Posted: 5/3/2009 7:18:09 PM EDT
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My father in law wants a revolver for home. He wants it in 38spl. I
think he should get a 357. 1- for the versatility of being able to shoot both, and 2- I think he'd have more of a selection of guns to choose from. I think these are valid, right/wrong?? Though not sure of the 38 playing field, just want him to have his bases covered. He thinks the 357 is too much for the wife, which I believe since she says their 22 kicks. Ex special forces vietnam, but has basically been out of the gun loop since then. What are your thoughts? Also recommendations on model?? I offered up he ruger sp101 or the gp100, I think Smiths are going to be out of his $$$ range. |
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I wouldn't feel undergunned with a 100 year old S&W Military and Police model in .38 Special. The .357 is a better cartridge for the purpose IMO, but the .38 will do the job as long as the shooter does his.
Unless he's set on a new gun, have him look for an older S&W Military and Police/Model 10 with a 4" barrel. There are plenty of them out there for good prices($325 and under). If he IS set on a new gun, then a good DA in .357 is lots easier to find and there isn't any reason you can't load it with .38 specials instead of magnums. |
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A .357 will generally run a bit more than a .38 special so if you're not going to shoot .357, why way the extra? Now, if you find a .357 at the right price, he should go ahead and get it and use .38 spl. The Rugers you mentioned sound good. I'm also betting you may be able to find a decent SW Model 10. J&G Sales has some double action only Model 64s for under $250. Of course, you have to add shipping and a transfer fee but presumably no sales tax.
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| A 38 will do the job just fine for a house gun but if you are talking about him being able to shoot both 38 and 357 because of the availability of ammo the way it is going right now you may use that as a reason to talk him into the 357. But if you mean the 357 is a better round then look at some of the specialty defense ammo for 38 availabe now it is a lot better then it used to be. I would also recommend a S&W Model 10, it is a good weapon for keeping in the night stand but if he wants something he can put in his pocket the Ruger SP101 is a good choice or a S&W J-Frame. |
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If he buys a .357 and never loads it with anything but .38, has it really been all that versatile? If he wants a S&W K frame, does the fact that there's more choices in the .357 really matter?
Properly loaded with something like Speer Gold Dot ammo, a 4 inch .38 can be a very dangerous and effective weapon. I'm less than enthusiatic about shorter barrels, but that's personal opinion. A handloader with a K frame .38 can shoot everything from mousefarts to a 158 grain LSWC at 1150 fps, if he knows where to look for load data. |
| J&G Sales has S&W Model 64s for sale for a decent price. They are converted to DAO, which I think sucks, but the weapon, in stock form, sounds like just the ticket. Light enough for a small or elderly woman to be able to handle it, yet heavy enough that recoil is not a problem. Four inch barrels. |
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J&G Sales has S&W Model 64s for sale for a decent price. They are converted to DAO, which I think sucks, but the weapon, in stock form, sounds like just the ticket. Light enough for a small or elderly woman to be able to handle it, yet heavy enough that recoil is not a problem. Four inch barrels. DAO is easily fixed. ( new/used hammer ) It's actually not a bad feature for a novice. A model 64 in DAO would be an excellent HD handgun. |
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642 is fine but who in their right mind would choose a J for a house gun? You don't need it to be small OR light, and those things are bad. ^^ why?? it's very light so recoil will be very strong. it has a very short barrel, so accuracy will be very bad and muzzle flash will be very bright. it's designed to be a carry gun; if you aren't looking to carry one all day long, find something else (something with a heavier frame, lighter trigger, and longer barrel). |
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+1 on the 64, whether of not from jg sales, though i would prefer the 357 personally
the bobbed hammer/fixed sights makes it "snag resistant." easy to stuff and draw from between the mattress and box spring. i dont see the SA ability as a plus in a defensive revolver except for relatively skilled shooters in limited, special circumstances (i.e. the fabled hostage rescue shot). the round butt versions with slim pachmyer carry grips fills my hand well (im 6'1" with big hands) and are the only revolver grips my gf (5'3, small hands) enjoys. probability for a confrontation in a low-light type of setting is pretty high for a HD peice. Might want to think about night sights/lasergrips. And definitly practice onehanded/hand held taclight shooting extensively. |
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recoil is relative and subjective.
