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Posted: 1/28/2017 9:38:32 PM EDT
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Dumb question, but is there any ballistic stopping advantage of wearing a level 3a plate backer over a level 2 vest? When I'm at work I always have a level 2 on. In my APC I have a ceramic level 3 plate along with a 3a backer behind it. It would be nice to reduce some bulk along the way. I like keeping my normal vest on as it covers more than the plate and backer.
Our level 3 plates are nice and light at 3.2 lbs. The problem with these are that they're quite thick.....something like 1-1.5 inches thick. Is there anything out there that is this light but at half the bulk? There's days where I want to completely remove the plate and just run with my 2 soft armor plates. Any ideas? |
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I'm a little confused by your post.
Do you normally wear your plates? If you were stacking a Level IIIA soft armor backing over Level II soft armor, you'll gain only the advantage of the IIIA soft armor as if you were wearing a IIIA "plate" over your Level II vest. If your plate only meets Level III level protection with the IIIA backing it, I wouldn't take it out if I were you. The plate is there for a reason: rifle rounds. If you take the system apart and ditch the plate, you lose that added protection. Yes, there are lighter solutions. UHMWPE. Polyethylene armor plate. Usually much more expensive but it is significantly lighter. I don't endorse Spartan Armor Systems, but it is an idea for how much a pair of plates may run you. You'll definitely pay for the upgrade no matter where you go. UHMWPE has its problems though, nothing is perfect. |
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I'm not sure how much I'd be willing to spend truthfully. All depends really.
I always have a level 2 vest on. In an active shooter type event or general incident I'll add my Mayflower carrier into the mix that contains my level 3 ceramic plate (front only) and both front and rear level 3a backers. The issue I have with the ceramic plate isn't really the weight.....it's the thickness. At an inch+ it makes for an interesting experience trying to shoulder my rifle quickly and accurately. Which brings me to my thoughts of ditching the plate sometimes. I'm just looking for something as light, but with half the bulk....if that makes sense. |
| What size rifle plate are you wearing? If its a 10x12 try out an 8x10 size plate instead. Or stick with 10x12 but get swimmer cut plates. Swimmers cut plates (just google it and you'll see) just have a more aggressive ergo cut pattern. Other than that there aren't many options that don't involve lots of money and possibly getting something custom made. |
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Are your plates stand alone or in-conjuction?
if you're throwing your carrier on while you're wearing Level II vest, you can pretty much ditch the IIIA backers as they are redundant and just adding to the bulk. There might be some reduction in the dissipation of back face trauma but it will be minimal, especially if the plates are stand alone. BTW, at the thickness and weight you're describing, you most likely have UHMWPE (polyethylene) plates, not ceramic. They're not called 'cereal boxes' for nothing Velocity Systems makes some sweet ass plates that are thin (1/2") and light but are super expensive (over $1000). Model Number: VS-PB Threat Level: 7.62 x 39 Armor Piercing Incendiary (API – BZ), Multi-hit 7.62 x 39 Ball, Mild Steel Core, Multi-hit 7.62 x 51 NATO M80 Ball, Multi-hit 5.56 x 45 M855, Multi-hit 5.56 x 45 M193, Multi-hit 5.45 x 39 AK-74, Multi-h In-conjunction with soft armor model VS-13A Ceramic SAPI .50 inches 8.75”W x 11.75”L 3.5 lbs. 9.50”W x 12.50”L 4.0 lbs. 10.25”W x 13.25”L 4.7 lbs. 11.00”W x 14.00”L 5.4 lbs. |
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Get a plate that fits. 10x12 fits larger men of average height, over 5'6" or under 6'0" and usually 200 or more pounds in weight.
Sounds like you have a plate shape too wide for your body if it hinders shouldering your rifle. You should have essentially a near zero adjustment in shouldering your rifle if your system fits and avoids hard buckles or other items at the shoulder pocket. There is no reason to stack two layers of soft armor outside backface trauma reduction. You need a plate on your back, not soft armor. You need a plate up front that fits. SAPI cuts work for that. Swimmer cut is more about weight reduction than utility. It sacrifices coverage for less weight. Unless you actually swim in your plates, the added mobility gained is not useful. If you are between SAPI sizes a shorter stock toe solves minor stock seating issues. |
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After looking at things, it would appear my issued plate is already a SAPI cut plate. So that kinda defeats that one.
I'm a short, fat white guy..... about 5'10" and maybe a 44" chest or so. I know our fire resistant suits we sometimes is a 44....which happens to be an old mil. issued suit. |
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Another factor to consider:
If your plates are strict NIJ level III rated, they DO NOT protect against most 5.56 rounds which are the predominant round in rifle-based active shooter events here in the US. If you are planning on buying a set of plates with your own money, make sure you buy them based on the threats you actually think will be in your area and also make sure you size them appropriately. If you are having trouble getting a good shoulder with your current plates/carrier, investigate different sizes and profile. Keep in mind that you need to protect all your vitals. So side to side you need to have both nipples covered. And vertically, you need to protected from your clavicle to 2-3 inches below your sternum. Don't buy plates that are too small just to achieve slightly better rifle positioning. Instead, look at different/shorter rifle stocks to make up for the extra space. And make sure to train adequately in full gear. Range days, drills, movement, combatives, etc - they all will work differently wearing a full rig. |
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Quoted:
I'm not sure how much I'd be willing to spend truthfully. All depends really. I always have a level 2 vest on. In an active shooter type event or general incident I'll add my Mayflower carrier into the mix that contains my level 3 ceramic plate (front only) and both front and rear level 3a backers. The issue I have with the ceramic plate isn't really the weight.....it's the thickness. At an inch+ it makes for an interesting experience trying to shoulder my rifle quickly and accurately. Which brings me to my thoughts of ditching the plate sometimes. I'm just looking for something as light, but with half the bulk....if that makes sense. Special threat plates like the Paraclete Speed Plate Plus and the Tencate 2000SA are half as thick, but they're heavier than your poly Level III plates. They give up NIJ certification but pick up protection against steel core high velocity rounds like M855 and such. I have Speed Plate Plus's and I'm very pleased with them. There's no benefit to layering IIIA over II... they're both soft armor. The same material is used in your Level III plates, but it's so thick (hot pressed) because you need so many damn layers of it to catch high velocity rounds. You'd need probably 7 layers of IIIa ballistic or more to get close to the protection of a level III poly plate. |
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