Posted: 9/8/2006 11:59:47 AM EDT
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After all the pretty pics Stickman posted of his GSR, and after fondling one at the local funstore, I just had to get one. I didn't own a stainless 1911 and the Sigs are just oh so pretty. I've now owned it for about a month and have exactly 996 rounds down it (yes, I really am that anal about keeping records). I did have a few problems with it from the get-go. The hammer would drop to half-cock when the grip safety was held and the slide released. Not cool. It was fixed by the shop I bought it from. I also had quite a few problems with failures to eject and feed. At first glance, I thought I had two problems -- an extractor problem and a feeding issue. Now I think it's one issue -- a chamber that's too tight. The spent casings would literally get stuck and the extractor couldn't pry them out. Same problem with rounds going in. This has largely gone away through repeated shooting (seems to be a break-in issue). I have not had a failure to extract in over 400 rounds. I have had 3 failures to feed in the last 400 rounds. I also had a hammer that was noticeably leaning. It did not affect function in any way. I dropped in a C&S ignition kit to lighten up the trigger some (it was crisp, but a bit heavy.. maybe 5 or 5.5 pounds, but I'm not expert). The new hammer does not lean in any way and the trigger is very nice now. No creep, light, and with a surprisingly sweet trigger reset. Now, as to my review of the gun -- it's certainly made of very high quality parts. They didn't not cut any corners when it comes to that. I've detailed stripped the pistol and looked it and I couldn't ask for much more. I'm on the fence with regards to the external extractor. I think I'd prefer an internal just because I've never had an EE and don't really know what to do with them. The slide to frame fit is very tight as is the fit for just about every part. I think the only thing they might have done wrong is build them too tigh -- they seem to require some wearing in to get to work realiably (not unlike a Les Baer). The accuracy is TOP NOTCH. Very very surprisingly so. I do all my shooting at 25 and 50 yards, so I really can notice whether a gun is accurate or not. Mine is a real tack driver. Probably due to the tight tolerances noted above. It is also a pleasure to shoot, due to the proprietary slide that Sig uses. The slide has a unique look to it and also has more mass up front than most 1911s, which helps to tame recoil. It is one of my favorite guns to take to the range. You might think that I'm disappointed given my issues early on. Not at all. I've got a high quality gun with fantastic parts that are well-fit and a gun that shoot remarkably well. I can deal with a little tinkering, etc, especially given that I have other pistols. If this were my only gun and I was having trouble getting it to run I might feel differently. I think Sig has a great product on their hands. I LOVE the look and the gun has really grown on me in how it performs now that it's broken in. Given that you can find them for around $800-900 and the features they have, I think they are one of the best bargains in 1911s around.       
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Very nice! Do the SIGs have MIM parts in them? Not hoping to start a MIM war, just curious. Have you have FTFs with mags other than what came with it? Wilsons or McCormicks? (this is like a tag... with questions!  ) Edit: The C&S kits are GOLD... I put one in one of my Para Ordnances and love it... |
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nice write up! a couple questions if you don't mind What are your thoughts on the spanner screw safety? (not a problem if you don't use it I guess) Does Sig use a one-piece or two-piece barrel? Other than the extractor, are the rest of the parts std. 1911? What are the differences between the GSR and the Revolution I've been hearing about? thanks for the help and congrats on a fine pistol (I'd like to get one myself), Rob |
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Pics are up! No MIM. All quality parts. I had FTF will all my mags, but the Wilson seemed to have them least of all. Barrels are one piece as far as I know. They seem to me to be rather high quality. Everything is standard 1911 except for the extractor. Now by "standard" I meant that you can drop any other part in it's place. It does have a nifty new beavertail safety, that you either love or hate. I love it. It certainly looks different, but if you hate it you can replace it. It also has a very different looking barrel bushing. The slide stop is a bit different looking as well. But they are all replaceable by any other 1911 part, just like any other 1911. As to the "screw safety"... do you mean the Series 80 firing pin safety? I