Anyone use this? How is it?

Basically the predecessor to the AKA2.

I actually didn't hate the Norotos proprietary mounting system, and used it for a while, simple and easy to use, and low profile. The TATM can also be used with a Universal interface adapter.

TATM is a good mount if you can get one cheap, but has been superseded by later mounts.

In comparison to the AKA2, it doesn't have an "intermediate" stowed position, and consequently, the TATM will stow mounted NVDs extremely high on your head--really leans into the whole "Rhino mount" thing.

The TATM also uses the "Legacy"-style shoe adjustment with fine teeth for the different eye relief settings, rather than the "infinite adjustment" design on the AKA2 and later mounts. This also means that you cannot really practically switch between a dovetail TATM and a USGI bayonet TATM, and they have two different arm lengths as well, the Short Arm (dovetail), and Long Arm (bayonet).

The TATM also has the "classic" Norotos worm-dial elevation adjustment, which some people prefer because they feel they can get a finer adjustment, but I find rather annoying compared to "on the fly" elevation adjustments--Norotos has since switched to "on the fly" elevation on most of their newer mounts, including the RHNO II and most of their "Hyper" mounts.

Still, it's a good and serviceable mount that might not be the current "top of the line," but is still head and shoulders above the Legacy Rhino, and probably the cheapest entry into push-button mounts (versus Force-to-Overcome), which I prefer. I still have both my SA and LA TATMs for a loaner helmet with an old-school Norotos one hole shroud.

~Augee

The newer TATMs have a middle stow position too just like AKA2. Fine mount but little on the heavy side. For it's price as used though it's great.

Interesting, never saw one with the middle position added, but it definitely was a good call to add it in later production and to the AKA2. Stowing a set of binos on the TATM without the middle position could feel like you grew a two foot tall horn.

~Augee

Very true Given that, the middle position does strain your neck a bit I feel, so it's not a perfect solution either. I haven't had the luxury of trying out the new Hyper mounts from Norotos, they probably aren't as protrusive but given the options here I prefer something with a little less of a horn-like appearance like the G24.

I could get a norotos with the dovetail for <<$100, or rhino ii with dovetail for about 100.  Would use with pvs14+ wilcox dovetail j arm or norotos DUAL dovetail adapter.  

Main goal is getting dovetail to get rid of bayonet wobble.

Which of the two would you guys take?

Or should I go another direction?

ETA - people say the g24 is the best but I really don't want to spend $400

Personally I like the bayonet Rhino II for a monocular and don't mind the slight wobble. Simple, lightweight, foolproof to use in the dark.

Beware that Norotos & Wilcox have different shaped & sized dovetails so it's best to use mounting accessories from a single manufacturer. If you decide to go with the TATM then I'd recommend the Norotos DDA with it. Wilcox dovetail is smaller and you may run into wobbles with a TATM + Wilcox arm combination.

From memory the Rhino II is considerably lighter than a TATM and depending on your use it might make a difference. With a helmet it's probably fine, but I find a TATM on a Crye Nightcap to be way too front heavy.

The Rhino & TATM (short arm) have have different arm lever lengths and I have not used the dovetail version of the Rhino so cannot comment on that. It does have good range of height adjustment though so it could be a non-issue.

They both have vertical adjustment

The T(itanium)ATM is that much heavier than the rhino 2 ti? The tatm looks smaller from pix, which is all i have seen.

I'd be using it on a bump helmet

Rhino II - 170g
TATM - 190g

With my super accurate kitchen scale.

As soon as I picked them on hand I was surprised they didn't feel that much different, but their weight distribution must be very different because the TATM really does feel front heavy. I absolutely prefer the Rhino II on the Nightcap, the difference is that a mono & Rhino is pretty much unnoticeable even without a counterweight but with the TATM it feels as something is pulling the whole contraption forward & down.

Haven't used the TATM on a bump due to not ever having one with mounting compatible with it. I have the Norotos proprietary shroud & mounting plate and haven't bothered upgrdading the TATM to fit into the universal shrouds.

If I needed to decide with what I have experienced I might lean towards a dovetail Rhino II, but that'd be partly a blind decision. There sure is something different with their weight distribution - probably the TATM has it's center of gravity more forwards plus the added 20 grams.

Edit2: While holding the two mounts between two fingers from the middle of the mounting plate the TATM has a significantly stronger moment and tries to turn downward while the Rhino II is easy to hold still. Measured this way it feels like the TATM weighs a lot more. Balancing them between two fingers is a bit hard for determining the COG, but just the first test shows my observations head mounted are based on something at least.

