Genius owner of fn57sale.com Youtubes himself making illegal PS90 SBRs - Page 1

Armory » General NFA Questions

Site Notices

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Genius owner of fn57sale.com Youtubes himself making illegal PS90 SBRs

Posted: 9/28/2017 11:12:30 AM EDT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9b8cYjLLJw

Fan-fucking-tastic.

Posted: 9/28/2017 11:23:19 AM EDT

[#1]

How do you know they're illegal? Guy could be a manufacturer SOT, or have a stamp for every one he showed himself making.

Posted: 9/28/2017 11:26:32 AM EDT

[#2]

Because he's in the comment section on the video arguing that these aren't SBRs, and generally demonstrating no knowledge of NFA regs.

Posted: 9/28/2017 11:34:59 AM EDT

[#3]

TYFYS

Posted: 9/28/2017 11:41:09 AM EDT

[#4]

Comments section is

Or the guy is an ATF agent / troll / CI.

Posted: 9/28/2017 2:19:21 PM EDT

[#5]

Quote History

Quoted:
Comments section is

View Quote

Agree. He said he measured the barrel with a tape measure, and didn't understand the dowel to bolt face method. He also said he's going to contact the ATF himself for clarification, that should make it easy on them.

Posted: 9/28/2017 3:40:52 PM EDT

[#6]

How to: Remove PS90 Barrel Shroud in 2 minutes without stripping threads!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9b8cYjLLJw

here it is.

Posted: 9/28/2017 6:43:16 PM EDT

[#7]

Yea, doesnt seem like he knows pinning is required for the OAL just as with the 16" barrel length. Not that i've ever seen a ATF agent checking permanent attachment meathods at the range, it would be wise of him to just drill a hole on one side and pin it like the factory shroud was.

Posted: 9/29/2017 12:19:09 AM EDT

[#8]

Forget the legality of it...no way I'd trust a "gunsmith" that doesn't know if he's drilling parallel or perpendicular, or if he has a 1/8" or 1/16" bit.

Posted: 9/29/2017 11:28:15 PM EDT

[#9]

As Far as all of us who bought the HTA shrouds are aware, the ATF said they're Kosher. But I'm sure some JA will write the ATF asking for an opinion on them. Yes the barrel length of the PS90 is 16", but the OAL is under 26" if the barrel were just 16". The OEM shroud could be pinned the way it is, because the added flash hider is pinned in it to meet the OAL. With the HTA shroud attached, you are over 26". The gun is not designed and won't work without a shroud in place.. Even a second place sells the shroud now.. Seeing how the ATF claims a stockless 10/22 ruger is a SBR, they might already be looking :O

https://www.imperialarmsco.com/product-p/fbs01.htm

Posted: 9/30/2017 8:32:02 AM EDT

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:
The gun is not designed and won't work without a shroud in place..

View Quote

True that it's not designed to, nor will it work properly... but it will fire a single round... which is a technicality when it comes to the legal issues.

Buffman, the barrel without the shroud measures 16" to the bolt face? Some were saying it was 14.8" or something. I don't have a non sbr barrel to measure anymore.

Posted: 9/30/2017 11:56:42 AM EDT

[#11]

Quote History

Quoted:
As Far as all of us who bought the HTA shrouds are aware, the ATF said they're Kosher. But I'm sure some JA will write the ATF asking for an opinion on them. Yes the barrel length of the PS90 is 16", but the OAL is under 26" if the barrel were just 16". The OEM shroud could be pinned the way it is, because the added flash hider is pinned in it to meet the OAL. With the HTA shroud attached, you are over 26". The gun is not designed and won't work without a shroud in place.. Even a second place sells the shroud now.. Seeing how the ATF claims a stockless 10/22 ruger is a SBR, they might already be looking :O

https://www.imperialarmsco.com/product-p/fbs01.htm

View Quote

Not ATF.

Posted: 9/30/2017 3:05:30 PM EDT

[#12]

Quote History

Quoted:

True that it's not designed to, nor will it work properly... but it will fire a single round... which is a technicality when it comes to the legal issues.

Buffman, the barrel without the shroud measures 16" to the bolt face? Some were saying it was 14.8" or something. I don't have a non sbr barrel to measure anymore.

View Quote

Without the shroud, the barrel is absolutely NOT 16" and the OAL is NOT 26". It's true that the rifle needs a shroud to cycle, but it could fire once without the shroud. And as shown in the video, once the threaded shroud is installed, it can be removed again by hand at any time, and could be replaced with a a shroud that is shorter.

The replacement shroud is the same length as the factory one. I think it's obvious that FN is pinning the factory shroud because they know it would be an SBR otherwise. Without that, there's no reason they would take the manufacturing step of pinning the factory shroud. The design of the receiver prevents the shroud from loosening, so pinning has no other rationale than NFA compliance.

Posted: 10/1/2017 1:19:59 AM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:

Without the shroud, the barrel is absolutely NOT 16" and the OAL is NOT 26". It's true that the rifle needs a shroud to cycle, but it could fire once without the shroud. And as shown in the video, once the threaded shroud is installed, it can be removed again by hand at any time, and could be replaced with a a shroud that is shorter.

The replacement shroud is the same length as the factory one. I think it's obvious that FN is pinning the factory shroud because they know it would be an SBR otherwise. Without that, there's no reason they would take the manufacturing step of pinning the factory shroud. The design of the receiver prevents the shroud from loosening, so pinning has no other rationale than NFA compliance.

View Quote

Would you like to place a wager on how long the barrel is? It's OVER 16". Whoever said it's 14.8" is FULL OF POO. If they measure from the breach face with the rod down the tube, it would even be over the tape measure length, I just went downstairs and measured..

You can't remove the shroud once installed without tools. You need a a 15mm wrench..
So begs the question which I can't find on the net. Has the ATF ever said what does and doesn't count in the OAL requirement of a rifle. As above the 16" barrel requirement is met. I recall the M1A bullpups installing a 2" buttpad to meet the OAL requirement. HTA shroud is longer than factory (only 1/16"). FN perhaps pinned it to keep the honest people honest? I'll see if HTA has a response..

Posted: 10/1/2017 9:08:32 AM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:
Would you like to place a wager on how long the barrel is? It's OVER 16". Whoever said it's 14.8" is FULL OF POO. If they measure from the breach face with the rod down the tube, it would even be over the tape measure length, I just went downstairs and measured..
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4392/36698762334_b4c52f5bd8_z.jpg

You can't remove the shroud once installed without tools. You need a a 15mm wrench..
So begs the question which I can't find on the net. Has the ATF ever said what does and doesn't count in the OAL requirement of a rifle. As above the 16" barrel requirement is met. I recall the M1A bullpups installing a 2" buttpad to meet the OAL requirement. HTA shroud is longer than factory (only 1/16"). FN perhaps pinned it to keep the honest people honest? I'll see if HTA has a response..

View Quote

Problem solved.

The only issue being OAL, there really isn't a question then. Removable and adjustable length stocks are measured as part of OAL installed and extended to their furthest length. Would only be logical that the same would be said for devices on the other end.