Posted: 7/21/2009 1:37:58 PM EDT
|
Who are the 3 best manufacturers?
Thanks. |
|
It depends on if you want a traditional double action or a single action
Cimmarrion, USFA make great 357 magnums repos of classic cowboy guns S&W & Ruger make good peices and if you want a third I would say Taurus is a distant third they are hit & miss but when they hit its a good pistol with a smooth trigger. |
|
Quoted:
Thanks. What are the differences between S&W and Ruger? This is like Ford vs. Chevy so you will hear bitter arguments pro and con. I'll try to be as objective as possible: Things they share in common: 1) Both are solid, American made products that work well. 2) Both are backed by companies deeply committed to customer service, their industry, and their products. 3) Both are reliable, widely available, and easy to get accessories and service for. Things that make them different: 1) S&W designs are somewhat more sophisticated and refined. They use forged steel for their frames. 2) Ruger turns more to simplicity, and uses investment cast frames, necessitating a little more bulk in construction to get equal strength. 3) Because they tend to be more refined and the design more "classic" - people tend to think S&W's handle better and more quickly. 4) Because they stress simplicity, people tend to think Ruger's are more rugged and reliable. 5) Because of design, components, and construction methods, S&Ws will run a price premium vs. a head-to-head Ruger model. 6) S&W has a vastly wider product range, so for someone looking for a very specific set of features, they hold an edge. In fact and in many years of experience, I do not see a measurable difference in reliability or strength in head-to-head comparable models. In my opinion it's not as neutral as Ford vs. Chevy - both of which are very good and about equal. I think it's more like say VW vs. BMW. Both are very, very good. One is a little simpler and cheaper; the other is a little more refined and more expensive. Both do their jobs wonderfully. It's up to you to choose the one based on your tastes and budget. You can't go wrong either way. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks. What are the differences between S&W and Ruger? This is like Ford vs. Chevy so you will hear bitter arguments pro and con. I'll try to be as objective as possible: Things they share in common: 1) Both are solid, American made products that work well. 2) Both are backed by companies deeply committed to customer service, their industry, and their products. 3) Both are reliable, widely available, and easy to get accessories and service for. Things that make them different: 1) S&W designs are somewhat more sophisticated and refined. They use forged steel for their frames. yes and no. they have alloy and the other LW frames too. 2) Ruger turns more to simplicity, and uses investment cast frames, necessitating a little more bulk in construction to get equal strength. 3) Because they tend to be more refined and the design more "classic" - people tend to think S&W's handle better and more quickly. 4) Because they stress simplicity, people tend to think Ruger's are more rugged and reliable. 5) Because of design, components, and construction methods, S&Ws will run a price premium vs. a head-to-head Ruger model. 6) S&W has a vastly wider product range, so for someone looking for a very specific set of features, they hold an edge. In fact and in many years of experience, I do not see a measurable difference in reliability or strength in head-to-head comparable models. In my opinion it's not as neutral as Ford vs. Chevy - both of which are very good and about equal. I think it's more like say VW vs. BMW. Both are very, very good. One is a little simpler and cheaper; the other is a little more refined and more expensive. Both do their jobs wonderfully. It's up to you to choose the one based on your tastes and budget. You can't go wrong either way. also, you forgot a newer component: Ruger - so far no ILs on their DA revolvers. S&W - current makes have IL. |
|
Quoted: Quoted: Don't forget Korth.   IIRC, they cost like $5k. I don't think many people are going to spend that.  I agree completely. But the OP didn't put any price constraint or other criteria on his "best" question, so I don't know if this is a "what should I buy?" exercise or just a hypothetical question. I've never even held one, but just based upon what I've read about them over the years I contend that they (assuming they are still in production –– I honestly don't know) would have to be on any list of the best 3 manufacturers of .357 revolvers, absent other criteria that would disqualify them. |
|
Lots of good info posted already. Worth reading if your too lazy and want to jump to the end to see if there is a flame war going on. (sorry to disappoint)
There are good S&W and bad S&W 357 revolvers, just like there are with Rugers. IMHO: The "best" S&W 357 is a tie between the model 27/28 and the 586/686. (both pre-internal lock models) The model 27/28 is an "N" frame and handles heavier loads. The 586 and 686 (non-7shot) are smaller and lighter than the "N" frame and hold value quite well. IMHO: The "best" Ruger 357 is the 4" GP100 in stainless. Built like a tank, but, not as large as the model 27/28 from S&W. Its my understanding that the S&W will have faster trigger return than the Ruger. This has never bothered me. Since you can get the same speed loaders to work in either brand, GP100 and 586/686, its really a matter of cost and availability. The good news is that neither brand is going to be a lemon by default. Used ones from either Ruger or S&W should only run about $450-$550. |
|
