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Posted: 4/26/2002 8:53:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/26/2002 9:19:08 PM EDT by sulaco]
The FAB10 is a well-made AR15 replacement of the oppressed masses in CA. The Price of the FAB10 is steep at $170 wholesale price but they do guarantee fit and finish. I put 200 rounds <140 wolf, 60 PMC>though my FAB10 at the range last weekend, with the help of a few friends . With the magazine filled to 10 rounds the FAB10 jammed twice near the end of the day, it could have been a number of things so I won’t think much of it. The bolt alone would barely move by the end of the day so I think it’s time to find some cleaner burring ammo.

Overall I would recommend the FAB10 to any Californian that found themselves in the same predicament as myself, finally saying I was going to buy an AR15 and found out that I couldn’t buy one any more.

Basic FAB10 info and improvements I could think of…
* magazine is riveted in
* no bolt catch mechanism <don’t really need one in the FAB10 anyways, it would just get in the way>
* constructed tight but well built
* The trigger guard isn’t cut all the way, so there is no gap that you can get a blister with…
* rear takedown detent and the selector detent holes both are threaded and caped. This is useful if you want to use the fab10 w/o a pistol grip<why you would want to do this I don’t know>.
* anodized finish would have matched my stock/upper but this finish they use is fine.

Here are two pictures from our range trip – we had so much fun that we nearly forgot to take pictures before we ran out of ammo.

My FAB10


Me using my FAB10

Side note: never wear white pants to a dirt-covered range; stains are a pain to take out of white close.

- Sulaco
Link Posted: 4/26/2002 10:12:52 PM EDT
That range looks familiar, is it the glass factory near Santa Barbara?
Link Posted: 4/26/2002 10:20:00 PM EDT
hehe...
yup that’s the glass factory all right
It’s a great little range, just takes about 30 minutes to get to it from Santa Barbara. So HvyAR, you live near SB or just visited a few times?
- Sulaco
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 12:50:01 AM EDT
I'm getting tempted to spend some money [:\]
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 9:56:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/27/2002 10:01:01 AM EDT by misterhemi]
I've been eyeing one of those myself. I do have some ARs but thought it would be fun to play with.

Here is my idea:

1)Get one with a letter from the manufacturer stating that it has NEVER been assembled into a rifle.

2)Since you can order custom serial numbers get one like:
PHUK-SB23,
SB23SUX,
AHOLE-DP,
etc.....

3)Get a pistol kit.

4)Have fun with my new project
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 10:07:31 AM EDT
Here is a link for those in the Los Angeles area:

www.redstarmuseum.com/fab10.shtml

He is located in Culver City.
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 12:58:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/27/2002 1:00:18 PM EDT by Skammy]
misterhemi
I had the same idea as using it as a pistol a few days ago

but the only thing I was wondering about was the approved pistol list

I think I will wait on the FAB-10 though, I'd like .308 version..
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 2:03:08 PM EDT
I heard these things are on backorder, since a lot of people are ordering them. I placed my deposit last week, and should be getting mine around mid may. I plan on throwing on a collapsible stock and a pre ban m4gery style upper. And its all legal since the gun has a fixed magazine (though i prefer it wasnt =oT)
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 3:23:20 PM EDT
sulaco
that looks like a nice shooting spot you got there, so its just the reciever that you buy and then you put it all together?
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 3:33:03 PM EDT
Wow...so is this my answer to not being able to buy an AR??

I am a total 'newbie' when it comes to rifles so any help would be great! If I buy this, what else would I need to buy and where can I buy it so that I can have the closest thing to an ar that is still legal in CA. I wouldn't need to register it then right?
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 3:59:48 PM EDT
They are a hot item, after you send in the order it probably won’t ship for 20+ days. Hears there site. The FAB10 is just a stripped lower receiver, you still need the upper/stock/lower parts kit. You load the FAB10 by pushing in the takedown pin and opening up the unit as if you were going to take the bolt carriage out to clean it. With the upper opened up, you simply fill up the magazine and close it back together again.

I would suggest getting the lower parts kit installed at the time of ordering your FAB10, getting a bushmaster M4 upper was my next choice over RRA<an extra $200> – every now and then I regret not getting it . The price on your build will very but this is what I spent.

Here are the costs for this project:
RRA Parts: $600.00 shipped
* lower Parts Kit
* 16” mid-length hand guards pre-ban upper
* 6 position telescoping stock
* tactical side swivel
* Tactical sling <not installed in pictures, I have temporarily misplaced some parts from it…>

FAB10: $250 out the door
* FAB10 lower, striped

tw1112 this is completely CA legal, and it isn’t considered an Assault Weapon so no registration required. Convincing you local FFL may take a little bit of work but well worth the effort. It’s a fun little rifle, just won’t load nearly as fast as if it were a magazine based rifle – but what can you do.

- Sulaco
Link Posted: 4/27/2002 4:06:20 PM EDT
They should mount a 30rder on it just so it has the look of a normal AR I don't like the way it looks without a big mag.
looks kinda expensive, but a good way to get around the ban.
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 2:46:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 8:07:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Troy:
Originally Posted By 1911greg:
They should mount a 30rder on it



That would be illegal.

