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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Getting A C&R (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/24/2004 9:12:12 AM EDT
| I'm looking into investing in a type 003 FFL, since my tastes run into the C&R types anyway. I just had a couple questions. I've looked at cruffler.com and downloaded the ATF form. For some reason I can't e-mail them though. I wanted to ask if I need any other form, or just the one. Also, I'm attending school out of my state of residence. Can I get and use my C&R here, or only in my home state? Also, would I need to send a copy of the paperwork to the CLEO here, or at home? And one more: what happens if I purchase a C&R piece or two, and find out I don't like them? Can I sell them to another individual without getting a visit from the ATF? I may not like all the laws out there, but I will abide by them. Thanks |
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You need 2 forms the missing form is a statement that you are a citizen. Copy of you app goes to your local CLEO for INFORMATIONAL purposes only (who will probably dump it). It's a national license but you may have state laws that impact your C&R use. I'm currently selling a C&R makarov here on the EE. The deal is you can sell stuff but only to enhance your collection. Not as a for profit BUSINESS. |
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The ATF has always been sort of vague about just what is the number of guns you can sell without being prosectuted. If you make it look like you got a collector's license in order to sell guns you may well get in trouble. No quid pro quo is allowed. Dennis Jenkins
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Yup it very vague...You can make a profit as a byproduct of buying wisely and selling to enhance you collectables but I just try to break even or so and buy new things. That why I'm selling the Mak. There are still some deals on SKS' out there to if your interested. |
Sound like it would be OK w/the Feds...Remember all state and local laws must be abided by. Wait until UPS delivers your 1st handgun to your door. A real HOOT! And remember to look for a Colt Sistema. They getting scarce along w/Soviet Military and E German Makarovs. |
Mostly it's my brother or brother-in-law seeing/shooting one of my new C&R guns and wanting one of their own. I've been wanting a Colt Sistema and a Makarov, and a CZ-52. There's just never enough cash to buy all of the toys I want. |
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Buy five of the same gun, keep the best and sell the rest. A legal way to enhance a collection. Or so I have been told ;) Seriously, do not get a C&R to make money, they are strictly for maxing out credit cards. There have been a few folk down here in missouri busted recently for unlawful firearm transactions and I think some were C&R guys. PS, once you are the proud owner of a C&R weapon you can later transfer it to yourself and then dispose of it anyway you want, I.E. sell it off. The big thing here is intent, if you are obviously running a C&R "business" then you are taking chances. The occasional transfer/sell will not get you into trouble. BTW, the BATF will never know where your firearms unless you get audited. You are the sole possessor of your book (Exceptions being if your state requires whatever form of registration) and which the BATF will never even look at unless you are audited. |
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The aquisition and disposition log (bound book)does not have an area for how much you paid or how much you sold it for. You could have bought (aquired) a rifle for $100.00 dollars and sold it (disposed) for $1000.00 dollars. The BATF&E is not interested in "how much" but is this being done to "enhance" your collection or to "supplement" your income? Therefore (as I interpret the regs) I could "aquire" 20 firearms keep the best and "dispose" of the remaining pieces. As long as there are no known violations in state (particular to your area) or federal laws you may "dispose" of those pieces to whom you wish. Personally I would use the "03" it as it was intended. The initial cost is so cheap (much less than a night out with the wife or girlfriend). It is worth the investment. Unfortunately, no matter how hard you try there is always another piece you "just gotta have":) As far as the CLEO in your area, make a copy of the application and mail it to him/her. If you go there personally they might get really confused. If you really need to, you can send it "return receipt". It's not necessary though. If your state requires a special local "pre-application" make sure you do this first before you send the Federal application in. Have Fun! |
| Okay some more questions: How do C&Rs factor into a total firearm count for the "arsenal license?" I've been out of the loop recently, but last time I checked, if you had 20 or more "firearms" you had to get a special arsenal license from BATF. Is this the case? Are C&Rs not considered "normal firearms?" Can I say that my home residence is my college address, and then fill out a change of address form when I go "home," or is it based off of my official state/location of residency (where I vote, get a CWP, and where Selective Services sends draft information?) Someone who knows, please fill me in. |
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Where do you live that has an "arsenal license"? Dennis Jenkins
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I think currently the "arsenal license" is pretty much a joke that was going around. I know some people who have literally hundreds of just M39 Finns. Not to say that there isn't some obscure place in the USA that has some screwy law like that. Dennis Jenkins
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Just sent mine in today, and I am looking forward to getting a $45 M44 Mosin Nagant!. Hmm, might need another Sistema Colt, and a 1912 Steyr-Hahn to match my existing one, and.... Damn, and I swore I would stop once I could arm a squad. Oh well, platoons aren't THAT big!  Dawg |
I mailed my paperwork today too. We shall see. Yes i also checked alot of those sights listed in the tacked post. hmmm SKS at cddn sounds good too.... |
