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Posted: 6/17/2002 11:36:15 AM EDT
I was at a local range yesterday and a guy was selling a pre-ban MAK-90 with an 80 rd. drum and a bunch of spare 30 rd. mags for $500. He says it is unfired and he bought it in 1992. It's got the thumbhole stock, but I believe I can change it to the pistol grip 'cause it was manufactured prior to the AWB 1994. Am I right?
I've been thinking about another AK, anyway. Is this a good deal?
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 11:42:44 AM EDT
I would say that $500 is somewhat higher than the gun is worth. Mak-90's sell for around $350 at gun shows here in Portland, OR. The mags are cheap($10-$15) but I don't know the price of a 75 round drum.

And when someone says the gun they are selling is 10 years old and is unfired, don't believe them.

You could offer him $300-$350. $500 is too much,IMHO.

Spambo
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 11:49:33 AM EDT
A buddy of mine just bought one in excellent condition with a scope, 800 rounds of ammo, 4 30 round mags, 2 10 round mags and a soft case for $300.00. But that was from a friend.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 12:11:00 PM EDT
Thanks guys,
I hate paying more than $300 for an AK, but I wasn't sure if the "pre-ban" made much of a difference in price. Pre/post ban on AKs is basically no difference unless the thing has a folding stock, IMHO. Who cares about a flash hider on an AK, anyway?
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 12:31:45 PM EDT
I'd go to the AK forum and ask those guys about the pre ban-post ban stuff regarding AK's. There was an 89 ban that effected imported rifles including AK's. Then there's the whole number of U.S. parts thing. It's a little tricky if your not well informed. I don't think the 94 ban is relevant unless it was legally in AW configuration at the time of the ban. I don't know if prior to the 94 ban you could change the number of imported parts to add pre ban features or not. It's all very confusing and I'm not sure anyone can give you a reliable answer.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 1:07:07 PM EDT
As the risk of raising the ire of armchair firearm law legal beagles, there is no such animal as a "pre-ban" MAK90. A MAK90 would not need the thumbhole stock for compliance if it were preban! Mak90s are postban.

That said, you CAN convert a MAK90 legally to pistol grip configuration with a US made pistol grip and the three fire control group parts to get the proper US parts count, and you can keep the existing handguards. OR, install a US made stockset for 3 parts, and a US hammer or trigger for the fourth part. I converted a MAK90 to pistol grip configuration using some maple dimension lumber I had in the shop and fashioned a stock and handguards with it, and used a cheap black US-made plastic SAR pistol grip off the trader, and added a Gordon Technologies double-hook FCG.

As far as the $$$ on the weapon and magazines, MAK90s go for $350 here too, the drum for maybe $75 to $120 depending on who's asking, and the 30s run about $8 to $15, again depending on who's asking. As priced at $500, no great deal. IMO, $350 is too much to pay for a MAK90 and then spend another $125 to $150 for a US stock set and FCG just to make compliance. If I were not able to make my own stockset and document it in digital pix, I would not have bought the $325 MAK90 that I did. All told, I don't have $360 in it.

Again, NO such thing as a preban MAK90. There were some post 89 and pre 94 Chinese AKs that were converted to butthole stock configuration after the 94 thing went into effect, but those usually have muzzle threads and are the exception.

Noah
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 2:13:31 PM EDT
as noah said: all mak 90's are post ban. the 90 stands for 1990 the year after the 89 assault weapons ban and the year it was modified with
the butthole stock. at least find one with the romanian druganov stock which is skeletonized and looks a lot nicer. i paid $289 for my ak but that was 5 years ago.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 2:49:50 PM EDT
MAK90s go for about $400 on average. If you can get one for a little less than that you are doing well.

However the 80 rd drum alone is worth close to $100 and the fact that he is throwing in a bunch of 30 rounders and it is brand new makes it a good deal if you ask me.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 2:58:10 PM EDT
I paid $139 a piece for mine back when I got them, about 7 years ago. See them at shows for around $350 to $400 now.

I also paid $3 a piece for 30 round clips. Should have bought a butt load.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 3:24:28 PM EDT
The Mak90 is one of the best AK around IMHO. They are way better than the Sars and Bulgarians AKs. The fit, finish and accuracy is way better. I paid $325 for mine a couple of years ago and absolutely love it!! Some people will always tell me I paid to much for it but I disagree as it is very reliable, decently accurate and a sheer pleasure to shoot.

75 rnd drums I see going for around $100, mags about $8 each. If the condition is LNIB I would personnally buy it and not look back. You will love this rifle and never want to get rid of it.

BTW, my Mak90 is chambered in .223 and is alot more accurate than the 7.62x39 AKs. However, my mags are alot more expensive.