what 22 beast do they have? fyi, most snubbies have really stiff/heavy triggers including teh SP101, so you will have to think about that too. you can go with a "heavier" gun, but will she be able to lift/handle it? also, if its "too heavy" or the "recoil" is too much or the trigger is too heavy, chances are she wont want to shoot/practice w/it. many times a better/softer grip can help with the recoil. also, learning how to handle the gun/recoil can help alot too. sometimes its just the preception of the "bang" that makes the "recoil" worse. you can go with the 357mag route, but i would do some testing/training with her before you settle on anything. take them to a gun rental range and do some testing if possilbe. |
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BTW I firmly believe that DAO is the only way to go for a defensive revolver. You an get a lighter pull that way, and you shouldn't be cocking it anyway. LOL wut? 3-5 pounds SA versus 8-9 pounds DA Pull weights any lighter than that in DA are probably going to result in failures to fire. |
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what 22 beast do they have? Some kind of 22short, auto I think, never seen it. Thanks for all the advice, combat jack, and others, thanks for breakdown on the 642. Just asked cause that was in his $$ range, when I was lookin @GB. I love the 686, probably on the high end of his $$$, and prob to big for the mom in law. I know Taurus are not the greatest, but advice on them, 608 or tracker?? |
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just another thought.... my father who will turn 70 this year has terrible arthritis, When he first moved to Florida he got his CHL and bought a Taurus PT111 in 9mm, he like how it felt when he carried it. When he drove to my house in TX he brought it along so we can go shooting together. He had not fired the pistol yet. At the range he loaded up for the first time and half way through the trigger pull he finger lost strength from the arthritis. He had to really struggle to pull the trigger all the way and even though he hit the paper at 7 yards, it was all over the paper. After we reviewed how he did and how his hand felt I let him try my Beretta 92FS and he managed to fire that no problem and had a respectable group on the paper at 7 yards. When we got home, we reviewed again, I let him load up with snap caps and we talked about how his hand felt. When he went back to FL he started looking for a pistol which not only fit his hand good, but he had no problem pulling the trigger. He settled for a S&W 637 in .38 Spc +p. If he had to he can pull the hammer back and fire with good accuracy and no trouble from his arthritis. I tried it myself as my trigger finger is starting to act up with arthritis and I bought one for myself (S&W 637) Something to think about. For older people it is not just the weight, but pulling the trigger is an issue if there is arthritis present. |
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My father in law wants a revolver for home. He wants it in 38spl. I think he should get a 357. 1- for the versatility of being able to shoot both, and 2- I think he'd have more of a selection of guns to choose from. I think these are valid, right/wrong?? Though not sure of the 38 playing field, just want him to have his bases covered. He thinks the 357 is too much for the wife, which I believe since she says their 22 kicks. Ex special forces vietnam, but has basically been out of the gun loop since then. What are your thoughts? Also recommendations on model?? I offered up he ruger sp101 or the gp100, I think Smiths are going to be out of his $$$ range. If his wife thinks 22 kicks then that would be the reason he wants a .357 as oppossed to a .357 Mag . A nice Model 10 in .357 would be just fine. as .357 is just the dia of the bullet and 38 special would describe the lenght of the case. But yes some would want a .357 Mag and shoot .38 specials in it. Some would buy a K-38 Masterpiece (Mod-14) .38 special ,that will mostly outshoot the other newer revolvers. A smith mod -14 will cost less than a sp101. about 350.00. Bob 
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I offered up the semi auto, but "my service 45 in vietnam was horrible"
was his response. Wanted no part of a 357, "connie's father has one the thing is a cannon, the barrel is huge" Plus he didn't like the idea of being able to shoot 3 different calibers from one gun. He's like the guy that will make an excuse, if it's not his way. don't get me wrong, great guy but can't give him advice. but anyways, he picked up a smith snubby 38 special. I haven't seen it, but told me where he got it, which I told him to go to another place for a bigger/better selection, so he got either a 442 or 642. 
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I offered up the semi auto, but "my service 45 in vietnam was horrible" was his response. Wanted no part of a 357, "connie's father has one the thing is a cannon, the barrel is huge" Plus he didn't like the idea of being able to shoot 3 different calibers from one gun. He's like the guy that will make an excuse, if it's not his way. don't get me wrong, great guy but can't give him advice. but anyways, he picked up a smith snubby 38 special. I haven't seen it, but told me where he got it, which I told him to go to another place for a bigger/better selection, so he got either a 442 or 642. Just as a point for discussion's sake, in the 1911 pistol trials, the Colt 1911 was actually more reliable than the revolver. |
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I offered up the semi auto, but "my service 45 in vietnam was horrible" was his response. Wanted no part of a 357, "connie's father has one the thing is a cannon, the barrel is huge" Plus he didn't like the idea of being able to shoot 3 different calibers from one gun. He's like the guy that will make an excuse, if it's not his way. don't get me wrong, great guy but can't give him advice. but anyways, he picked up a smith snubby 38 special. I haven't seen it, but told me where he got it, which I told him to go to another place for a bigger/better selection, so he got either a 442 or 642. Just as a point for discussion's sake, in the 1911 pistol trials, the Colt 1911 was actually more reliable than the revolver. They should have run it against the revolvers that were manufactured at the Gov requests(the Colt and S&W mod 1917)to fill in because the other 1911 manufactures couldn't produce enough front line pistols! Bob
