Posted: 10/27/2012 10:48:57 AM EDT
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. The only thing I have lubed was the detent plate for the safety/decock as after a little over 3 years of no lubing made ONLY the decock difficult to operate. A little gun oil on the detent cleared the problem. No failure to go into battery, no failure to fire/feed/eject has occurred during this time.
Unless due to rain and finances I shoot between 2-4 IDPA handgun matches a month using about 90-115 rounds a match depending on how much I want to shoot. Low side round count 2x a month at 90 rounds a match : 8640 High side round count at 2x a month at 115 rounds a match: 11040 Pics from the other day: 
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?  
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............ +1 I'd like to know too. OTOH, they're not that expensive and are easily replaceable.
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............ Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/test it in any way? |
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Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/abuse it in any way? No, I wouldn't buy a Raptor for $50K as that's ridiculous for a pick-up truck. Nor would I abuse ANY of MY guns in this way. 
Clearly these are your guns to do with as you please. All I can say is you guys must be made of $$ to abuse your property as such. It defies logic & common sense, IMO. YMMV. My .o2 |
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............ Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/abuse it in any way? Bingo, I like to know what my firearms CAN and CAN'T do. I have yet to see a "dirty" Raptor locally. 
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I like your style. 
FDE frame... 
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d135/Talnz167/Cannons/USP45_2k/P6260019.jpg Holy shit, I see you have the same metal showing through in almost the same spot as mine near the end of your frame.
I guess it's common???
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Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/abuse it in any way? No, I wouldn't buy a Raptor for $50K as that's ridiculous for a pick-up truck. Nor would I abuse ANY of MY guns in this way.
Clearly these are your guns to do with as you please. All I can say is you guys must be made of $$ to absue your property as such. It defies logic & common sense, IMO. YMMV. My .o2 I've beat the shit out of my carry G19 with 1,000 rounds in a training course with no additional cleaning nor lube from the initial clean/lube before day one. At least now I know it'll go that distance, AND it has given me no trouble at all to date. Durable, I say. |
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............ Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/test it in any way? This. HK builds the best handguns in the world and it shows. |
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Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/abuse it in any way? No, I wouldn't buy a Raptor for $50K as that's ridiculous for a pick-up truck. Nor would I abuse ANY of MY guns in this way.
Clearly these are your guns to do with as you please. All I can say is you guys must be made of $$ to absue your property as such. It defies logic & common sense, IMO. YMMV. My .o2 What those HK's went through is not abuse: they did what they were designed to do. It makes perfect sense and follows a logical progression as now they have empirical data as to what these pistols can take and still keep going. Those pistols will be fine and will continue working. Relax. |
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I like your style.
FDE frame...
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d135/Talnz167/Cannons/USP45_2k/P6260019.jpg Holy shit, I see you have the same metal showing through in almost the same spot as mine near the end of your frame.
I guess it's common??? Helps keep the serial number sheet metal in place I would assume...?
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Because....they were designed for it?? Isn't durability a selling point of most handguns? HKs have proven themselves to be a very durable and reliable sidearm. Are you the type to buy a $50,000 Ford Raptor truck and not tow/go offroad/abuse it in any way? No, I wouldn't buy a Raptor for $50K as that's ridiculous for a pick-up truck. Nor would I abuse ANY of MY guns in this way.
Clearly these are your guns to do with as you please. All I can say is you guys must be made of $$ to absue your property as such. It defies logic & common sense, IMO. YMMV. My .o2 What those HK's went through is not abuse: they did what they were designed to do. It makes perfect sense and follows a logical progression as now they have empirical data as to what these pistols can take and still keep going. Those pistols will be fine and will continue working. Relax. Exactly.
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............ +1 I'd like to know too. OTOH, they're not that expensive and are easily replaceable.
Gents, I agree with you. It's simply impossible for me to treat my machines in this manner. What does it prove really? Nothing, other than laziness. To each their own, but I'll keep my weapons clean and ready thank you very much. |
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10/20/12 marked the 4th year I've been shooting IDPA with my HK USP 9 and in during that time I have not cleaned her what-so-ever. Why?
Why mistreat such a refined & upper tier gun? I don't get it............
What? They are not really "refined". More like "overbuilt". That is like calling a unimog refined. It's a hard use gun, he is doing just that. Not everyone buys guns to take pictures of them squeeky clean. |
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Keeping a gun squeaky clean isn't the only reason to perform regular maintenance. More than once I've found a broken part on a gun during a cleaning session. If you don't maintain your carry gun regularly, you may find two ends of a broken pin falling out of the gun when you least expect it.
