Posted: 12/19/2009 10:19:02 PM EDT
|
I found these in a local shop today and am leaning toward getting one. "Get Both" is just not an option right now this close to Christmas. One is a Bulgarian with 5 mags for $220 and the other is a Chinese Norinco with 6 mags for $230. What's the better deal? |
|
Quoted:
I found these in a local shop today and am leaning toward getting one. "Get Both" is just not an option right now this close to Christmas. One is a Bulgarian with 5 mags for $220 and the other is a Chinese Norinco with 6 mags for $230. What's the better deal? Layaway. Put the purchase price of one down on both. Then get both later. |
|
Quoted:
So, I would think that everyone would agree that East German Makarovs are the best quality 'Real' Makarov type pistol... But, how about the quality of a true Russian PM? Would a true Military Russian Makarov be lower quality than a Bulgy or Norinco? I would rate the Russian PM right behind the E.G., ahead of the bulgie and Norinco, IJ70 dead last. |
|
Thanks for the info, Steve_M
So, why would people want the Norinco more if the Russian Military Makarov is both collectible and quality made? I ask this because I have an opportunity to buy either a Miltex Special Edition Blued, Norinco ZZ series, or a Russian Military Makarov, Russian and Norinco in 97% or better condition, and Miltex is 100% NIB. Again, sorry to hijack... But I don't really want to start another thread |
|
I owned a Bulgie first. It was not "high" craftsmanship. I traded it for a Russian IJ70 18 AH. The quality was much higher than the bulgie. The E.G. that my dad owns is higher quality finish than both of those, although my Russian has a very, very smooth trigger.
The Norinco I just bought has a very nice finish, very comparable to the E.G.'s finish. It is nicer in finish than the Russian. When I was really into the Maks, 15yrs ago, and up on everything I could find about the Maks, the Bulgies were everywhere, and a dime a dozen. They were considered the low mark of quality, behind all others, including commercial versions. I'd rather have the military bulgie, now; given the collectablity, but not over my Russian, even if it is a commercial version. Someday the E.G. is going to slip out of my dads safe, and into mine  . I just have to convince him a little more. 
|
|
Quoted:
Thanks for the info, Steve_M So, why would people want the Norinco more if the Russian Military Makarov is both collectible and quality made? I ask this because I have an opportunity to buy either a Miltex Special Edition Blued, Norinco ZZ series, or a Russian Military Makarov, Russian and Norinco in 97% or better condition, and Miltex is 100% NIB. Again, sorry to hijack... But I don't really want to start another thread Different people are into different things, Some Maks are more interesting to them than others. All three listed are both collectible and of high quality. it would be a hard choice for me to make, at the right reasonable, price I would want all three. 
Good Luck. 
|
|
So, do you guys agree with the below list?
Bulgarian- Very common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Baikal- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) Everyone is welcomed to correct the list if you have other opinion... |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
So, I would think that everyone would agree that East German Makarovs are the best quality 'Real' Makarov type pistol... But, how about the quality of a true Russian PM? Would a true Military Russian Makarov be lower quality than a Bulgy or Norinco? I would rate the Russian PM right behind the E.G., ahead of the bulgie and Norinco, IJ70 dead last. +1 I concur....I have a Mitex and the finish is fantastic, I'd rate that with the EG finish but its not the factory finish so I wouldn't put it in the same category. The EG were made in the late 50's early-mid 60's and for a 50 yr old firearm, the factory finish is just unmatched over the others. |
|
Quoted:
So, do you guys agree with the below list? Bulgarian- Very common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Baikal- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) Everyone is welcomed to correct the list if you have other opinion... I seem to be the odd man out, and I haven't looked at a Bulgie in years, but the one I had was not on par with the Baikals with reguards to craftsmanship and bluing. There were machine marks everywhere, and a very dull blueing. The arsenal marks and stenciling from the importer were crude. The Baikals IJ70's were much cleaner of machined marks, with a higher grade of bluing. They also have a nice, almost stippled finish on the frame, that sets them off a bit. The bluing on them is by no means anywhere close to the EG's or Norincos, mostly because of the extreme smoothness of the metal(no machine marks). Now, I can see why the collectability of the Bulgies may make them more valuable to a person, as they were miliatry issue(aside from the Miltex versions), and the Baikals were commercial, but the finish on the Baikals is better in my humble opinoin; and a dated one at that. |
|
guns762, thank you for your valuable opinion.
Because I have only experience on Bulgarian, East German, and Russian Military, I , too, can't really say much about other manufacturer's quality. Anyway, I changed the list a bit, and I hope you guys can jump in and say what you what to say. Updated List- Baikal- Very Common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Bulgarian- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) Again, I only had experience on EG, Russian Military, and Bulgarian.. |
|
Quoted:
guns762, thank you for your valuable opinion. Because I have only experience on Bulgarian, East German, and Russian Military, I , too, can't really say much about other manufacturer's quality. Anyway, I changed the list a bit, and I hope you guys can jump in and say what you what to say. Updated List- Baikal- Very Common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Bulgarian- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) Again, I only had experience on EG, Russian Military, and Bulgarian.. The others posting in this thread think that the Baikals are lower quality than the Bulgarian.......Just because I don't think so, does not mean I'm right  . Steve seems very knowledgeable about the Maks. I'm just offering an opinion. The Bulgies are more common than the Russian Baikals. You had that right the first time.
|
|
okay, LOL
So, I guess we can settle with this one? Bulgarian- Very common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Baikal- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
guns762, thank you for your valuable opinion. Because I have only experience on Bulgarian, East German, and Russian Military, I , too, can't really say much about other manufacturer's quality. Anyway, I changed the list a bit, and I hope you guys can jump in and say what you what to say. Updated List- Baikal- Very Common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Bulgarian- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) Again, I only had experience on EG, Russian Military, and Bulgarian.. The others posting in this thread think that the Baikals are lower quality than the Bulgarian.......Just because I don't think so, does not mean I'm right . Steve seems very knowledgeable about the Maks. I'm just offering an opinion. The Bulgies are more common than the Russian Baikals. You had that right the first time.
Like yourself, I'm somewhat a fan of the Makarov design; simple ,rugged, accurate, a very underrated handgun. The biggest problem I have rating them ( the countries) against each other is that the visual quality with in each type or model can range quite a bit, early IJ70's had a decent ( maybe just a tad thin ) finish, the frame was the same blue as the slide, then they switched to a flat black rougher finish for the frame only. ( to me the only reason to give them a minor ding) The finish on the Bulgarians can also have a lot of range ( it was a military handgun afterall). So it's not unusual to find a variation of the Mak that sort of breaks the rating rule , for example a Bulgie that is as nicely finished as a Russian Military or one that looks like it was produced on a monday after a long vodka weekend.
I keep it simple and like all of them, they are all good, some are just a little nicer and more rare than others. |
|
Quoted:
So, do you guys agree with the below list? Bulgarian- Very common, Great quality (8 out of 10) Baikal- Common, Average quality (7 out of 10) East German- Less Common, Perfect Quality (10 out of 10) Russian Military- Hard to find, Outstanding Quality (9 out of 10) Norinco- Very Rare (Beside the $1000 Simson Mak), Better Quality (7.5 out of 10) I agree genrally with the list as stated, BUT, of the 8 or 10 Maks I have owned, the most accurate, and flawlessly reliable was a Bulgie commercial, with a EG being a close second. Everyone is welcomed to correct the list if you have other opinion... |