Posted: 12/26/2010 12:26:18 PM EDT
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So... Many of y'all checked out my thread about the AO 1911 I inherited. Well, I took it to the rang last weekend and put some rounds through it. Well... I have a number of issues I need to get fixed and I am pretty sure I know what I need to do but I wanted to get y'all's opinion. Please note, I cleaned and oiled it the day before taking it out.
First off, I had a number of FTE's and FTF's. Pretty sure the FTE's were a problem with the ammunition (PMC Bronze 230 grain) not being strong enough to completely work the action. Most of the FTE's were stove pipes. I had two where the round did not come completely out of the chamber which caused some nasty jams that took a minute to clear. I am pretty sure the FTF's were the fault of the magazine. I had only one magazine to use so I will be purchasing some in the near future to test out. Second, because of the bubba'd sights that are on the gun, it is not accurate whatsoever. The front sight is a standard GI sight and a tritium night sight on the rear that is too tall for the front sight. I shot about 70 rounds and maybe 40 hit the black, and they were all over the place. To make sure that I wasn't just off that day I also brought along my .22 single action revolver with standard iron sights (.22 WMR Ruger Single-Six). At 15 yards (same distance I was shooting with the .45) I put all 50 rounds out of the .22 in the 10 ring without a problem. So that all being said, I am planning to have get the following stuff done to the 1911. Please let me know if there is anything else y'all thing is worth doing or not doing. I am planning on changing out, the grips, grip safety, thumb safety and extractor. I also want to get the mag well and feed ramp polished. I am planning on having the front strap doing in 25 or 30 LPI. Finally I am going to have new front and rear sights put on the gun, as long as the slide isn't too messed up. Much of the work I am planning on doing myself. The only things I am going to take it to a smith for is the sights and checkering. I apologize for not having pics, but I was too pissed off that I forgot to break out the camera too take pics of the targets. Thanks for any help you guys can provide. Pics of 1911 and .22 below. 
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I'd start with a new 16lb recoil spring. Can't believe that any factory ammo wouldn't cycle a properly sprung 1911. My 1911s, some with heavyier than standard springs, cycle just fine with modest reloads.
For sights, consider a gold bead front staked sight of the proper height. Don't need to dovetail the slide––just get a post sight with bead installed, and stake it in place. Probably $50 for the sight with the bead. If you can install it yourself fine––if not, an install would probably be around $25. Its not as easy as it looks. The rear dovetail looks like a standard G.I., and for that consider a 10-8 simple blade sight . $32 delivered and you could install it yourself. Get a couple brand name (you don't need to spend $30+) mags and get the feeding issues resolved. Save the cosmetic stuff for last. Its not hard to put a LOT of money into a 1911, and not get any of it back. Make sure you have a decent shooter before you go for the easy bling. |
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Quoted:
Save the cosmetic stuff for last. Its not hard to put a LOT of money into a 1911, and not get any of it back. Make sure you have a decent shooter before you go for the easy bling. Yeah, my main thing is making sure it shoots. I need to take another picture of the sights for you guys. The rear sights are definitely not stock, but I do not know enough yet to tell what kind of cut they are in. The rear sight has a deep center cut with the white tritium on the posts. When I priced everything out the other day, for everything I mentioned earlier I was figuring somewhere around $300, not counting labor for the stuff I can't do. I hadn't thought of replacing the recoil spring, but it seems to me now it is something I should have thought of. I am not so much worried about how much I do end up putting into this gun because it will more than likely be something that gets handed down since it was afterall my step father's and I want to keep it in the family. |
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Measure the rear sight dovetail across the base––the widest part. If its a g.i. dovetail, that dimension should be 0.344".
There are several decent aftermarket sights, reasonably priced that will fit the g.i. dovetail without further modding the slide. If its different than .344, you may be moderately screwed in your options. Getting the front sight right, should be a gimme. You may have to remove the existing sight (vice grips) to determine what size "tenon" hole is in the slide. |
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(1) overall functional safety check––thumb safety, grip safety, trigger––could be OK as is. There are stickys on the 1911 forums that explain how to do this. A no-brainer but worth doing.