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Haha, you people are funny. These guns were designed to work under shown conditions, worse conditions actually. Why do we pay all this money for "combat pistols" (HK, Glock, Sig, Smith, ect) if you don't trust them to work while not in a pristine condition? Do you change the oil every time you drive your car? Me neither, nor to I put oil on my guns every time I shoot them... they don't need it.
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Cool I guess. I do like to see my guns go through getting disgusting but there is no way I could keep from cleaning it especially if I carry it daily to trust my life to. Yeah, it could and maybe should be able to go bang after years of rounds down range, it's not worth it to me to take the chance. I just ran 5 mags through my G19 and it's not hardly dirty at all but it will be clean before I go to bed.
I have wanted to buy a handgun and just shoot it, never clean it until it fails but I wouldn't carry it until I was done with the test. No matter the mfg. guns are man made machines. They WILL fail, the question is when? On a side note, good on you OP for actually taking the time to practice in all these matches, that's a lot more than I have done. Kinda making me miss my USP 45 full size 
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Haha, you people are funny. These guns were designed to work under shown conditions, worse conditions actually. Why do we pay all this money for "combat pistols" (HK, Glock, Sig, Smith, ect) if you don't trust them to work while not in a pristine condition? Do you change the oil every time you drive your car? Me neither, nor to I put oil on my guns every time I shoot them... they don't need it. Huge difference between "designed to perform under these conditions" & WANTING to run them under those conditions, IMO. For example, one COULD go w/o a shower or bath for extended periods of time. One's body could indeed endure such treatment & has been proven in the past during war times. But that doesn't mean one should do so just because one can, IMO. Again, it's y'alls gun(s), do with them as you please. But I just don't get it..........
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Haha, you people are funny. These guns were designed to work under shown conditions, worse conditions actually. Why do we pay all this money for "combat pistols" (HK, Glock, Sig, Smith, ect) if you don't trust them to work while not in a pristine condition? Do you change the oil every time you drive your car? Me neither, nor to I put oil on my guns every time I shoot them... they don't need it. Huge difference between "designed to perform under these conditions" & WANTING to run them under those conditions, IMO. For example, one COULD go w/o a shower or bath for extended periods of time. One's body could indeed endure such treatment & has been proven in the past during war times. But that doesn't mean one should do so just because one can, IMO. You're comparing a human body - a living, breathing organism - with a pistol? I guess my point is, if these guns are designed to perform under these conditions I see no harm in letting them. I can tell you right now I have four pistols that have 800+ rounds through them without cleaning or lube added. I guess it really doesn't strike me as being odd...
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Haha, you people are funny. These guns were designed to work under shown conditions, worse conditions actually. Why do we pay all this money for "combat pistols" (HK, Glock, Sig, Smith, ect) if you don't trust them to work while not in a pristine condition? Do you change the oil every time you drive your car? Me neither, nor to I put oil on my guns every time I shoot them... they don't need it. Huge difference between "designed to perform under these conditions" & WANTING to run them under those conditions, IMO. For example, one COULD go w/o a shower or bath for extended periods of time. One's body could indeed endure such treatment & has been proven in the past during war times. But that doesn't mean one should do so just because one can, IMO. You're comparing a human body - a living, breathing organism - with a pistol? I guess my point is, if these guns are designed to perform under these conditions I see no harm in letting them. I can tell you right now I have four pistols that have 800+ rounds through them without cleaning or lube added. I guess it really doesn't strike me as being odd...