don't mind it. This is my first 1911 to have one (lots of firsts for me here). I do notice a bit of creep and extra pull associated with it, but it's not a problem for me. I don't feel safer with or without it, and will probably just leave it as is. Detail stripping (or rather reassembly) is a bit more frustrating with those extra parts there -- I will say that. I should've mentioned -- I LOVE the real Novak sights (something you don't usually see at this price point) and I love the quality checkering on the grip. It's the "fit and finish" like this that really propel this gun into a class beyond it's price point. As to the difference between Revolution and non-Revo -- well, the Revos have that huge "Revolution" billboard. The big difference is that the frames are now made in-house as opposed to being built by Caspain. What does that really mean to you and I?? Nothing. |
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The spanner screw on the side of the frame is not a safety lock. It is like wilson said, there to hold the guts of the series 80 safety parts inside the frame. wilson- make sure you keep track of that screw. I have read where other GSR shooters had that screw back out during shooting, and had some of the parts fall out. If you notice the screw moving at all, a little locktite will fix it up for you. GSR Spanner If you need it, this is the correct size spanner bit for the screw in the GSR. Mine has not come loose, but I keep a very close eye on it. Mine is a tack driver as well - Glad to hear that you are a GSR lover as well! Don ETA: Which Ignition kit did you use? I had to send my GSR back to sig where they replaced my hammer and beavertail. |
Thanks bro -- I was unaware of that. I used the Tactical II ignition kit (4 pound pull) by Cylinder & Slide. Brownells has them. What was wrong with your GSR that it needed to go back to Sig? |
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I checked it over at the store (5 hours away from home) but didn't notice a slight hammer lean. I called SIG before I put even one round down the barrel. I figured that the best chance I had to get it fixed or traded was with an unfired gun. SIG said since it was unfired, call and deal with the shop I bought it from. The shop I bought it from said ship it to us and we'll send it back to SIG. It was back to me in a little over a week. The hammer and beavertail was replaced and is perfectly straight. Some say that hammer lean is cosmetic, but with what I paid, I wanted a straight hammer... SIG and my shop fixed me up no charge as I requested - I am one happy customer! Thanks for the info on the ignition kit. I am happy with my trigger right now, but I will hold on to the info for down the road - maybe when I do my first spring change. BTW, mine is a 1st gen railed stainless. The only other changes I have made was to put hogue wraparounds. I prefer them for carry. I'll have to get my pics up online tomorrow. |
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Ok. I put another 300 rounds down range today. I thought that I had all the issues licked, but I'm sad to say that that's not the case. I had 2 failures to eject and numerous failures to feed for the first 200 rounds. I then realized that my thumb was rubbing against the slide (I have a high hand hold) and although this is not a problem for my other 1911s, it seems to be for this one. As soon as I stopped doing that all my failures to feed went away. I use a Wilson Shock Buff in all my 1911s with no trouble, but I'm thinking that it may be giving this one some issues. I've removed the shock buff and will go to the range tomorrow for another couple hundred rounds to see if the issues are gone. With my thumb slowing it down and the shock buff impeding its ability to travel as far back as it might like, I may be getting feed issues. If that fixes it, then I'll be happy. If not, I'm at the end of my rope as far as what I can do, so I'll probably send it back to Sig at that point. I really don't want to have to do that since it'll be out of my possession for at least a month. But in all honesty, despite all this I'm very happy with the pistol. Once the growing pains are ironed out it'll be one super blaster. |
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Wilson, Just my .02, but I run my GSR internally completely stock. I don't have hardly any problems aside from a few failure to lock back on empty mag. I have heard from several GSR shooters that since they build the GSR to such tight exacting tolerances, it takes some pistols a long break-in period to become 100% reliable. If you do send it back to SIG - May I suggest speaking with them over the phone and not email. I have read numerous complaints from other gunners about their lack of response to emails. Good luck. I hope that taking the shock buff out and adjusting your grip makes your pistol 100%. Don ETA: I would also check out m-1911.org they have a forum just for the GSR. Lots of gripes but lots of love there too. Tons of good info from people who have solved problems with their GSRs. |
