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Posted: 4/8/2006 5:29:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 5:29:16 PM EDT by CockedandLocked]
I was over at a guy's house a little while ago. He showed me a Remington Rand 1911a1 with SN of 1,493,xxx The gun says United States Property M19111A1 US Army. I gave him $625 and an 18 pack of Bush beer for it. the gun's in good shape but has been shot. Other than what looks like some holster wear there really isn't any nicks, scratches, etc.

Updated with PIX





As you can see in the pictures the gun is a little dirty. It hasn't been cleaned.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:10:18 PM EDT
Dude, I'm no 1911 expert or militaria guy, but I don't think I'd be shooting a '43 Rand.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:18:02 PM EDT
Easy way to tell if it is a shooter or not. Take a strong flashlight Surefire or equivalent and shine it on the crossed cannon cartouche at the right rear. If it "shines" bright or burnished metal do not shoot it much. If it is parked in the stamp grooves shoot the hell out of it. This marking was applied after the finish was done. From your pics it looks very good and should be worth about $1000-$1200 easy. So yes ya done real good! If you look at the mags from the top down you should see a letter code on the front lip this will determine who the maker was and what guns they go with. Post the letters and I will look them up for you.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:20:03 PM EDT
I'll make it as plain as day:

YOU DID INDEED MAKE A GOOD DEAL

That's a good price, these days, for a USGI 1911. You did damn good

Thought I dunno about that case of Busch....did you NEED to punish the guy who sold it to you?





Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:28:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By P08:
Easy way to tell if it is a shooter or not. Take a strong flashlight Surefire or equivalent and shine it on the crossed cannon cartouche at the right rear. If it "shines" bright or burnished metal do not shoot it much. If it is parked in the stamp grooves shoot the hell out of it. This marking was applied after the finish was done. From your pics it looks very good and should be worth about $1000-$1200 easy. So yes ya done real good! If you look at the mags from the top down you should see a letter code on the front lip this will determine who the maker was and what guns they go with. Post the letters and I will look them up for you.



The cartouche you speak of looks like it's parked. I don't see any shine or variation from the rest of the parked metal on the gun. Now as far as the mags, I have a feeling they are not GI. I don't see any numbers or anything on the top of the feed lips. Two of the mags are silver and the remaining four look like they are blued.

Also I found out the gun was rearsenaled thanks to the link Sukebe privded. It's stamped FJA

"FJA: Frank J. Atwood. Found on Remington Rand and Ithaca 1911A1s (entire production)."
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:28:46 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Evil_Ed:
I'll make it as plain as day:

YOU DID INDEED MAKE A GOOD DEAL

That's a good price, these days, for a USGI 1911. You did damn good

Thought I dunno about that case of Busch....did you NEED to punish the guy who sold it to you?








Thanks and tell me about it... he could have had anything welll as far as domestic's. That was his first choice! It was cheap so I'm not going to complain.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:34:32 PM EDT
looks like a decent deal. you paid what you paid, so be happy with it, and go shoot the hell out of it!
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:35:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 4:38:55 PM EDT by MT-Gun-Nut]
I don't think I'd post a SN on an open forum.


P.S. FREE GREYWOLF!!!
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:35:50 PM EDT
more than likely it is easily worth the $600, it could be worth alot more depending on the shape it's in, post pics
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:38:43 PM EDT
Sounds like a good deal to me - I'd pay that price in a heartbeat for a 1943 Remington Rand.

Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:42:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
Sounds like a good deal to me - I'd pay that price in a heartbeat for a 1943 Remington Rand.





As would I.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:44:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MT-Gun-Nut:
I don't think I'd post a SN on an open forum.


P.S. FREE GREYWOLF!!!



DOH, I thought I X'd the last couple digits out.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:45:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rssc:

Originally Posted By MT-Gun-Nut:
I don't think I'd post a SN on an open forum.


P.S. FREE GREYWOLF!!!



DOH, I thought I X'd the last couple digits out.


yea, thats good.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:46:17 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rssc:
I was over at a guy's house a little while ago. He showed me a Remington Rand 1911a1 with SN of 1,493,xxx The gun says United States Property M19111A1 US Army. I gave him $625 and an 18 pack of Bush beer for it. the gun's in good shape but has been shot. Other than what looks like some holster wear there really isn't any nicks, scratches, etc.



must show pixs holster wear is like a hot MILF....

six bills. sounds like a good buy.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 4:54:47 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rssc:
I was over at a guy's house a little while ago. He showed me a Remington Rand 1911a1 with SN of 1,493,xxx The gun says United States Property M19111A1 US Army. I gave him $625 and an 18 pack of Bush beer for it. the gun's in good shape but has been shot. Other than what looks like some holster wear there really isn't any nicks, scratches, etc.



So the guns is a casualty?
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:00:20 PM EDT
Tag for pics, you should know better you slacker.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:03:55 PM EDT
Oh I also got 6 1911 mags. What do they usually go for? Are there some to stay away from?
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:07:52 PM EDT
Really nice shape, good luck with it.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:08:21 PM EDT
Good info on M1911A1's here;
www.coolgunsite.com
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:35:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2006 5:36:47 PM EDT by pv74]

Originally Posted By rssc:

Originally Posted By Evil_Ed:
I'll make it as plain as day:

YOU DID INDEED MAKE A GOOD DEAL

That's a good price, these days, for a USGI 1911. You did damn good

Thought I dunno about that case of Busch....did you NEED to punish the guy who sold it to you?