(2) getting the pistol to cycle properly and eject with ordinary factory ammo (3) getting the pistol to feed ball ammo (factory) reliably (4) getting the sights to have a reasonable POI/POA within 25 yds (5) getting the trigger right––if its over 5 lbs and gritty now. May be OK as-is (6) getting the pistol to feed swc and hp ammo––if it doesn't having gotten this far (7) beavertail grip safety if the current one bites you (8) refinishing (parkerize??–– less than $100, I think (9) grips (10) front strap checkering––I have pistols with and without, and for informal range shooting it doesn't matter––to me. To have it done professionally is big $$. To do it yourself––I could sure make a mess of a project like that and suspect I wouldn't be alone. (11) if you got through steps 1-5 and the accuracy was still crappy, you could consider a fitted barrel and bushing––probably $200 min. Springfield Armory has a price sheet on their website www.springfieldarmory.com for modification work. Their prices probably present the near max you might expect to pay, but they would give you an idea what it would cost to have a particular mod done professionally. |
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Safeties (Grip and Thumb) both work, but the grip safety feels a little loose to me and the thumb safety is kind of mushing when clicking it off. The trigger has a nice clean break and is fairly light. I am not sure of exact weight but I would estimate right at 5lbs. I guess it might have helped if I had said that other than becoming a family 1911, I plan on carrying it if/when I get it running reliably and possibly using it for IDPA/USPSA.
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It's an Auto Ordnance, good luck. Sounds like most of your issues might be mag and extractor related. However.............I'm not a fan of AO in any way shape or form and I wouldn't put to much money into it. In the research I've done and from what I've read on here and some other forums, it seems that a good number of people consider an AO to be a good base good to build off of. Also, I did read somewhere that the AO's built prior to 1985 were not as bad as those built from 1985-1999. This one was built in May of 1982. So we'll see. I honestly don't mind spending the money on it especially since I will be doing 80-90% of the work myself which gives me a chance to learn. But again we shall see. When I start working on it I will post updates and let y'all know how it's going. I'm stubborn enough that I'm thinking I can make something decent out of it. |
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It's an Auto Ordnance, good luck. Sounds like most of your issues might be mag and extractor related. However.............I'm not a fan of AO in any way shape or form and I wouldn't put to much money into it. In the research I've done and from what I've read on here and some other forums, it seems that a good number of people consider an AO to be a good base good to build off of. Also, I did read somewhere that the AO's built prior to 1985 were not as bad as those built from 1985-1999. This one was built in May of 1982. So we'll see. I honestly don't mind spending the money on it especially since I will be doing 80-90% of the work myself which gives me a chance to learn. But again we shall see. When I start working on it I will post updates and let y'all know how it's going. I'm stubborn enough that I'm thinking I can make something decent out of it. OOOOOK, been there, done that, wasted a ton of money on a cast slide out of spec 1911. Hopefully it goes better for you but don't dump a ton of money into it because it's NOT a good base gun. AO is one of the reasons 1911s got such a bad reputation years ago. You'll get a couple other 1911 aficionados that will post that will back me up on what I say. However, it's your gun and your money. Sometimes it's best to learn some things on our own. |
| I wasn't trying to be a flamer or anything. I know you are trying to give advice, I'm definitely open to anything anyone has to say because I definitely have little experience with 1911's. But we'll see how it goes. I'm hoping that this does not turn into a money pit and that if it starts to I can stop myself before putting too much into it. Again I apologize and thanks for the advice. |
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Just remember, at some point you'll sink enough money into this gun to have bought a RIA that works out of the box, and has a lifetime warranty. I'm not saying DON'T get the AO running, there's no point in having a gun around the house that doesn't work, but thought I would mention that for perspective. |
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Quoted:
I wasn't trying to be a flamer or anything. I know you are trying to give advice, I'm definitely open to anything anyone has to say because I definitely have little experience with 1911's. But we'll see how it goes. I'm hoping that this does not turn into a money pit and that if it starts to I can stop myself before putting too much into it. Again I apologize and thanks for the advice. All I'm saying is you need to put limits on what you want to put into this. I WOULD suggest a quality extractor, a new set of springs and a couple of good mags before you do anything else and see what that does for it's reliability. Good luck. |
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I wasn't trying to be a flamer or anything. I know you are trying to give advice, I'm definitely open to anything anyone has to say because I definitely have little experience with 1911's. But we'll see how it goes. I'm hoping that this does not turn into a money pit and that if it starts to I can stop myself before putting too much into it. Again I apologize and thanks for the advice. All I'm saying is you need to put limits on what you want to put into this. I WOULD suggest a quality extractor, a new set of springs and a couple of good mags before you do anything else and see what that does for it's reliability. Good luck. Yeah, thats kind of what I was thinking after the replies I have gotten. Thanks for all the help guys, I will definitely let you know how it goes... |
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First, that front sight definitely appears too low for that rear sight. You will most likely need a higher front sight, say .165" or 175", to get it shooting closer to point of aim.