Edit:
I am stealing @marvthehamster picture from the Helmet rig thread, but here's what I meant with the arm length. Notice how far up he needed to adjust the dovetail Rhino II. Not that it's a problem, but the range of adjustment due to the arm length is in practice less than with a mount that was designed for dovetail in the first place. Still though, personally I would still go with a mount with the least weight & closest to helmet center of gravity. That plus the Rhino II "analog" adjustments are nice.

My personal preference is for the TATM over the RHNO II, but if it doesn't already have the universal shroud adapter plate installed, that may cut into your savings.

The reason I prefer the TATM is that I strongly prefer push-button mounts to FTO mounts, as well as the right-side tilt control, but those things are all very much a matter of personal preference.

I prefer push-button mounts, among other things, they don't have the same "snap" and "whip" when moving them between stowed/deployed, and they're also easier to move between the two--FTO mounts can have... "personalities" about the amount of pressure they require to switch, and they don't really "lock" in either position, they're just held in place by detents, making them a bit... "springy" for me. A bad jolt (like a fall from a high place) with an FTO mount can also create an... unpleasant situation.

Of course, FTO mounts can prevent damage--both to the device, and to your neck because of this, but this is why I like "breakaway" features as well.

The right-side tilt adjustment I prefer as well, because, and I might be one of the rare people that does this, I tend to adjust the tilt of my NVDs fairly regularly, if I'm in a different position (e.g., prone from standing), mixed light environments, walking inclines or different types of terrain, etc. As I am right handed, I feel that the right-side tilt adjustments allow me to have a little bit more control for fine-tuning the tilt of the goggles. It takes my firing hand off the weapon, yes, but I just personally find it more comfortable to support the weapon's weight in my left hand, and do a quick fine-tune of the tilt with my right.

Right and left-side adjustments seem like a pretty minor thing, and perhaps they are--but when you're talking about operating things in complete darkness by feel alone "switchology," and what you prefer/are most comfortable with, can be a pretty big deal. Or at least a big enough deal for me that I like to take it into consideration.

Again, others might have different preferences, or just not really even think it's enough of an issue to be a valid decision criteria, I'm just letting you know why I would prefer the TATM of the two.

These small touches, are, however, why I still think that the Wilcox L4 G24 is still the best dovetail mount on the market--the Norotos LoSto PB comes close, having added things that bothered me with the AKA2 (on the fly elevation adjustment, breakaway feature, low[er] profile mount), but puts the controls on the opposite side of where I want them. Norotos' big "paddle" controls are, however, easier to use than the smaller control surfaces on the Wilcox mounts.

~Augee

I appreciate the detailed input, fellas.  I've been getting a lot of help from some friends... just got my first pvs14 this week and have a dbal single spectrum and wmlx ir/white en route...  I've gotten a lot of good advice so far, and my friends who are helping are saying "buy once, cry once" on the Mount etc...which is usually my philosophy but there is a big ass price difference between a rhino ii and dovetail J-arm off ebay and a g24 and dovetail j arm from TNVC... oh yeah I still need to buy a bump helmet, IR beacon, etc... but yeah, my buddies who are already in the NODs game are strongly in the dovetail camp.. I kinda wish I had just ordered an old used usgi rhino/shroud/arm package from flea bay for 50 bucks and bolted it to my snowboard helmet while figuring this stuff out...

...I need to get this thing on my head,

Also debated getting the PT bravo helmet from tnvc for a cheap bump option to save some coin... although it is somewhat less savings when you have to figure on adding a shroud (I'd find one used or use the one that comes with the rhino II, I imagine?... so

Head mount Options I have come up with

a) 60 for pt bravo helmet, 60 for rhino 2 off ebay, 30 for j arm would be my cheapest option - $150ish for pt bravo helmet, rhino 2 mount with bayonet j arm.

