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Posted: 9/4/2002 6:22:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2002 10:55:37 AM EDT by EatBeef]
I am looking for a new antelope rifle (it may also be used to hunt deer-although not likely) to be used at fairly long ranges (500yds +). Mainly I am looking for a new cartridge, I use a 25-06 right now. Probably the 280 Rem or 264 Win Mag, so far. I want something that shoots far and flat and hits fairly hard at long ranges. Any suggestions?

Basically something that shoots as flat as a 50BMG, hits as hard as a .338, and kicks like a .223---that can't be too hard to find...
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 6:26:40 AM EDT
Some might argue that with the new heavier 7mm bullets on the market the 7mm-08 might be your answer.

The 7mm-08 is a .308 necked down to 7mm.

I once had one for whitetail hunting. It was an accurate round.

However, whitetail hunting in the mountains of the east and pronghorn hunting in Colorado are two different stories.

I've never had any expereince with the .280.
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 7:47:17 AM EDT
dude...your getting a short magnum.

i think yuou should seriously consider either the winchester or remington short magnums. they are out in .270 and 7mm. flat shooting, highly efficient and not very bad in respect to recoil (plus can be chambered in short action rifles).

sloth
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 1:09:53 PM EDT
Get a .270 WSM.

It is fast, flat, and accurate. If you want it a bit larger, get the .300 WSM.

The .280 Rem is ok, but it is a long action cartridge. 7mm-08 is a good option.

One thing about the 7mm-08. It is a proven and successful wildcat. Brass can be formed from .308. The WSM cartridges are the new "HOT" thing, but will probably also be rather successful. The .270 WSM is more powerful than 7mm-08 IIRC.

The .280 Remington is the most likely cartridge to lapse into obsolecense in my humble opinion.
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 1:19:47 PM EDT
Darn, even before I opened the thread I was already thinking 25-06.. Why change it? Ah, yes.. An excuse for a new rifle.. I getcha.

I think a .270 would work well for you. Or something with more power, how about the good ol' 7mm Rem Mag. Hits plenty hard and is pretty flat shootin'. You'll be set up for anything from antelope to moose, with that round.
You'll have to hold over no matter what cartridge you use, so there shouldn't be any concern over that.. If you try for *flat* shooting at 500 yards, your barrel is going to last about 500 rounds.

I'd stay away from the short mags etc unless you know you WANT one for sure.. Except for the original, the .300 WSM, I don't think the others will last long.. Time will tell, but that's just my opinion. They just don't have a purpose, other than a new *gimic* or a new toy, to add to a collection. They're the answer to the question no one ever asked. Sure it's good that the companies are making *new* things for the industry, but they're only reinventing the wheel.
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 4:26:48 PM EDT
When I read the title I too thought of 25-06. I have a Remington 700 BDL in this caliber. With my reloads the terminal performance is spectacular (117 BTSP Hornady Interlock bullets). Shoots very flat in my opinion, reloads chronographed at 3250 fps and it is no way hot. Pretty good BC at 0.391. Used it to shoot prarie dogs even until I got a 22 caliber varmint rifle. My Dad and brother before me used this rifle too and it is hard to say how many antelope and deer were harvested with it. Someday I hope to get a Sendero model in this caliber I like it so much.

whiterabbit
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 4:31:09 PM EDT
i was also thinking 2506. i just red an artical where the writer said if he were building hte ulimate "goat" (thats what westererns call them so im told)gun, he would go with .25-06
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 4:34:21 PM EDT
Just get the .338 RUM. You can thank me for my suggestion later Please note: I have never hunted anything larger than a pheasant or prairie dog heheheh....
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 4:35:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 5:11:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Green_Furniture:
Remington 700 in 7mm.

Worked for twenty years in Wyoming for my dad. (he ran out of shells from the box he bought in '78 so he quit going.)



Good testimony.
I concur.
( It's also my favorite combination.)



Link Posted: 9/4/2002 5:29:14 PM EDT
.270WSM the only real improvement on almost perfection, the .270 Winchester.
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 5:37:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By schapman43:
Just get the .338 RUM. You can thank me for my suggestion later Please note: I have never hunted anything larger than a pheasant or prairie dog heheheh....



Hmmm... .338RUM on a pheasant

Bet that saves a lot of time cleaning the birds.

EatBeef - I'm apparently not alone in my belief that a .25-06 is a damn good antelope caliber. 7mm Mag would be my suggestion for a little more distance, but (and I don't mean flame you) why are you even considering a 500+ yard shot at an antelope?

Link Posted: 9/4/2002 6:13:58 PM EDT
Assuming you're going to reload, and work a load for the individual rifle, there is alot of good recomendations above. I would prefer the 300 Rem Ultra Mag or a 30-378 WBY, but recoil will be a problem. I'm VERY interested in the 270 WSM. I think this would really be a fantastic cartridge and I hope to see more info on it. As far as a round becoming obsolete... if you reload, who cares? If you lay up a supply of brass, and don't go nuts on your loads, 500 shell cases will outlast the usefull life of the barrel in most cases. If you don't reload, well I guess your at the mercy of the manufacturers. I really like my 300 REM; the only drawback so far was the recoil. I put a Vais brake on it, now it's just the noise. Jesus H. is that thing loud! I've had a couple people get pissed at the range and one guy asked me if I'd stop shooting until he was done. I'd imagine the short mags don't make as much noise.
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 6:20:25 PM EDT
Just as a side note, if you want to gain a little more long range hunting info., go to Dan Lilja's web site. I think its riflebarrels.com. There's a boat load of barrel info there (obviously), but there was a section on long (reallllllly long) range hunting.
Sleepy717
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 6:35:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Yankee1911:
but (and I don't mean flame you) why are you even considering a 500+ yard shot at an antelope?




