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Posted: 6/10/2003 2:46:16 PM EDT
Guys, I just bought an Auto Ordinance 1911. I always wanted a 1911. I took it to the range yesterday and it jammed on the second round. After that it jammed pretty regularly, about once every other mag. The brass isn't making it out of the chamber and that was causing failure to feed. The brass would just sit their in the ejection port. Also, I would swear that I was getting trigger slap. It was kinda uncomfortable. The accuracy was good, and I really like the design ergonomics and how it feels in my hand. Just don't know how to fix this problem.Can any of you experienced 1911ers out there help the new guy. I really want to fix this gun up and make it a shooter. Any other tips would be appreciated. Oh, I am using Chip McCormick mags. They seem pretty well made.
Thanks,
2ID Doc
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 3:17:37 PM EDT
Is this a new or used Auto Ordinance? The older ones had some quality control issues that have reportedly been addressed by the new owner {Kahr Arms}.

Either way it sounds primarily like an extractor problem.
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 3:21:54 PM EDT
It's a NIB Khar arms Ao 1911. Is an extractor an expensive item to replace? What's a good brand? I think a new trigger is in order as well. Any suggestions.
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 3:44:06 PM EDT
If it is a NIB Kahr Arms / Auto Ord, talk to the factory about warranty work. Don't change any parts just yet. Kahr will stand behind their products if you give them the chance.

But to answer your questions, extractors are not that expensive, I personally like Wilson Combat parts. Triggers are also widely available and not very expensive, and again, I like Wilson parts.

But I really counsel talk with Kahr Arms / Auto Ordnance first.

Beachboy
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 3:54:42 PM EDT
Yup on Wilson Combat "BulletProof" parts IF and when you start changing parts.

AND, Check out these magswww.precisionsights.com/actmag.html. Amazing quality and decent price.

Also, have you tried rapping your loaded mags against the palm of you hand to make sure all you ammo is as far back as possible? It sometimes helps.
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 3:57:35 PM EDT
I know it sounds strange, but your not preparing your grip for recoil are you? Or maybe your grip isnt tight enough.

I have seen people not hold a .45 strong enough and it has done exactly what your talking about.
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 4:36:41 PM EDT
I'm pretty sure my grip is OK.I've spent enough time behind the trigger of enough .45's to be confident with it. The gun Barely comes apart as well. THe bushing is so tight I almost couldn't rotate it enough to get the recoil spring out.(had to use my leatherman) Now I can't rotate it back, even with a wrench. I'm starting to get aggrivated. I'm gonna talk to the fun store Wed. I'll let you guys know what happens. I hope this can be resolved.
Link Posted: 6/10/2003 11:07:10 PM EDT
A couple of quick things, if I may.

First of all, lube the shit out of your gun: rails, bushing, barrel, etc. If it's as tight as you say then it may be binding just enough to cause trouble.

Secondly, try different ammo. Not all guns like all ammo.

Thirdly, try different mags. I use Chip McCormick 8rd mags for about $14 apiece.

Lastly, have someone else shoot the gun & see if they're having the same problems?

Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:05:09 AM EDT
Also, take your slide off and remove the barrel. Slide a cartridge under the extractor hook and see if it stays there from the tension of the extractor alone. If not, your extractor needs tuning, which is actually quite easy.

www.m1911.org has a how to section with an article from Bill Wilson on tuning extractors. Its actually pretty common for 1911s to get out of the factory with no extractor tension....sadly.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 11:26:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2003 11:28:33 AM EDT by Green_Canoe]
Regarding the trigger slap:

The only part that would feed energy back through the trigger is the disconnector. If it is working correctly the hammer has no physical way to feed energy back to the trigger because the path is interupted by the disconnector being disconnected (if working correctly). The disconnector is actuated as the slide starts its rearward movement. If the disconnector is hanging up it could transmit energy back through the trigger. I'd skip the trigger replacement (as a fix for this problem) and polish all the surfaces the disconnector slides on (if the pistol is out of warranty).

Kent
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 4:21:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/12/2003 4:21:54 AM EDT by desertmoon]
Go with what Bob_Cole, Lumpy and Green_Canoe have said they are on the right track. Also...get a BUSHING WRENCH...for that poor thing. The visualization of using a leatherman to twist the bushing made me hurt way down low!!!!
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 5:44:36 AM EDT
Maybe I'm a dimwit, but I've owned a bunch of 1911s, including some really tight match-tuned ones...and all you have to do to rotate the bushing is retract the slide a little bit - I've never needed a bushing wrench.
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 6:42:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/12/2003 6:43:55 AM EDT by Matthew_Q]
2IDdoc,

I think you may just need to tune the extractor a bit (find the how to on the link listed above)

Likely, it's losing the empty as the slide travels back, and it's not hitting the ejector with enough force to eject. Bending the extractor is easy, and it's free.

If you replace it, I suggest Wilson Combat. Their Bulletproof parts are supposed to be superior in function and durability.

As for the gun being tight, definitely LUBE IT UP. Work the slide a shitload by hand. My parkerized SA Milspec felt a little tight and scratchy (like rubbing sandpaper against sandpaper), but some lube and lots of manual cycling, and then a couple hundred rounds at the range, and it's very smooth now.

Link Posted: 6/12/2003 7:27:31 AM EDT
One of my Kmbers did that the first time out. I was shocked what a POS it was. Turned out it was just so WELL made, ie everything was so tight, that it just need to be broken in a bit.

The next time out with a really good cleaning and liberal use of lubricant, it worked great and has ever since.

There is just something special about a good shooting 1911. I don't know what it is, but I sure do enjoy shooting them a lot.
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 5:39:19 PM EDT
Is it bending the mouth of the brass, or maybe making two crushed spots on the mouth? If the brass looks like this, try a wolff 18.5# recoil spring, and check the extractor tension. Should clear it up.
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 10:27:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2003 10:29:07 AM EDT by cyanide]

Originally Posted By BobCole:
A couple of quick things, if I may.

First of all, lube the shit out of your gun: rails, bushing, barrel, etc. If it's as tight as you say then it may be binding just enough to cause trouble.

Secondly, try different ammo. Not all guns like all ammo.

Thirdly, try different mags. I use Chip McCormick 8rd mags for about $14 apiece.

Lastly, have someone else shoot the gun & see if they're having the same problems?

Hope this helps.

What he said, and don't panic till you have shot 500 rds, through the gun, if it still does it after 500 rds. then send back to the company for inspection and repair. All auto's need a break in period before they are relable.
Link Posted: 6/15/2003 5:50:27 AM EDT
I have an older A.O. 1911. I did with it, what I do to all my 1911's, reguardless who makes them, and got it a throat and polish job. My smith calls it a "reliabilty package". It includes throating and polishing, polishing up the breachface and underside of the slide, tuning the extractor and basic functioning check. Once done, they feed anything reliably. Mine worked fine with ball but balked a little with wadcutters until I had this done. Also, mags are a definite source of trouble. I've had best results with GI contract # mags in all my guns.
Link Posted: 6/15/2003 8:29:08 AM EDT
like AK103K said, that 'reliability' tuning is a good idea. Polishing the feedramp and throat are a good idea in any 1911.

I've been lucky with the SA pistols. The ramp and throat are pretty much polished. After a few hundred rounds break in (even during break in) I have had no problems feeding anything with the three SA pistols I've had.


Lots of good suggestions and ideas here... let us know how it turns out!

Link Posted: 6/15/2003 8:47:02 AM EDT
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