b) 80 for airsoft helmet with norotos shroud from buddy, plus 60 for rhino 2, plus 30 for j arm - $170 for airsoft ops core with rhino 2 and bayonet j arm

c) 80 for airsoft helmet with norotos shroud from buddy, 60 for rhino 2, 50 for aka2 dovetail, 140 for DDA from tnvc - $330 for airsoft ops core with rhino ii & dovetail

d) 60 for pt bravo or maybe airsoft ops core replica, 50-100 for tatm shroud, 75 for tatm, 140 for DDA -  $350ish for pt bravo bump and dovetail rhino

e) ops core fast bump 225, rhino ii bayo 60, usgi J arm 30 - $ 315 for real ops core bump, no dovetail mounting

f) ops core fast bump 225, rhino ii 60, aka2 dovetail 50, DDA 140 - $475 real ops core and dovetail rhino II

g) ops core fast bump 225, tatm 75, tatm conversion bracket 60, DDA 140 - $500 for ops core with tatm dovetail


I do like the dial tightening system... I have it on snowboard helmets and a bike helmet.  But if the PT bravo works well that could be OK too. Once you start adding mods and shrouds and rails etc to it, it's not a lot of savings over an ops core, but it has been in the wild for a long time, soooo???

Here's the PT bravo helmet link: https://tnvc.com/shop/pro-tec-bravo-half-shell-helmet/


.

ill be honest, i skimmed the article, but i did not see a downfall to the TATM.  if you use a MOD3, the release on the TATM sucks.  i did it a couple of times, never again.  i am using a couple of used AKA2's i got off ebay.  i use the TATMs and dual dovetail adapters for my MOD3 monocular adapters (with some very slight modification).

i exclusively use Norotos dovetail on all my NV stuff.  i didn't want to have two different mounting options.

IMO, get selection F or G.  but i think some people would suggest getting the 4D pads in the ops core helmet.  ive never felt them, but i hear they are pretty comfy.  i would scrounge around the EE or ebay (beware fakes!) and buy used, not abused.

Well yeah those are the best, but 2-3x as expensive  

I'm a noob to procuring this stuff, so trying to figure out if I buy the cheaper stuff- will I immediately regret it?  Is going dovetail immediately as necessary as my friends make it out to be?

To be honest, in your position, I would buy a real Ops Core Bump, and snag a used Legacy Rhino and J-Arm for around $30.

This will give you a) something to use while you save money for an L4 G24, and b) a good basis for comparison for how much better the L4 G24 is.

I know I'm fairly down on the Rhino, but I used them for almost a decade before upgrading, they do what they need to do--perhaps not ideally, but they'll do the job, and they're damn near free, again, it will give you a functional setup to use while you save up for a "top of the line" mount.

~Augee

you could buy a cheaper mount like a legacy Rhino like Augee said.  i had Rhino II's and bayonet j-arms and i was never happy with how floppy the j-arm was and how easily i could bump the release lever.  whatever you do, use a lanyard to secure your NVG to your helmet and use it every time!!

So a friend sold me a bump and a legacy rhino (gen 1 ) and j-arm for cheap to at least get me head mounted...  planning on upgrading mount to dovetail at some point but at least I have my foot in the door, and a point of reference. Mount and j arm were basically free

Good choice. If it's a airsoft bump make sure everything is attached properly. I once had one which was otherwise a pretty good copy, but I felt the shroud screws could come through the shell if give an impact of some sort. Did not end up using it, but anyway, it would've worked for something to begin with.

It is an airsoft bump, but has a real norotos universal shroud bolted on.

Rhino II off of fleabay for $57. Regular j arm $20.

Does all you need fairly well with a single tube. Sure you could go Wilcox.  Just depends on if you want to drop all of that money for cool points. Nothing wrong with that if you do.

Nvm. Just saw you already got a legacy.

I know some have issues with wobble but I don’t have nearly any with my rhino II.

You guys do know you can tighten and loosen up the screws on the rhino mounts if they are sloppy or too tight right?

i like using it on my loaner setup because the knob to take off the nod from the dovetail is a bitch so my newbie friends don't drop my stuff,

I'm gonna pick up a rhino deuce soon

The adjustability of the rhino 2 works well for me. The height and eye relief adjustments are maxed out on mine but doesn’t seem to pose an issue. As Others have stated, the dovetail adapter is a nice addition though I wouldn’t say it’s a necessity. I got one because my bridge mount is dovetail. If I was only running a mono I’d probably be fine with the bayonet mount. Put a bungee on it and wiggle problem solved.  

Augee, i accept PayPal or USPS money order for payment of photo royalties ;)

I think you're looking for murtis.

~Augee

Touché. Better brush up on that attention to detail thing. Maybe Murtis has more cash for royalty payments anyway.....

That's a big maybe, wouldn't count too much on it. That plus we pay yearly "media tax" here already and in my head that counts towards the usage of your pics too