Me neither. ToddG, a highly regarded pistol instructor with some time inside the industry, was the guy who came up with what's called the 2000 round test. The 2000 round test is where you shoot a gun for 2000 consucutive rounds without any cleaning or lube, after an initial clean/lube before the challenge. You may take a month or a year to do the test; you're just not allowed to do anything more than wipe down the exterior of the gun. This is a guy who shoots 15,000 rounds every few months. Some of his pistols have done the 2000 round challenge several times. Maybe this guy, who has more experience with shooting pistols than most of us in this thread, knows what talking about. Maybe he knows something we don't. And yet people still decry something like that as "abuse." |
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Haha, you people are funny. These guns were designed to work under shown conditions, worse conditions actually. Why do we pay all this money for "combat pistols" (HK, Glock, Sig, Smith, ect) if you don't trust them to work while not in a pristine condition? Do you change the oil every time you drive your car? Me neither, nor to I put oil on my guns every time I shoot them... they don't need it. Huge difference between "designed to perform under these conditions" & WANTING to run them under those conditions, IMO. For example, one COULD go w/o a shower or bath for extended periods of time. One's body could indeed endure such treatment & has been proven in the past during war times. But that doesn't mean one should do so just because one can, IMO. Again, it's y'alls gun(s), do with them as you please. But I just don't get it.......... If you're mentioning wartime, of course. These tests and challenges mimic the possibly that you won't always have the luxury to clean your gun to a squeaky clean every time you shoot it. That's the whole point. |
| The lack of lube may be a little abusive but who cares, it's his gun and I'm very impressed with the results. I shoot my Glock 17 all year long in USPSA and IDPA without cleaning but I do lube it. I dont count the rounds but it's over a thousand. But I dont carry my competition guns nor the mags, which are all dedicated for range/competition use. But then again, I dont clean my carry guns after every range trip either. The most reliable gun is one you just shot and didn't fuck with afterward. |
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Im slowly () collecting ammo so I can do the 2k challenge over a weekend with my HK45C.
I would start now but if I keep it dirty over a long period of time I wont be able to sleep at night,
And yes, I know it can handle being dirty but there is just something about a good cleaning that makes me happy. |
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Im slowly ( ) collecting ammo so I can do the 2k challenge over a weekend with my HK45C.
I would start now but if I keep it dirty over a long period of time I wont be able to sleep at night,
And yes, I know it can handle being dirty but there is just something about a good cleaning that makes me happy. Someone needs to unarchive that thread! I've gone though that challenge with EIGHT pistols.  I am not sure how to do it or even if I am able since I am not a member, but I'd love to see the HK45c results.
On that note, I've got 1200 through my USP 40 Tact... few more range trips to finish that up. |
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Im slowly ( ) collecting ammo so I can do the 2k challenge over a weekend with my HK45C.
I would start now but if I keep it dirty over a long period of time I wont be able to sleep at night,
And yes, I know it can handle being dirty but there is just something about a good cleaning that makes me happy. Someone needs to unarchive that thread! I've gone though that challenge with EIGHT pistols. I am not sure how to do it or even if I am able since I am not a member, but I'd love to see the HK45c results.
On that note, I've got 1200 through my USP 40 Tact... few more range trips to finish that up. I tried to get my 92A1 and some ammo to toss into that thread before it went into Archives but wasn't quite able to... |
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When in anyones lifetime has a pistol gone in combat for 5K? NEVER we cleaned them and maintained them.
I agree it is cool your pistol can do it but really what are you proving.... The pistol was designed to endure but never did I run that many rounds through my pistol when I was in Iraq or Afghan if anything I was cleaning it ritually because if I drew my pistol something was wrong with my rifle and I HAD to know my sidearm would work no matter what. So why would anyone ever do this for a carry pistol when one day they know the pistol will hit the wall and fail. It is a machine and like every machine it WILL fail. To each their own let me know when it quits. |
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When in anyones lifetime has a pistol gone in combat for 5K? NEVER we cleaned them and maintained them. I agree it is cool your pistol can do it but really what are you proving.... The pistol was designed to endure but never did I run that many rounds through my pistol when I was in Iraq or Afghan if anything I was cleaning it ritually because if I drew my pistol something was wrong with my rifle and I HAD to know my sidearm would work no matter what. So why would anyone ever do this for a carry pistol when one day they know the pistol will hit the wall and fail. It is a machine and like every machine it WILL fail. To each their own let me know when it quits. I agree. To me a combat test would be dragging it through some dirt/mud, shooting a few mags quickly, dropping it. shooting a mag and then dragging it through some mud again and then dump a few more mags. I always thought if I ran that many rds through it without a cleaning, it not only wears it down more quickly but may fail whenever I actually need it. I do love these threads though. A really like the pistol training 50k test they put pistols through. Always neat to see how they come out at the end. |
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ToddG, a highly regarded pistol instructor with some time inside the industry, was the guy who came up with what's called the 2000 round test. The 2000 round test is where you shoot a gun for 2000 consucutive rounds without any cleaning or lube, after an initial clean/lube before the challenge. You may take a month or a year to do the test; you're just not allowed to do anything more than wipe down the exterior of the gun. This is a guy who shoots 15,000 rounds every few months. Some of his pistols have done the 2000 round challenge several times. Maybe this guy, who has more experience with shooting pistols than most of us in this thread, knows what talking about. Maybe he knows something we don't. And yet people still decry something like that as "abuse." Yes, it IS "abuse". Guns are designed to be cleaned & lubed. Just like any mechanical device. With the exception of a few guns (rimfires, competition guns), every single gun I own is one I might call upon to defend my life (or other lives). I want/need that gun to be both clean & ready to go at a moments notice. Oil can & WILL evaporate over a period of time. Adding to this time stress is heat from shooting. I could care less what some boob "with experience in the industry" thinks or does. He's not saving my life nor am I depending on him to do so. Virtually everything I learned about gun maintenance is what I was taught in the Marines. (You may wish to read up on their history.) I'd say they have a wee bit more experience than "ToddG" (is he Kenny G's brother?). Again, it's y'alls gun(s), do with them as you please. But it's silly, nonsensical & makes absolutely no logical sense whatsoever to do this sort of thing. But by all means, have at it.