Thanks and tell me about it... he could have had anything welll as far as domestic's. That was his first choice! It was cheap so I'm not going to complain.




Domestic?


You should have had the decency to offer at least two cases of imported beer

Anyways...you did DAMNED good


Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:38:04 PM EDT
The markings will be on the top of the floor plate not the feed lips. Now that I look at the pictures closer I do not see a two tone on the front of the slide. Here is a pic of a untouched one to compair it to.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:43:20 PM EDT
I got a greasy old 1911 at a yard sale once...$200 I think. Must have been something wrong with it because there was this dried gunk all over it - "cosmogreen" or something, guy said.

The one I got - he had two - said "S Mfg Co" or something on the slide. Never did clean it; it's sitting under the kitchen sink wrapped in a towel. Too busy to clean it - think I can put it in a dishwasher?

The guy said he would sell me another one for an extra $150 - North American something, out of Quebec, but I had my heart set on getting a Hi-Point carbine that day, and besides, who wants a Canadian knockoff?

<­BR>
Just kidding. You got yourself a nice pistol!

Link Posted: 4/8/2006 5:53:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By P08:
The markings will be on the top of the floor plate not the feed lips. Now that I look at the pictures closer I do not see a two tone on the front of the slide. Here is a pic of a untouched one to compair it to.
www.georgealarm.com/doug/1911/1492924.JPG



Well from the front to the back of the slide I don't see a difference in the tone of the park. Should I be seeing this? Does the absence of this mean the gun shouldn't be shot?
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 6:05:59 PM EDT
That 1911 could be worth as much as 2K, maybe 3K. A friend of mine has a WWII era Remington Rand and he was looking at the values for like pistols and found one going for 3200.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 6:11:43 PM EDT
Email me some better close ups of the cartouche. What you are looking for in an original 1911A1 is to not have an even finish. What I mean by that is look at the small parts. These were finished at a different subcontractor sometimes. Were made out of a different hardness of steel, or were finished differently. All A1's had flame hardening marks on the front of the slide and on the slide stop notch. Here is a better example to get an idea of what I am talking about. It is an all original Ithaca rated about 99.9%
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 6:23:44 PM EDT
I also just noticed that your gun has a long trigger that belongs to a 1911. Yours should have the short one. They are easy to come and easy to swap out.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 6:44:49 PM EDT
You noticed that too?

Now I'm upset that I shot the bejeezus out of mine before I traded it. Then again, used to be the RRs were pretty common.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 6:45:20 PM EDT
You noticed that too?

Now I'm upset that I shot the bejeezus out of mine before I traded it. Then again, used to be the RRs were pretty common.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:02:44 PM EDT
It's had some parts changed on it but it is well worth $600 bucks. The trigger is some crappy aftermarket one, not even a long 1911USGI. Look at the feed ramp, is it bare metal or parked? I can see some variation in the front of the slide. If they are refinished they tend to be more noticeable.

Early 43s are not known to be some of the better built RRs. Lots of plant problems and rejection rate was high. However, by the end of 43 quality improved considerably and the rejection rate was way down.

Contract number was W-740-ORD-2477 for 48,000 pistols. Your pistol falls in this lot.

Should have a HS BBL.
Stamped short trigger.

Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:18:34 PM EDT
I want to thank everyone for the help. The guy I bought this from may very well have the original trigger. His father owned it since the sixties possibly earlier. He was a target shooter so most likely he replaced the trigger. He has a bunch of 1911 parts tucked away. The one in there appears to be some sort of aftermarked target trigger. It's got a small flathead screw I presume is used for adjusting the trigger. I'm going to go back over there and try to find the original trigger. One question though... How do I tell if it has a HS barrel?

I'll take some better pics tomorrow in the natural light (these pics were taken under a lamp). I'll post em ASAP.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:21:11 PM EDT
Remove the barrel and look on the side of the lug. It should have a letter code that tells who made the barrel HS= High Standard.
Link Posted: 4/8/2006 8:22:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fxntime:
It's had some parts changed on it but it is well worth $600 bucks. The trigger is some crappy aftermarket one, not even a long 1911USGI. Look at the feed ramp, is it bare metal or parked?



I'm hoping the guy still has the original trigger. I'm going to check that out. The feed ramp is bare metal. It's the same as the back end of the barrel. What does this mean? Does that mean that it more than likely has not been refinished?
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 8:55:54 AM EDT

Originally Posted By rssc:

Originally Posted By fxntime:
It's had some parts changed on it but it is well worth $600 bucks. The trigger is some crappy aftermarket one, not even a long 1911USGI. Look at the feed ramp, is it bare metal or parked?



I'm hoping the guy still has the original trigger. I'm going to check that out. The feed ramp is bare metal. It's the same as the back end of the barrel. What does this mean? Does that mean that it more than likely has not been refinished?



Probably the original finish then, grats on the nice score. Replace the hideous trigger with the correct short stamped one and chill knowing it is worth [if the BBL is correct] an easy grand at least. If it is pretty much all original you can start there.

The real big money is on 100% correct and excellent condition USGI guns. There is a big difference between A 90% and a 99 or 100% percent gun. We are talking thousands here and the collectors who know the difference and will pay it know their stuff. Of course, there are a lot of people with money who are ripe for the pickins also. There is always someone out there with more money then brains.

The BBL was originally blued BTW.

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