I don't know really--to give them a fighting chance. I guess something new and different and challenging, plus I am kinda lazy and don't want to stalk them along way. My buddy and I have this thing going where we won't take a shot at a prarie dog unless the range finder says 500+, so just moving up the ladder to larger game I suppose
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 6:40:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2002 6:51:11 PM EDT by EatBeef]
I guess I might have to stay with my .25-06, although the ballistics of the .280 and .264 look awefully tempting. Plus there aren't alot of people that have those calibers--I think that is cool, I like wildcat and oddball cartridges.

I don't know about those WSM, do they have the notorious bell curve trajectory of the other short action rounds?
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 7:04:41 PM EDT
The WSM series are all faster that the standard cartridges. The Short, fat case of all the WSM's is more efficient when it comes to powder burning. Look at the bench rest guys and what they shoot (22BR, 22 and 6mm PPC's, ect). The long, skinny powder collum is hard to ignite evenly. I sound like a ad...sorry. I should add, I don't currently own a WSM of any type, but that will hopefully change soon. On paper, they look good. I have to admit, the 300 win mag and the 300WSM are not much slower than my 300 rem, but the rem burns about 25% more powder. I'm shooting close to 100 grains of H1000 where I think the 300win mag is around 72 grains.

I digress... Seriously, go to riflebarrels.com (I don't know how to do a actual link) and look ant the articles on long range hunting. There's a shitload of info there and Dan Lilja makes one of the best barrels around. I have two of his barrels and they are by far my favorite barrels on my varmint guns.

Anyway...good shootin
Sleepy717
Link Posted: 9/4/2002 8:09:19 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Yankee1911:

Originally Posted By schapman43:
Just get the .338 RUM. You can thank me for my suggestion later Please note: I have never hunted anything larger than a pheasant or prairie dog heheheh....



Hmmm... .338RUM on a pheasant

Bet that saves a lot of time cleaning the birds.

EatBeef - I'm apparently not alone in my belief that a .25-06 is a damn good antelope caliber. 7mm Mag would be my suggestion for a little more distance, but (and I don't mean flame you) why are you even considering a 500+ yard shot at an antelope?




I guess I should clarify. I never used the .338RUM to hunt birds or dogs. I used appropriate firearms. Not that the .338 wouldnt be appropriate but..... oh never mind.
Link Posted: 9/6/2002 6:35:50 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/6/2002 9:07:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gunguyr:
Can you say Lazzeroni???? Speedy devils. Before
Laz. the 264 Win or the 257WEA were the flattest shooting cartridges out yonder.



Bought time someone mentioned Lazzeroni!

They beat the pants off ANYONE for long range work.

www.lazzeroni.com

I want one.
Link Posted: 9/6/2002 9:17:04 PM EDT
You might want to check out www.longrangehunting.com
Link Posted: 9/6/2002 9:27:58 PM EDT
Lazzeroni 7.82 Warbird it is, now where do I find one for sale! Is there commercially loaded ammunition for it, or do I have to handload it all. Anyone have one of these?
Link Posted: 9/6/2002 10:48:26 PM EDT
I personally would suggest the .270 Weatherby Mag. Seems to have the same requirements as you requested. It is a .300 H&H necked down to a .270 bullet.
Link Posted: 9/7/2002 8:11:33 AM EDT
I too would pick the 25-06, I've had 3 of them and when shooting anything up to 200 lb. deer you can't go wrong. One other caliber not mentioned is a 270 Ackley-improved, with this caliber you can still fire regular .270 winchester shells to fire form without worrying about headspace problems and with the right powders available today (My buddy uses reloder 22 with 130 grain partitions and out of a 26" Remington 700 he gets a little over 3,400 fps. Not exactly a summer load, flat primers, but it's faster than the .270 weatherby factory loads.)

Byron
Link Posted: 9/7/2002 11:26:16 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2002 12:05:09 PM EDT
I triple that in Rem700 in 7mm Mag that round hits hard you can shoot past 500 yards easy.
I shoot my brother-in-laws and i can hit 600+ with out high hold over.
Link Posted: 9/7/2002 12:39:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By gunguyr:
Well, Remington 700 Sendero chambered for the Warbird on Gunbroker that ends in 20 hours.
$800.00 with dies. (no it's not mine)



Thanks, I will check that out!!!
Link Posted: 9/7/2002 5:22:29 PM EDT
I was buying a new pronghorn/deer rifle, and I must agree with those above who recommend the 270 WSM. It shoots flatter than 25-06, 257 Wby, 270 Wby, 7mm Rem Mag, 300 Win Mag, and 300 Wby Mag. Only the Remington 7mm and 300 Ultra Mags are in the same ballpark, and they have double the recoil.

The long standing question "What is the best long range deer cartridge" appears, at least in my mind, to have been definitively answered.

I got the stainless Model 70 and took it to the range for the first time today, and got five shot groups of under an inch. Recoil was very moderate.

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