Quoted: ... IMHO: The "best" S&W 357 is a tie between the model 27/28 and the 586/686. (both pre-internal lock models)... I have a 28 and several 586/686 variants. Personally, as much as I love the 586/686s I'd give them all up before my 28. I let it get away from me once and was blessed to be able to buy it back from the friend I sold it to –– never again. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ruger - so far no ILs on their DA revolvers. S&W - current makes have IL. The Ruger LCR has a built in lawyer-lock. No reports yet if it self locks the way S&W locks do. This is unproven in most Massad Ayoob pointed out in a recent article that he has only seen 3 S&W locks lock up all were 44magnum snubbies with very hot hand loads and high recoil. I have never seen a smith lock up ever and have never read a post where it happened to someone only to a friend of a freind. Massad Ayoob is a well respected instructor and I will take his word.......I also dislike the lock and will not own a pistol with one in it.........do what you want but the locks not a big deal unless you are shooting hot handloads. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks. What are the differences between S&W and Ruger? This is like Ford vs. Chevy so you will hear bitter arguments pro and con. I'll try to be as objective as possible: Things they share in common: 1) Both are solid, American made products that work well. 2) Both are backed by companies deeply committed to customer service, their industry, and their products. 3) Both are reliable, widely available, and easy to get accessories and service for. Things that make them different: 1) S&W designs are somewhat more sophisticated and refined. They use forged steel for their frames. 2) Ruger turns more to simplicity, and uses investment cast frames, necessitating a little more bulk in construction to get equal strength. 3) Because they tend to be more refined and the design more "classic" - people tend to think S&W's handle better and more quickly. 4) Because they stress simplicity, people tend to think Ruger's are more rugged and reliable. 5) Because of design, components, and construction methods, S&Ws will run a price premium vs. a head-to-head Ruger model. 6) S&W has a vastly wider product range, so for someone looking for a very specific set of features, they hold an edge. In fact and in many years of experience, I do not see a measurable difference in reliability or strength in head-to-head comparable models. In my opinion it's not as neutral as Ford vs. Chevy - both of which are very good and about equal. I think it's more like say VW vs. BMW. Both are very, very good. One is a little simpler and cheaper; the other is a little more refined and more expensive. Both do their jobs wonderfully. It's up to you to choose the one based on your tastes and budget. You can't go wrong either way. I mostly agree . For me I very much value what I feel is the better trigger on the S&W guns. I believe this is the greatest factor in ease of use and resultant accuracy. The "greater strength" of the Rugers is unusable unless one is abuseing the firearm. Ruger is a decent line but for my use the S&W is the only choice by a huge ammount. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Don't forget Korth. IIRC, they cost like $5k. I don't think many people are going to spend that. I agree completely. But the OP didn't put any price constraint or other criteria on his "best" question, so I don't know if this is a "what should I buy?" exercise or just a hypothetical question. I've never even held one, but just based upon what I've read about them over the years I contend that they (assuming they are still in production –– I honestly don't know) would have to be on any list of the best 3 manufacturers of .357 revolvers, absent other criteria that would disqualify them.
My uncle worked on one once quite a few years ago. A speck of dirt/unburned powder/whatever had gotten into the works and caused the hand to rub up a bad burr in the frame window. He said it was finely made and fitted, but the tolerances were too tight. http://www.korthusa.com/revolver_en.htm |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ruger - so far no ILs on their DA revolvers. S&W - current makes have IL. The Ruger LCR has a built in lawyer-lock. No reports yet if it self locks the way S&W locks do. This is unproven in most Massad Ayoob pointed out in a recent article that he has only seen 3 S&W locks lock up all were 44magnum snubbies with very hot hand loads and high recoil. I have never seen a smith lock up ever and have never read a post where it happened to someone only to a friend of a freind. Massad Ayoob is a well respected instructor and I will take his word.......I also dislike the lock and will not own a pistol with one in it.........do what you want but the locks not a big deal unless you are shooting hot handloads. Fairly easy to grind the lock off internally... Yah it requires removing the side plate and hammer, but it retains the PC appearance and doesn't have a gaping hole in it. I've had a couple of Smiths show up in my safe after "too good to let slip by" prices were found. A quick visit to the dremel/bench grinder and the Lawyer Lock is no more. Edit: Oh yah... at OP. I've always been a fan of the Model 19 combat magnum. 
|
|
Don't forget Korth.
I am afraid it is too late, I heard Korth is done and they do not answer their phones anymore. I was at the German "factory" last summer and there was just one guy working there. They were definitely not a factory at that time and were glad to sell more than eight revolvers per month - but those were as close to perfect as it can get! Most American custome shops top that production output. But when it comes to the three top makers of revolvers, I would put Korth on the top of the list, the earlier guns from the time when old Mr. Korth still headed the operation being better than the later ones. |
|
Did I miss something?