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Well removing the shock buff didn't do it. I shot 100 rounds at the range today and the problems are getting worse. I was getting a failure to extract or a failure to feed after almost every shot. And then the "manhole cover" on the slide started to come out as well. I have just shy of 1400 rounds through the pistol, so it can't be a break-in issue. She's going back to Sig through the gun shop that I bought her from. Hopefully Sig will fix it. My biggest concerns are that I replaced the ignition system with a C&S drop-in kit and I replaced the safety with a Wilson ambi-safety. I'm worried that they'll try to deny warranty coverage because of that or worse -- they'll replace the ignition system with they're own, so I'd be out $150. I thought about reverting it back to stock, but I didn't have the time or inclination to monkey around with it and it's frustrating getting those Series 80 parts in and out. We'll see. I hope they're customer service is good and I hope they don't try and replace my ignition kit. They shouldn't even be monkeying about with the frame at all as the problem has nothing to do with it. |
They expressed some concern over the replaced ignition system. But they also said that the repair should be free of charge. That's about it. They'll be sending it out on Monday. I'll let you guys know -- my guess is it'll be about a month  . Just a guess though. Hopefully I'll never have a problem again after that!It wouldn't surprise me at all if they just replace the entire slide with one of the new Revolution models that don't have the manhole cover. |
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I was going to suggest (with my limited knowledge) that it sounds like something let go or fell apart or you lost something inside the series 80 system - Especially with the spanner backing out. It really doesn't sound to me either like it's something in your ignition system. The other option that you have is to replace your Series 80 system with the dummy plates that you can get from Brownells. You basically fit plates where the guts of the Series 80 system goes, and it reverts your pistol to a Series 70 configuration. As far as the spanner goes at that point, Locktite it in, and you're good to go. When I had my problem with my hammer lean, I sent my GSR back to SIG and it was back to me in a little over a week. Just make sure to keep on them - it hopefully won't take a month. ETA: After re-reading your posts - it really sounds to me like something broke - your pistol was functioning nearly flawlessly for almost 1400 rounds right? |
I was having issues with feeding and a bit with extracting before, but nothing to this scale. I think you may very well be right that something broke because it went from slightly problematic to jam-o-matic just like that. I'm hoping that they fix the spanner or replace the slide so that this is not an issue again, tune the extractor, and ream the chamber. I'm also hoping that they leave the frame alone as I like my C&S kit. I considered deactivating the Series 80 system, but I've decided I'm going to keep it in. I don't feel safer with it, but I don't feel right deactivating a safety mechanism. Plus it didn't seem to affect trigger pull much and until now was working just fine. We'll see what Sig does. I'd imagine that a lot of people are watching this... |
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I really wish you the best of luck - The GSR is really a great pistol which is getting a really bad reputation... I hear you about the Series 80-I'm not going to deactivate mine either. If I were you, I'd send along a note with the pistol asking for them to do what you want - never hurts to ask. Good luck! |
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Also, try posting this over at M-1911.org in the SIGARMS forum. I've found that they are very knowledgeable on the 1911 system, and they are pretty neutral on the GSR. Worth a try. forum.m1911.org/index.php? |
Thanks again Bro -- I did just that just now. |