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ToddG, a highly regarded pistol instructor with some time inside the industry, was the guy who came up with what's called the 2000 round test. The 2000 round test is where you shoot a gun for 2000 consucutive rounds without any cleaning or lube, after an initial clean/lube before the challenge. You may take a month or a year to do the test; you're just not allowed to do anything more than wipe down the exterior of the gun. This is a guy who shoots 15,000 rounds every few months. Some of his pistols have done the 2000 round challenge several times. Maybe this guy, who has more experience with shooting pistols than most of us in this thread, knows what talking about. Maybe he knows something we don't. And yet people still decry something like that as "abuse." Yes, it IS "abuse". Guns are designed to be cleaned & lubed. Just like any mechanical device. With the exception of a few guns (rimfires, competition guns), every single gun I own is one I might call upon to defend my life (or other lives). I want/need that gun to be both clean & ready to go at a moments notice. Oil can & WILL evaporate over a period of time. Adding to this time stress is heat from shooting. I could care less what some boob "with experience in the industry" thinks or does. He's not saving my life nor am I depending on him to do so. Virtually everything I learned about gun maintenance is what I was taught in the Marines. (You may wish to read up on their history.) I'd say they have a wee bit more experience than "ToddG" (is he Kenny G's brother?). Again, it's y'alls gun(s), do with them as you please. But it's silly, nonsensical & makes absolutely no logical sense whatsoever to do this sort of thing. But by all means, have at it. Well geez thank you captain we are all glad that we now have your blessing to treat our guns in this manner. Btw it's "I couldn't care less" what some boob thinks. |
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ToddG, a highly regarded pistol instructor with some time inside the industry, was the guy who came up with what's called the 2000 round test. The 2000 round test is where you shoot a gun for 2000 consucutive rounds without any cleaning or lube, after an initial clean/lube before the challenge. You may take a month or a year to do the test; you're just not allowed to do anything more than wipe down the exterior of the gun. This is a guy who shoots 15,000 rounds every few months. Some of his pistols have done the 2000 round challenge several times. Maybe this guy, who has more experience with shooting pistols than most of us in this thread, knows what talking about. Maybe he knows something we don't. And yet people still decry something like that as "abuse." Yes, it IS "abuse". Guns are designed to be cleaned & lubed. Just like any mechanical device. With the exception of a few guns (rimfires, competition guns), every single gun I own is one I might call upon to defend my life (or other lives). I want/need that gun to be both clean & ready to go at a moments notice. Oil can & WILL evaporate over a period of time. Adding to this time stress is heat from shooting. I could care less what some boob "with experience in the industry" thinks or does. He's not saving my life nor am I depending on him to do so. Virtually everything I learned about gun maintenance is what I was taught in the Marines. (You may wish to read up on their history.) I'd say they have a wee bit more experience than "ToddG" (is he Kenny G's brother?). Again, it's y'alls gun(s), do with them as you please. But it's silly, nonsensical & makes absolutely no logical sense whatsoever to do this sort of thing. But by all means, have at it. I buy guns that were designed and meant to be shot. And shot a lot. And yes, I agree that oil does evaporate; I figured that out early on with my first gun and switched to grease. I've read up on some military history. What annoys me is for the longest time, I read that issued weapons were cleaned so often they started to accumulate more wear from cleaning than actual shooting. Especially the Marines being sticklers for ultra clean weapons. |
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I bought a USP-45 from a friend who rarely cleaned it. I know his round count was nowhere near yours. There are streaks of pitting in the barrel. Be careful. unlikely - it's probably just lead in the poly grooves. Just unburnt powder or powder residue. I tried taking better pics of the barrel but 10 minutes in I gave up. 
Damn focus kept adjusting too much. 
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