Second, I'd suggest buying a few good quality magazines. This won't be money wasted because they can always be used for your next 1911. Third, read up on extractor tensioning and learn how to check and set tension. Don't think about spending money on cosmetic enhancements until you get it running reliably. |
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auto ord guns have a reputation as about the worst built us made 1911 by far. dropping money into for mods beyond making it function are ill advised. your easiest fix to the sights being off is to get a gi style rear sight to put on- it would bring your poi/poa relationship much closer. Easieer that replacing the staked in front sight.
for the money you'd spend on the mods you mention you would be better off getting a spare base model(colt 1991, sa gi or milspec) and shooting it instead |
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Quoted: So... Many of y'all checked out my thread about the AO 1911 I inherited. First off, I had a number of FTE's and FTF's. Much of the work I am planning on doing myself. The only things I am going to take it to a smith for is the sights and checkering. I apologize for not having pics, but I was too pissed off that I forgot to break out the camera too take pics of the targets. I predict you're going to stay pissed off... Don't even bother wasting a couple hundred bucks on checkering. Quoted: for the money you'd spend on the mods you mention you would be better off getting a spare base model(colt 1991, sa gi or milspec) and shooting it instead The checkering and sights alone would buy a Springfield GI. And that gun would be at least 90% more likely to work. |
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The rear sight is obviously too high in relation to the front. The OP and several others have stated that. That will certainly affect POA/POI relationship. But I'm more concerned with the OP's claim that the gun just wouldn't group. Could be a lot of things, including shooter error (might also contribute to the stovepipes he was getting), bad barrel, bad bushing, etc.
I'd suggest starting with the small, simple stuff that you're going to need anyway, since you plan on staying with the 1911 platform... mags, springs, etc. Maybe try another barrel and bushing to see what happens. If it were me, I'd ask an experienced 1911 shooter to run a couple of mags through it just to eliminate the human factor. Don't know much about the Auto-Ordnance 1911s, but I've never heard much good about them. If practice and some simple parts swaps don't have an immediate positive effect, I'd be inclined to save my dollars to put towards something with a better reputation. Good money after bad & all that. Just sayin'. |
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I'd suggest starting with the small, simple stuff that you're going to need anyway, since you plan on staying with the 1911 platform... mags, springs, etc. Maybe try another barrel and bushing to see what happens. If it were me, I'd ask an experienced 1911 shooter to run a couple of mags through it just to eliminate the human factor. I have shot other friend's 1911's and not had any problems, and I do love the platform. I will be getting another one in the future anyway, but I would at least like to get this one running which is why I posted this thread. I have definitely considered a lot of what you guys have said and have an idea of what I am going to be doing. As of right now I am going to start with the small stuff like was suggested, mags and what not. Once it's running reliably I am going to fix the sights and leave it alone after that and go get the SA I had been planning on buying originally before this one was handed to me. Thanks for the help guys. |