want to spend JUST on the rifle? (excluding accesories and ammo)? One reason I LOVE my 556 is that it works extremely well for a lefty--as good as a STAG lefty, which I also own. (both have ambi controls but the 556 charging handle, mounted on the right, is easy for the left-handed shooter). |
Uncle Ho, This website might help you browse what you like. Most are available in factory or clone semi-auto form. world.guns.ru/assault/as00-e.htm From there, you can find what you're looking for sometimes at Wikipedia. To answer your question specifically, FALs and H&K G3 are available in semiauto form in various configurations. Off hand one's that are around for traditional civilian purchase: - SKS - AK-47 - AK-74 - AUG - G3/HK91 - HK93 - FAL - AR-15 - AR-180 - G36 - Daewoo - AR-10 - XCR - Sig556 - Galil - FS2000 - PS90 |
The XM8 project is dead, has been since 2005. So civilians won't get them and the military doesn't want them. However, HK is taking some of the surviving prototypes to the "extreme dust environment" shoot-off in an attempt to revive the program. There, against the FN SCAR, HK 416, and the standard M4, they will see if the problems that occurred with the XM8s repeat themselves or not. The shoot-off is expected to take about five months. www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,143790,00.html?ESRC=eb.nl Personally I'd like to see the Sig 556, FN FS2000, XCR, and the Masada also take part in the shoot-off. But supposedly the point of the shoot-off is not to find them M4's replacement, but just to gather more data about what systems are most reliable... whatever that means.... |
I would like that too. Why the hell is HK still fussing about the XM8? They have the 416 and 417 which would be easier sells to the military than any other rifle seeing as they would require the least changes. |
If you'd ever handled an XM8, you'd know what it has to offer (ergonomically) over the M4. I can't attest to it's funtionality (since they didn't let us fire them when we were inside the display room at the factory in Oberdorf am Neckar), but they felt better in my hands than anything else I've ever handled. |
| You guys obviously know more about military style rifles than me, so do you think that the M16 will be replaced in the near future my another battle rifle? An acquaintance overheard me talking about rifles with a friend and entered the conversation to talk about how after watching a program about the Tavor on Future Weapons that bullpups were the future of rifles and that the M16 was old and dumb, even though he could not tell me what caliber they were chambered for. I did not pay any attention to him but I was wondering if the M16 needed to be replaced. They seem like fine weapons to me. |
 The M4/M16 is going to remain as standard equipment for a very long time. Tell your acquaintance that there are more important things than looking cool on TV. By the way, the Tavor is chambered in the same round, 5.56. |
DemolitionDamon, is correct. I don't see the M4/M16 going away anytime soon. The Tavor is a neat weapon, even though I despise bullpups. The magazine release is a real PITA. What I most liked was the integrated safety-selector/laser. Bascially, when you SAFE the weapon, the laser cannot discharge. Once you rotate the selector to SEMI, the laser is then armed for use. Very neat. |
Not sure I would call them a fad. I'm personally not a big fan, but they do have their place. They allow the shooter to get very tight with the weapon, but you can do that with a non bullpup style weapon. I'd say shoot one before you make your decision. But, I say that about any weapon you want to purchase if your not sure. |
This opens another can'o'worms, but . . . shotties are big, heavy, slow to reload, have heavy recoil, low capacity, and short effective range. The "assault rifle" is a superior solution to the question of CQB. |
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Quoted: Well (coming from someone with no combat experience) the reason for bullpups seems to me like they are for urban combat and fighting in tight spaces, but why not use the lowly shotgun for close combat? This opens another can'o'worms, but . . . shotties are big, heavy, slow to reload, have heavy recoil, low capacity, and short effective range. The "assault rifle" is a superior solution to the question of CQB. Makes sense to me. How much longer is, say, a Steyr Aug than an M4? |
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The standard model Steyr Aug is 31.1 inches long, the carbine model is 27.2 inches long. An M4 with the stock fully retracted is 29.8. However you have to realize that the M4 features a 14.5 inch barrel at that length, and the full size AUG has a 20 inch barrel in a package that is only 1.3 inches longer. So you get the ballistics and accuracy of the longer barrel in a very compact package. Knocks on bullpups generally fall into three categories. 1. They are clunky to reload 2. Older bullpups such as the AUG could not be transitioned from one shoulder to the other, since the shooter would receive spent casings right in the face with the firearm on the "wrong" shoulder. You can change which side the gun ejects to, but it involves disassembling the gun and swapping parts around. Not something one can do in a rush if you simply want to fire from the left shoulder because you are hiding behind cover with the rest of your body. 3. Trigger pull is crappy because the trigger is located in one place and the fire control pack in another place, with a linkage in between. Therefore pretty much every bullpup I've ever shot has a long, heavy trigger pull. More modern offerings from FN have solved the second problem, but not the first or third. I find the FS2000 desireable but not enough to blow $1900 on one. I recently had the opportunity to run some CQB drills with a post-86 dealer sample AUG back-to-back with some other comparable firearms including the M16 and offerings from HK. I was impressed. An interesting concept and it certainly has some advantages, including tremendous controllability in full-auto fire compared to a similarly sized M16 variant. Also, most of the weight is in the rear of the gun, so despite the controllability it feels buttstock-heavy and barrel-light, which I think is ideal for fast target acquisition. I would feel very comfortable taking the AUG into combat if I had plenty of time to teach myself how to reload the damn thing, but then again I have a couple of ARs that I would also feel comfortable taking into combat and I'm already trained up on their ergonomics to the point that I don't even have to think about it. The bullpups are a somewhat specialized tool, but there's room in my toolbox for the concept. In certain situations they might have certain advantages, but they certainly aren't the end-all be-all of firearms development, and they might not even be the "next big thing." As far as combat shotguns goes, that's a whole 'nuther conversation. I have three combat shotguns and love them all, and wouldn't hesitate to grab one in a home defense situation. At 25 yards or closer against unarmored individuals I'm convinced that nothing stops people faster. Some will argue that a double or triple tap with fragmenting high-velocity 5.56 rounds is better, but 00 buckshot and 1 oz. slugs have a long, proven history of knocking people down and keeping them there until the chalk outlines are drawn. On the other hand, a famous firearms instructor (Clint Smith I think) coined the phrase "everyone loves a combat shotgun for the first seven rounds", meaning after that you are just out of the fight too long trying to reload the damn thing. Grunts using shotguns in Iraq and Afghanistan attempt to constantly reload while in a fight to avoid running the shotgun totally dry. They call this "feeding the monster", I've been told. Anyway, here's a fun video I found of some MOUT training with AUGs. Maybe this will help give an idea of how long/short/bulky/sleek they actually are. www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ucw_UUAhBjs&mode=related&search= Here's a vid of Jeff Overstreet of CMMG shooting an FN2000. You can see how it ejects its spent casings through a tube that ends well forward of where the head is placed, so the gun is fully ambidextrous, as well as the controllability on full auto. Jeff shoots alot of full auto though, so his control is generally good even with guns that have less inherent stability. www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pbit-R3FCvY&mode=related&search= |
This is a good way of putting it. Personally I like the FS200, but just like he said, not enough to spend around 2K for it. Shoot or at least handle everything your thinking of buying before you buy. You made a good choice with the original question. |
i'm starting to wonder if the haters have even shot one
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Vid of ADF shooting up a hillside. Notice how none use the vertical grip, they keep them folded. www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YU4F7Lpu8Q |
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