If it was a fixed mag? It might be illegal for hunting....
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 8:35:59 AM EDT
A mixed blessing:

I just picked mine up from M & N Armory in Fremont. I paid for it at a gunshow in February. I wasn't happy that I had to wait two months. I wasn't happy that he charged me nearly $500 with sales tax for a built lower (I know I could've built it myself--I've built at least a half dozen and my personal best for assembling a stripped upper and lower into a functioning rifle is 1:17:34), but I've made it my goal in life to support the endangered California Gun Dealer*.

It was explained to me that the back order was due to a switch to a new CNC machine. Programming had to be done, lost and redone. Tooling was refined, yada, yada, yada.

I was told that the manufacturer uses Bushmaster forged receiver blanks. And because he originally makes high performance engine parts, he is a strict believer in keeping the tolerances tight.

Friday I finally made a call and found out the lower was in. I wasn't real happy that I paid that much money, waited that long and didn't get a courtesy call.

My major complaint is that the finish sucks. Baked engine enamel is no replacement for a good hard anodized finish. My second complaint is that some of the tolerances are a little too tight: fitting my Colt 14" M-4 upper was a slight chore as I worked the pivot and take down pins into their closed positions.

The first can be fixed by spending more money to have it refinished. The second is a matter of time for steel pins to "break in" the aluminum.

* Has anyone else noticed a decline in the number of gunshops? In Northern California, specifically the South SF Bay Area, I've seen two out of eight shops close down in the last year and a half.
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 10:09:52 AM EDT

Originally Posted By sulaco:
hehe...
yup that’s the glass factory all right
It’s a great little range, just takes about 30 minutes to get to it from Santa Barbara. So HvyAR, you live near SB or just visited a few times?
- Sulaco



I haven't been there in about 2-3 years. I used to go there every other week, but that was 10-12 years ago. I also went to the Winchester Gun Club off of West Camino Cielo. The drive was too much for my vehicle's trans and suspension, so now I go to ASR.
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 11:42:19 AM EDT
Can't hav a fixed mag over 10 rounds, it was part of the ban. That's why SKS with a 20 round fixed magazine was deemed illegal, you gotta keep it 10 rounds or less.
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 11:56:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/28/2002 12:43:14 PM EDT by LngBchAR15]
L&G weaponry offers simliar or same lower. www.faxworldcom.com/lgweap/.
Don't know if their product is any different from Redstarmuseum's FAB10. Can I build pistol out of this FAB10 lower? I think there is weight limit set by ATF so I guess I can't. If someone knows,
please let me know. I already own a postban AR15 so I get high cap mag but I don't get evil features such as flash suppressor, bayonet lug, and collapsible stock. Oh well. But way to go! I'm really happy for the return of AR type weapon in Kalifornia.
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 12:26:10 PM EDT
The weight limit does not count since it does not have a detachable mag... The only thing im wondering about is the handgun certification...
Link Posted: 4/28/2002 12:51:58 PM EDT
caag.state.ca.us/firearms/dwcl/12125.htm Keyword seems to be "capable of being concealed." LOL, how do u conceal AR type pistol? Someone please submit FAB10 pistol for certification and let me know the outcome. caag.state.ca.us/firearms/labcert.htm Then I'll buy it
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 3:30:36 PM EDT
ive been tossing the idea around building one into a pistol the prob for me is im broke :(
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 4:18:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By talbalos:
* Has anyone else noticed a decline in the number of gunshops? In Northern California, specifically the South SF Bay Area, I've seen two out of eight shops close down in the last year and a half.



Eddy's Sport Shop just closed in Mountain View last month. That leaves me with one in San Carlos and one in San Bruno on the north peninsula. I ranted enough yesterday about powder at $30 a pound, so I'll shut up. Still, not surprising with prices the way they are.

Ahhh...Idaho...2 months off.

-hanko
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 10:09:33 PM EDT
Would it be possible to convert this rifle into a more useful configuration (say, in case the owner moves to an area outside of Cali)?

Link Posted: 5/7/2002 10:03:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/7/2002 10:07:43 AM EDT by WSmac]
One bit of information that seems to be lacking when someone posts about the FAB10; you have the spoon to fix to the lower each time you reload. The spoon has a post brazed on which fits into a hole where the bolt-hold-open slot would go.
What's needed now is a stripper clip with spoon built in, and a quick-release lever for the rear takedown pin.
I've talked with some gunshop owners in Southern Oregon and Northern California (the REAL Northern Cal - Humboldt/Del Norte counties ) and for the most part, the Oregon folks kinda shake their heads, while the California folks get all bug-eyed.
They rant on about how folks will be getting arrested, weapons confiscated, jail, etc.
It really is sad to see respectable people act so terrified of their own government.
A couple of the Ca. folks actually liked the idea.
Edited to note: NO ONE'S HEARD OF THIS except us. I will keep taking mine around to gunshops as part of my personal firearms education plan.
...Now, if they would only allow these in Highpower matches...
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