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I offered up the semi auto, but "my service 45 in vietnam was horrible" was his response. Wanted no part of a 357, "connie's father has one the thing is a cannon, the barrel is huge" Plus he didn't like the idea of being able to shoot 3 different calibers from one gun. He's like the guy that will make an excuse, if it's not his way. don't get me wrong, great guy but can't give him advice. but anyways, he picked up a smith snubby 38 special. I haven't seen it, but told me where he got it, which I told him to go to another place for a bigger/better selection, so he got either a 442 or 642. Just as a point for discussion's sake, in the 1911 pistol trials, the Colt 1911 was actually more reliable than the revolver. They should have run it against the revolvers that were manufactured at the Gov requests(the Colt and S&W mod 1917)to fill in because the other 1911 manufactures couldn't produce enough front line pistols! Bob
Yeah, test the 1917 model revolvers...in 1911 
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I offered up the semi auto, but "my service 45 in vietnam was horrible" was his response. Wanted no part of a 357, "connie's father has one the thing is a cannon, the barrel is huge" Plus he didn't like the idea of being able to shoot 3 different calibers from one gun. He's like the guy that will make an excuse, if it's not his way. don't get me wrong, great guy but can't give him advice. but anyways, he picked up a smith snubby 38 special. I haven't seen it, but told me where he got it, which I told him to go to another place for a bigger/better selection, so he got either a 442 or 642. Just as a point for discussion's sake, in the 1911 pistol trials, the Colt 1911 was actually more reliable than the revolver. They should have run it against the revolvers that were manufactured at the Gov requests(the Colt and S&W mod 1917)to fill in because the other 1911 manufactures couldn't produce enough front line pistols! Bob
Yeah, test the 1917 model revolvers...in 1911 Officers Target Model DA first issue in .38 special six inch barrell ,Hand finished action Generaly same as the the new Navy made in 1904-1906. I agree all test were in favor of any .45acp ,but you are right I was thinking WW1! Bob
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BTW I firmly believe that DAO is the only way to go for a defensive revolver. You an get a lighter pull that way, and you shouldn't be cocking it anyway. LOL wut? 3-5 pounds SA versus 8-9 pounds DA Pull weights any lighter than that in DA are probably going to result in failures to fire. The DA pull of a DAO revolver is lighter than a similar DA/SA revolver. SA has no place in self defense shooting. |
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BTW I firmly believe that DAO is the only way to go for a defensive revolver. You an get a lighter pull that way, and you shouldn't be cocking it anyway. I mostly agree. I bought my wife a S&W model 60 LS for her defence gun, my friend had almost the same thing in an airweight... One night his wife was home alone and someone was trying to get into the house, so she grabbed the gun and then the baby... her mistake was to cock the hammer before picking up the baby, she bent down to get the child, and the gun went off, and we assume the BG ran off after the gun shot... and she was ok other than shaken up as was the child, she had powder burns on her shirt, and a hole, and the bullet went through the floor into the basement and was found in a 2x4... I have been thinking about bobbing the hammer on my wife's gun.. but I think she would be better off taking some classes instead. My friend traded that airweight after the incident for the 1911 he has been wanting (easy to talk the wife into a gun with a safey after her incident at that point I assume  ).
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BTW I firmly believe that DAO is the only way to go for a defensive revolver. You an get a lighter pull that way, and you shouldn't be cocking it anyway. I mostly agree. I bought my wife a S&W model 60 LS for her defence gun, my friend had almost the same thing in an airweight... One night his wife was home alone and someone was trying to get into the house, so she grabbed the gun and then the baby... her mistake was to cock the hammer before picking up the baby, she bent down to get the child, and the gun went off, and we assume the BG ran off after the gun shot... and she was ok other than shaken up as was the child, she had powder burns on her shirt, and a hole, and the bullet went through the floor into the basement and was found in a 2x4... I have been thinking about bobbing the hammer on my wife's gun.. but I think she would be better off taking some classes instead. My friend traded that airweight after the incident for the 1911 he has been wanting (easy to talk the wife into a gun with a safey after her incident at that point I assume ).Relying on mechanical devices to stave off disaster created by poor training is...not going to stave off disaster. |
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I have a S&W Model 10 Police .38 special, it seems to have plenty of power and accurate as hell, I paid about $230 for mine about a month ago.
I saw some others at a local gun shop going for $300-350 today in the case with some other pricy colt pockets and ww2 walthers. I would suggest the same pistol to anyone, I'm very happy with it. 
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BTW I firmly believe that DAO is the only way to go for a defensive revolver. You an get a lighter pull that way, and you shouldn't be cocking it anyway. I mostly agree. I bought my wife a S&W model 60 LS for her defence gun, my friend had almost the same thing in an airweight... One night his wife was home alone and someone was trying to get into the house, so she grabbed the gun and then the baby... her mistake was to cock the hammer before picking up the baby, she bent down to get the child, and the gun went off, and we assume the BG ran off after the gun shot... and she was ok other than shaken up as was the child, she had powder burns on her shirt, and a hole, and the bullet went through the floor into the basement and was found in a 2x4... I have been thinking about bobbing the hammer on my wife's gun.. but I think she would be better off taking some classes instead. My friend traded that airweight after the incident for the 1911 he has been wanting (easy to talk the wife into a gun with a safey after her incident at that point I assume ).Relying on mechanical devices to stave off disaster created by poor training is...not going to stave off disaster. I agree I have been trying to get my wife and his wife into some classes, but I kinda gave up on his wife... she is just a bitch to my wife... 
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