Evolution armor BALCS soft armor inserts > Tactical Gear

Posted: 10/4/2008 5:57:45 PM EDT

Ok, I saw these on Ebay (yes, I know, bear with me) and was wondering if anyone had any experience with these. With the 30% money back thing these inserts would be a great deal. The guy who runs Evolution Armor, Allan Bain, seems to be the one who invented dragonskin (from what he says). It seems like he would have the know-how to make a decent III-A insert.

On the other hand, I could be totally wrong and these can be best suited for airsoft.

Any thoughts?

Posted: 10/6/2008 8:06:46 AM EDT

[#1]

I have been keeping an eye on these for a while..
Every now and then McBain-Armor has some really good prices on a Carrier and Armor Combo..

Tim, where are you..?

cgi.ebay.com/BALCS-IIIA-Soft-Armor-Inserts-Eagle-CIRAS-SPEAR-vests_W0QQitemZ280267925531QQihZ018QQcategoryZ102537QQcmdZViewItem

www.evolutionarmor.com/

CXS

Posted: 10/6/2008 8:12:33 AM EDT

[#2]

I haven't commented because I know nothing about Evolution Armor.

Posted: 10/6/2008 5:05:48 PM EDT

[#3]

I ordered them, the guy seems legit and it has passed the NIJ 2005 interim requirements (whatever that means). After the cash back it comes out to $397 shipped.

If I ever take a 9mm from a submachinegun or high velocity frag, I'll let everyone know how it went.

Posted: 10/6/2008 5:19:00 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
I ordered them, the guy seems legit and it has passed the NIJ 2005 interim requirements (whatever that means). After the cash back it comes out to $397 shipped.

If I ever take a 9mm from a submachinegun or high velocity frag, I'll let everyone know how it went.

Cash back?

CXS

Posted: 10/6/2008 5:22:23 PM EDT

[#5]

Yeah microsoft was doing a 30% cash back deal on ebay, people are getting aimpoint micros with larue mounts for a ridiculously low price. It's down to 20% now though. Here's the thread

Ebay aimpoint thread

Posted: 10/18/2008 3:39:06 PM EDT

[#6]

Well, my panels came in today. Seem to be well made. Weigh 4lbs 9oz total for both. Panels are 5/16" thick. Now I just need to decide which carrier to get.

Pics!

Posted: 10/18/2008 5:18:05 PM EDT

[#7]

Wish I'd known about the construction. While it depends greatly on your expected use/threat, many folks are shying away from anything with Spectra (PE) in it if there's any possibility of contact shots.

Here's some info, blatantly stolen from one of ballistic guru DocGKR's great threads in lightfighter.net's Helmets and Body Armor forum:

Posted 21 June 2006

THE JURY IS IN:

We recently had the opportunity to test shoot Level IIIa vests made of 12 panels of Kevlar Comfort XLT sandwiched between 15 panels of Gold Flex (Kevlar laminate). The vest stopped all of the appropriate threat calibers when shot from 10 feet (9mm Win Ranger Talon 127 gr +P+ from a G17 and .44 Mag Federal Classic 240 gr JHP from a S&W 629 5”); sadly, the contact shot results were less than desirable, with over 50% of the .44 Mag contact shots fully penetrating the panels, as well as a few of the 9 mm shots zipping through the vests. Also alarming was the observation that contact shots which did not fully perforate the panels were usually found in the last few layers of the panels, indicating little reserve margins.

Keep in mind that the older well-worn IIIa Kevlar vests, including one that was 25 years old, a few that were 15 to 18 years old, and numerous vests in the 9-12 year range ALL continued to easily stop the threats they were rated for, including multiple contact shots from the same 9 mm and .44 Mag loads that perforated the IIIa XLT/Gold Flex panels in the testing described above.

NOTE: The above photo illustrates three .44 Mag shots: UL contact shot--stopped in last few layers of vest, UR shot from 10 feet--stopped without problems in middle of vest; LR contact shot with full perforation of vest. Observe the significant melting and material degradation from the heat of muzzle gases on the contact shots

The above testing once again confirms that for LE use where the risk of contact shots is relatively high, soft armor using laminates are a poor choice, because of the inherent problems with laminates, including:

1) Curling
2) Contact shot failures
3) Delamination
4) Stiffness
5) Heat retention
6) Material strength degradation in heat
7) Compression set wrinkling
8) Fiber migration

100% woven p-aramid vests are a bit thicker, but offer substantially more protection. Officer's need to know that lighter, thinner, more expensive vests are NOT necessarily offering better protection.