19 replies, 271 reads, nobody mentions Freedom Arms? You guys are slippin'.... 
|
|
Quoted:
Did I miss something? 19 replies, 271 reads, nobody mentions Freedom Arms? You guys are slippin'.... I think that most people make the assumption that when seeking a .357mag, they are looking for a DA revolver. |
|
Quoted:
The Cadillac is a Python. Yes. And easilly purchased on Gun Broker/ Auction Arms , etc. 2nd for me would be Smith model 19/66, 3rd would be the 686/586 Smith, followed with honorable mention by the Colt King Cobra and Trooper. Rugers are ugly, purposeful looking guns (the old , out of production Secuity Six series looked good)–– The SP is a nice choice for a hideaway gun and would be one of my first choices for a CCW revolver , but the GP gives up way too much in the looks department to the Smith for me to consider as a new purchase (Thats just me, and i'm pretty vain and anal ––- appearance matters) Taurus looks like a Smith, ––- but it definitely is not a Smith. Dan Wesson makes some fine revolvers, but their availability is spotty, and if buying used, some years had QC issues reportedly |
|
I bought a half dozen police surplus 38 sp Colt Police Positive revolvers that were built in the 50s and 60s.
I got them for destructive tests. I have found them to be a more desirable action than my S&W and Ruger revolvers. I like to cut an inch off the frame and ream the chambers out to 357 mag. These revolvers are lighter, more elegant, more accurate, and lock up tight after lots of hot loads. |
|
Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Ruger - so far no ILs on their DA revolvers. S&W - current makes have IL. The Ruger LCR has a built in lawyer-lock. No reports yet if it self locks the way S&W locks do. This is unproven in most Massad Ayoob pointed out in a recent article that he has only seen 3 S&W locks lock up all were 44magnum snubbies with very hot hand loads and high recoil. I have never seen a smith lock up ever and have never read a post where it happened to someone only to a friend of a freind. Massad Ayoob is a well respected instructor and I will take his word.......I also dislike the lock and will not own a pistol with one in it.........do what you want but the locks not a big deal unless you are shooting hot handloads. A member here not only had it happen to his Model 357, he took pictures of it while locked up tight as a drum.  |
|
If we are talking double action .357s, then Ruger and Smith & Wesson are the only American companies to consider. If we include single action revos, then we have to add USFA, who makes the best Colt 1873 clones, and Freedom Arms, who make perhaps the best single action revolver anywhere.
Of current production double action revos, my choice is the S&W 627-8PC; 5” barrel, stainless, 8 shot, N frame, seriously accurate, terrific trigger, both double action and single action. |
| I have a S&W M-586 6'' and a S&W 686 4" and both have been worrked on (action jobs) by my departmental armorer. He was responsible for 3300 S&W revolvers at one time and did a hell of a job. Both break like the proverbial 'glass rod' when being fired DA and SA is a real treat. I used to own a Ruger that was originally chambered for .38 spl and was reamed out for .357's. As I recall it was a Security Six and built like a tank. A Buddy wanted to get a 'House Gun' and could not afford a new one and the Ruger was just getting dusty in my vault so I sold it to him for what I paid for it. One of the things that peeves me about Rugers is all the BS they put on their barrels. |
|
Quoted:
There aren't 3 anymore.
I did not see the limitations to domestic or double action revolvers, but Freedom Arms produces probably the best domestic revolver. Among serious revolver enthusiasts and ISSF shooters the Manurhin MR73 is highly valued. I agree! The MR 73 is definitively one of the best revolvers! |
I just picked up a LNIB GP-100 for $350.00 and they have some for $299.00 without the box, I found this over on one of the Ruger forums.
We have many Rugers remaining. We received these Rugers from a local security company whose Federal security contract expired this spring. These Rugers are like new! Some have the original box, some have just a random Ruger box and some came wrapped in bubble wrap with no box. So, if you want one of these revolvers this is what I need- A hard copy of your local FFL dealer, either faxed or emailed to me. Acceptable payments are major credit card or a certified/cashiers check sent to us. We are located in New Mexico. Orders shipped outside of the Land of Enchantment aka New Mexico will not be charged sales tax! We are a federal firearms dealer and will only ship to a FFL. Call Julie if you have any further questions at 505-983-3432, (10am to 3pm Monday thru Friday mountain time) This Ruger forum is a whole new world for me so thanks for all the info!! Have a great weekend! ps- I could be scoring another large lot of Beretta 92fs and H&K USP 40. I will keep you posted. Julie V. The Outdoorsman of Santa Fe 530 N Guadalupe St Santa Fe, NM 87501 505-983-3432 505-989-3838 fax [email protected] |