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As you've probably read, the GSR (not the Revolution, but just plain GSR) was Sig's first run, using Caspian parts..and some of them were out of spec. The Revolution series was their second run, and that's what most people look for today... If yours is not a Revolution model (it'd say it on the slide)...well, you got one of the bad early guns Before you send it back in, REPLACE THE INTERNALS with their originals. There's a better than average chance they'll look at it, see it's not stuff Sig put in, and send it back with a note saying "Sorry, Charlie, but you mucked with it...no longer warranteed". If they can't make it run right, ask for a new replacement. The Revolution series, near as I can tell, has fixed a lot of their early teething problems... Note, this is all anecdotal; I don't own one, this is just information I've gleaned from the 'net in my quest for knowledge about the Sig 1911's. (I've been tossing about the idea of picking one up for a while, and I like lots of research and data behind me when I toss a grand to the wind..) |
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We'll see. Like I said, it went to Sig with the C&S drop-in kit installed. I love that trigger pull, so I'll be sad to lose it. I'm pretty disatisfied at this point. And I don't think I can trust that thing again. I may end up trading it in when it comes back. A Colt WWI repro or Kimber Pro TLE/RL may be in my future.... |
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Just curious, did you replace the recoil spring with a Wolff for kicks? There is NO WAY your thumb could slow the slide down enough to affect functioning. I have several .45s and my family many more and the only time we get problems with "riding the slide" is if one of us puts a .22 conversion unit on it. It just doesn't have the velocity to work with a high-thumb hold. We all hold pretty much the same way (thumb high, resting on/gripping the thumb safety) and I can feel the slide moving under my thumb. Just a thought, before you send it back in. Sometimes manufacturers put crappy springs in, or they get a bad one from a decent supplier... |
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I got it back today. Here's what they did -- 1. Replaced the extractor 2. Replaced the recoil spring and guide 3. Reassembled the firing pin safety 4. Told me to use oil, not grease I still plan on using my Mili-Tec -- if it doesn't work with that, I'm getting rid of it. I'm going to run 100 rounds through it this weekend. We'll see how it goes. |
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Well, I put 99 rounds down range (1 I put in the "misfire bin" because it looked too nasty to fire). As usual, anything that can go wrong with me and this gun does.... and did. I had only 1 failure to feed, near the end. It got hung up on the feed ramp and just required a slap in the back of the slide to get working. I had 1 misfire -- weird. Never had that before. It dimpled the primer, but the cartridge didn't go off. Loaded it back up and it fired. Probably ammo related. I also managed to lock up the gun real good and get a round wedged in the grip. I'm a lefty and my support hand tends to push on the other side of the slide stop. Well, it's never been a problem, but of course, with this gun it had to be. I managed to push out the slide stop enough to lock up the gun. Then the round that was going to feed somehow got jammed in the grip and required a lot of pushing and pounding to get out. Yeah, some of this is just bad luck. Really I only had 1 true failure that was gun related in 99 rounds. I guess I should be happy with that. I really don't want to trade it in because I'll take a beating on the gun if I do that. But at the same time, I'm not exactly real happy with it. What do you guys think?? |
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Well, another 50 rounds at the range today. Another failure to feed. Also had the slide stop come out and jam the gun again. I had it. Me and this gun were through. That POS + $500 got me a brand new 20" PTR-91. I didn't have a .308 rifle, so it was about time. I got hosed of course on the trade-in, but it is what it is. If it were a good gun I would've tried to sell or trade it here, but I wasn't about to pass that off to you guys. |
Welp, that about does it for me and my visions of a GSR, too. This is just the latest of the GSR threads I've seen. |
what ammo are you using? |
Same ammo I use on all my guns -- Winchester White Box. I've seen poorly manufactured ammo from every major brand. You shoot enough, you're bound to find one or two. So I buy based on price and availability. |
well if it makes you feel better. I got 2 bad GSRs a few months ago. Bought my limited edition reverse two tone edition back in March and never really got to use it. Defective grip safety. It kept getting stuck in the depressed position. sent back to sig on their dime. Got another one but that took another 2 months and that gun shot itself loose at 500 rounds. So loose that the slide rattled on the frame when I shook it. Sent it back on their dime and finally got a refund after 1 month. Im dont know about some people, but its a hassle to have a gun all summer and not work. Hope some have better luck with it. Cause I didnt. 
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