| I just dropped my application in the mailbox today. I am eagerly anticipating it. A bit nervous about the ATF interview that seems to happen with NY residents, mostly cause I have no idea what to expect, and well, it's big scary gubment. I imagine that will go smoothly though, I can't wait! |
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Hey! Could take anywhere from 30-90 days. I've read posts where people claim they received theirs in a couple of weeks. Took 45 days for mine. You will receive the info/books before you get the license. The license usually follows about a week later. In the mean time, make a list of all the dealers that you will send copies of your 03 too. Go to the post office and get alot of stamps and envelopes. If you don't have a copier, go out and make a couple of dozen copies of your FFL (unsigned). Draft a short intro letter to include with your copy, for example: To whom It May Concern: Enclosed you will find a signed copy of my Curio & Relic License. Please add my information to your files for future purchases of eligible firearms and or ammunition. I would also appreciate if you could add me to your mailing list. If available, a copy of your current sales flyer/catalog would be greatly appreciated. Looking forward to doing business with you in the future. Sincerely, Your Name Address tel # You won't get a written "confirmation" concerning your FFL from the dealers. Normally during their next mailing they will send you a sales flyer. After about two weeks you can call them to see if your info was added to their files. Have Fun! p.s. Get a part time job, you'll need it! |
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Just a suggestion for you guys who are waiting for your license to arrive. Look at the dealers list and start getting your envelopes addressed. Maybe do 2 or 3 a night. That way once your license arrives all you have to do is make some copies, sign the copies, stuff em in the envelopes, and send them off. This is a whole lot easier than waiting till the license arrives and having to address 50 envelopes. Within 30 days you should be getting all kinds of fliers & catalogs. I also keep a list of the dealers who have my license in my bound book. That way if I spot a deal I can know right away if they have my license copy on file. |
I'll get started tonight on that.............Thanks |
How do you find out the dealer prices at Brownells? Do they send you a catalog w/dealer pricing when you send them your FFL? Dawg |
Sign up for an account. Then, once you have the account, there's a page you can go to and andd your FFL. once you ad your FFL number, it shows the normal price and the dealer price. Definitly makes their prices a bit more reasonable. |
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Beware!!! New address for C&R Applications I had a question about which forms to use for a C&R, so I called the BATF. The lady I spoke with gave me an address in Atlanta to send my application, and told me the Dallas address is no longer used eventhough it is still on the applications. She mailed the 2 forms to my house, although I had already printed and mailed my forms off the Internet. In the envelope from the BATF with the forms is a notice that as of July 1, 2003 the new address to send your application is ATF P.O. Box 409567 Atlanta, Georgia 30384-9567 The new P.O. Box is in the same city as the National Licensing Center. Mail sent to the Dallas P.O. Box will be forwarded to Atlanta for a period of six months. After the six month period, applications sent to Dallas will not be forwarded to Atlanta and will not be returned. The notice states that they will update their forms at a "future Date". Here is a link so you can read the address change notice online. www.atf.gov/firearms/nlc/061903nlclockbox.htm The notice I have states that the mail will not be forwarded or returned after six months, but the online version makes me believe that the mail will be forwarded. |
Yup Nam is 100% correct. You just have to remember to sign in when you visit the site. Then the public and dealer prices are both shown. |
EVERYONE NEW TO C&R READ THAT!! God damnit, now I bet that means more waiting for me...god damnit...just sent mine in the other week, to dallas... |
| If anyone sent an application to the Dallas ATF address recently, you may want to send an email to the National Licensing Center to ask if they received your application. The email address is [email protected] |
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"Mail sent to the Dallas P.O. Box will be forwarded to Atlanta for a period of six months. After the six month period, applications sent to Dallas will not be forwarded to Atlanta and will not be returned." Six months from 1 July 03 is 01 Feb 04. IF you sent it in January you should be clear. If you sent it in February, i suggest resubmitting or calling. |
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Nam, count your months again.... 1 July 2 August 3 September 4 October 5 November 6 December January is the seventh month. Read the info at the link I provided on my post above. The online notice makes it sound like the applications will be forwarded. Hopefully that is the case. |
Check cashed 1/29/04 
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So it seems like they are forwarding the mail from Dallas to Atlanta. I just can't believe that in the six month change over period, they couldn't get the address changed on the forms. That's the .gov for you. NAM, it's ok that you had an extra finger when counting the months...just so the ATF doesn't have an extra finger when deciding when to mail my license! 
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Does anyone happen to have the number to call to see if they have received my application? They did not reply to my email. I sent it in on the 29th, and am not sure if I should send in a new application to the proper address or not. How long should I wait before doing that? Damn AIMsurplus is tempting me every time I look at it, but I can do nothing! Augh! |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Getting A C&R (Page 1 of 2)
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