Again, at this time, stick with all woven p-aramid (840 denier Kevlar 129 or similar weave Twaron) vests and avoid soft armor containing Spectra or polyethylene/laminates (Spectrashield, Gold Flex, etc…).

As long as your threats are engaging at a distance, it seems like it's fine, but keep their muzzle away from you.

Posted: 10/18/2008 8:18:39 PM EDT

[#8]

That's some good to know stuff. Only thing I bought these for was to back in conjunction with plates to use in an armor system such as a CIRAS or RBAV with my main concern being to stop rifle rounds.

Quoted:
Wish I'd known about the construction. While it depends greatly on your expected use/threat, many folks are shying away from anything with Spectra (PE) in it if there's any possibility of contact shots.

Here's some info, blatantly stolen from one of ballistic guru DocGKR's great threads in lightfighter.net's Helmets and Body Armor forum:

Posted 21 June 2006

THE JURY IS IN:

We recently had the opportunity to test shoot Level IIIa vests made of 12 panels of Kevlar Comfort XLT sandwiched between 15 panels of Gold Flex (Kevlar laminate). The vest stopped all of the appropriate threat calibers when shot from 10 feet (9mm Win Ranger Talon 127 gr +P+ from a G17 and .44 Mag Federal Classic 240 gr JHP from a S&W 629 5”); sadly, the contact shot results were less than desirable, with over 50% of the .44 Mag contact shots fully penetrating the panels, as well as a few of the 9 mm shots zipping through the vests. Also alarming was the observation that contact shots which did not fully perforate the panels were usually found in the last few layers of the panels, indicating little reserve margins.

Keep in mind that the older well-worn IIIa Kevlar vests, including one that was 25 years old, a few that were 15 to 18 years old, and numerous vests in the 9-12 year range ALL continued to easily stop the threats they were rated for, including multiple contact shots from the same 9 mm and .44 Mag loads that perforated the IIIa XLT/Gold Flex panels in the testing described above.

www.10-8forums.com/ubbthreads/postimages/26966-XLT_GF_contact_shot.jpg

NOTE: The above photo illustrates three .44 Mag shots: UL contact shot--stopped in last few layers of vest, UR shot from 10 feet--stopped without problems in middle of vest; LR contact shot with full perforation of vest. Observe the significant melting and material degradation from the heat of muzzle gases on the contact shots

The above testing once again confirms that for LE use where the risk of contact shots is relatively high, soft armor using laminates are a poor choice, because of the inherent problems with laminates, including:

1) Curling
2) Contact shot failures
3) Delamination
4) Stiffness
5) Heat retention
6) Material strength degradation in heat
7) Compression set wrinkling
8) Fiber migration

100% woven p-aramid vests are a bit thicker, but offer substantially more protection. Officer's need to know that lighter, thinner, more expensive vests are NOT necessarily offering better protection.

Again, at this time, stick with all woven p-aramid (840 denier Kevlar 129 or similar weave Twaron) vests and avoid soft armor containing Spectra or polyethylene/laminates (Spectrashield, Gold Flex, etc…).

As long as your threats are engaging at a distance, it seems like it's fine, but keep their muzzle away from you.

Posted: 10/19/2008 3:10:51 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
That's some good to know stuff. Only thing I bought these for was to back in conjunction with plates to use in an armor system such as a CIRAS or RBAV with my main concern being to stop rifle rounds.

Kewl. For your application they should be fine, but I can tell you - there are lots of PO'd cops who have composite armor who didn't know about the FBI testing and evaluation (or the Colorado (?) test) procedure that exposed a lot of the problems with PE/hybrid armor.

Posted: 10/19/2008 3:53:19 PM EDT

[#10]

Iwas jsut gona post the same question avbout the same ebay sellers stuff...specificly the carrier/armor combo for 599$

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