Sgtar15
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 5:20:40 PM EDT
I have to agree that it was a nice weapon from a fit and finish standpoint, but the darn thing would not group worth a hoot. There was no damage to the crown, but he best it would do is about 5 or 6 MOA. My SARs, WASRs and SLR-95 all shoot groups at most half of that. I ended up selling it because of the lousy groups with Wolf, Barnaul, Klimovsk, Ulyanovsk, Norinco steel core, no matter.

IMO, the Bulgarian has the edge in accuracy, fit and finish, but the machined receiver is also heavier.

Noah
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 5:48:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/17/2002 5:49:44 PM EDT by retrodog]

all mak 90's are post ban. the 90 stands for 1990 the year after the 89 assault weapons ban and the year it was modified with
the butthole stock. at least find one with the romanian druganov stock which is skeletonized and looks a lot nicer. i paid $289 for my ak but that was 5 years ago.

Actually there are two bans that impact the MAK-90. The 89 ban was against the importation of the AK-47. As a result of this and specific other models named in that ban, many of the manufacturers changed the design somewhat (it varied by model/company) and continued producing something.

Well the ban was subsequently considered ineffective as many of the weapons it was written to stop found a naming convention "loophole" to avoid the problem. In the category of the AK, the Modified AK for 1990 was created (MAK-90). Now at the time there was no real legal reason to convert over to the thumbhole stock. They did that to try and please the liberals and make it different enough to justify a new model number and continue sending them here. It worked for a while. The ban of 94 was written differently. It pretty much stopped them in their tracks with limits on foriegn parts percentages (or something like that) and listing combinations of "evil" features. Hmmm...

I think the whole idea of converting one is tricky. If you plan on making it like a postban AR (only the pistol grip as the one "evil" feature) then you are probably okay, since that would still comply with the 94 ban. If, on the other hand, you are planning on that and a flash supressor and other "evil" features then you may be opening the door for problems. The earlier suggestion to check it out with the AK guys is your best bet.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 6:20:06 PM EDT
A comment on the advice that sgtar15 gave you. If he has a .233 Norinco he most likely has a model 84S. The 84S was a much better made AK than the MAK-90. Heaver gauge metal and better finish. A lot more accurate. Most of the MAC-90s that I've seen or had have shot OK but were not finished or made all that well.

Also, be careful when buying a thumbhole to convert. Most of them have an angle cut at the rear of the receiver. You can not put on a normal AK stock.

With a 75 round drum (which may or may not work) you should not pay more than $400. $350 would be more like it. As everybody said, there is no such thing as a "pre-ban" MAC-90. If it was preban it would just say Norinco. MAC stands for "Modified AK". Modified to meet the ban.

If you never had one they are fun to shoot. However, they aren't all that accurate and that thumbhold stock looks like crap.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 6:59:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/17/2002 7:00:39 PM EDT by retrodog]
Adendum to previous post:

If you want a good stock that handles well and there are no questions about, I suggest the synthetic "dragonov" type. I've put it on both of my MAK-90s. It handles about as good as a pistol stock and is very strong with that extra lower part. A very good way to go.
Link Posted: 6/17/2002 9:40:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Flash66:
A comment on the advice that sgtar15 gave you. If he has a .233 Norinco he most likely has a model 84S. The 84S was a much better made AK than the MAK-90.



Acually it is a Mak90 and is marked as such. It was built in 1990, as per the serial number, so it may be an intermitint variety as it does have a threaded cap at the muzzle end.

Sgtar15
Link Posted: 6/18/2002 3:03:38 AM EDT
I am going to throw my vote in for the MAK as being one of the best AK variants I have come across. It is possible to find some MAK's that came with the straight back receiver so finding replacement stocks would be easier to come by. I need to come to your area for MAK's if they are going for $350.
Link Posted: 6/18/2002 10:15:59 AM EDT
My MAK-90s say "Norinco" on the side and were $140. That was right before Clinton did his thing though. I bought them in July of 94. They were new and fresh off the boat (they are stamped 94, or maybe engraved). Anway, I can remember thinking, "Wow, this is $100 cheaper than the AK-47s used to cost. What a deal."
Link Posted: 6/18/2002 10:22:15 AM EDT

Originally Posted By VA-gunnut:
I am going to throw my vote in for the MAK as being one of the best AK variants I have come across. It is possible to find some MAK's that came with the straight back receiver so finding replacement stocks would be easier to come by. I need to come to your area for MAK's if they are going for $350.



My MAK 90 falls into that category. It has a straight cut reciever and a threaded muzzle. I bought it NIB in '93.
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