Posted: 2/13/2014 12:18:32 PM EDT
I am thinking about getting a single action, 45colt, maybe 44mag. I bought a Taurus Gaucho once..... traded it off at the very next gun show. POS shot about 1' high at 20'. I want something that shoots to POA, like all my other guns. None of this "6 o'clock hold" BS  I'm looking at a Pietta or a Ruger Vato, er, I meen Vaquero. Do both of them shot to POA? How is the quality and service life on the Pietta? Does it have the fireing pin on the hammer and needs to be carried on an empty chamber?
These are both available local for me, but I'm open to other suggestions. I'm wanting polished nickel or SS and 4~" barrel, 45 or maybe 44. |
| The only way to guarantee the gun hits to your point of aim is adjustable sights. Most fixed sight guns should be close but there's no promises. Plus most older style revolvers will normally utilize a six o'clock hold. That was the standard for eons, the point of aim thing is comparatively recent. |
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I can't afford the super high end custom guns, but Ruger SA guns (with a few cheap tweaks) are pretty sweet to shoot. Installation of a Wolf spring kit and minimal polish of mating surfaces, gives you a nice 3-3.5# trigger. I have several Ruger handguns (all stainless) and they have served me well, for the money, the quality is hard to beat.
http://s882.photobucket.com/user/jscheel1/media/DSC00472_zpsf86c52f9.jpg.html?sort=3&o=13 |
| sounds like you need a stainless blackhawk with adjustable sights then --- lots of guys with fixed sight single actions experiment with up to 20 or 30 different loads to get one that shoots closest to point of aim, - even with USFA's and Colts that are 3x what a Ruger cost |
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sounds like you need a stainless blackhawk with adjustable sights then --- lots of guys with fixed sight single actions experiment with up to 20 or 30 different loads to get one that shoots closest to point of aim, - even with USFA's and Colts that are 3x what a Ruger cost Ruger FTW. Had a 7.5" stainless Super Blackhawk I wish was still with me. Looking to get another. |
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Ruger FTW. Had a 7.5" stainless Super Blackhawk I wish was still with me. Looking to get another. Quoted:
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sounds like you need a stainless blackhawk with adjustable sights then --- lots of guys with fixed sight single actions experiment with up to 20 or 30 different loads to get one that shoots closest to point of aim, - even with USFA's and Colts that are 3x what a Ruger cost Ruger FTW. Had a 7.5" stainless Super Blackhawk I wish was still with me. Looking to get another. I really like fixed sights. How come it is hard to have a SA revolver shoot to POA? All of my 1911s and 38 DA revolvers shoot to POA perfectly. Any load. |
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I really like fixed sights. How come it is hard to have a SA revolver shoot to POA? All of my 1911s and 38 DA revolvers shoot to POA perfectly. Any load. Quoted:
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sounds like you need a stainless blackhawk with adjustable sights then --- lots of guys with fixed sight single actions experiment with up to 20 or 30 different loads to get one that shoots closest to point of aim, - even with USFA's and Colts that are 3x what a Ruger cost Ruger FTW. Had a 7.5" stainless Super Blackhawk I wish was still with me. Looking to get another. I really like fixed sights. How come it is hard to have a SA revolver shoot to POA? All of my 1911s and 38 DA revolvers shoot to POA perfectly. Any load. Because a .44 Mag Vaquero can shoot mouse-fart .44 Special Trail Boss loads and Magnum full house, 300gr, W296 buffalo killers, and everything in between. And that can affect POI. .45 ACP and .38 Special have much narrower performance margins. The .45 Colt also has a pretty wide range of loads available too. It's unreasonable to expect Buffalo Bore Heavy Magnum loads to shoot to the same POI as Hornady Cowboy loads. A Blackhawk is a very practical choice as it can accommodate POI variations. You won't be locked into whatever loads shoot perfectly for you. |
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Because a .44 Mag Vaquero can shoot mouse-fart .44 Special Trail Boss loads and Magnum full house, 300gr, W296 buffalo killers, and everything in between. And that can affect POI. .45 ACP and .38 Special have much narrower performance margins. The .45 Colt also has a pretty wide range of loads available too. It's unreasonable to expect Buffalo Bore Heavy Magnum loads to shoot to the same POI as Hornady Cowboy loads. A Blackhawk is a very practical choice as it can accommodate POI variations. You won't be locked into whatever loads shoot perfectly for you. Quoted:
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sounds like you need a stainless blackhawk with adjustable sights then --- lots of guys with fixed sight single actions experiment with up to 20 or 30 different loads to get one that shoots closest to point of aim, - even with USFA's and Colts that are 3x what a Ruger cost Ruger FTW. Had a 7.5" stainless Super Blackhawk I wish was still with me. Looking to get another. I really like fixed sights. How come it is hard to have a SA revolver shoot to POA? All of my 1911s and 38 DA revolvers shoot to POA perfectly. Any load. Because a .44 Mag Vaquero can shoot mouse-fart .44 Special Trail Boss loads and Magnum full house, 300gr, W296 buffalo killers, and everything in between. And that can affect POI. .45 ACP and .38 Special have much narrower performance margins. The .45 Colt also has a pretty wide range of loads available too. It's unreasonable to expect Buffalo Bore Heavy Magnum loads to shoot to the same POI as Hornady Cowboy loads. A Blackhawk is a very practical choice as it can accommodate POI variations. You won't be locked into whatever loads shoot perfectly for you. I've shot +p in my 45acp and POI was the same and I've shot 44spec in my redhawk, same POI. I've shot 38 and 357 in 2 revolvers, same thing. I know what you are saying; I've heard it before, but not my expieriance. 
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Adjust your point of aim or file that front sight .
As the previous posters have pointed out , these fixed sights can be adjusted to your desired point of aim . I prefer the 6 O'clock hold but would not hesitate to file the front sight if I liked the gun and merely wished to change POI . My recommendation would be a Colt's revolver 2nd Gen . |
| Aasg no such thing as a gun to shoot to poa with any load variations in bullet weight and velocity guns will change poi especially if you shoot at a reasonable range ( meaning none of this ten yards and closer only bs) if you have a 1911 that is poa at 25 yards with 230 ball it is impossible for it to still shoot to poa with 185 jhp or 200 target swc . This is the down fall of fixed sights they can't be readily adjusted for different loads |
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I'm with you, I much prefer fixed sight revolvers. Uberti's have been wonderful handguns for me. I currently own two in .44 Special and they both, expectedly, shot low when I got them. Like someone else said, they come with tall front sights so they can be regulated, which is exactly what I did. I regulated the sights on both mine with my hunting load (255 - 260 gr. SWC @ 1000 fps) and they shoot plenty close at 50 yds. with my practice load (255- 260 gr. SWC @ 850 fps).
I wanted a 45 Colt and decided on a 4 3/4" Vaquero for no real other reason than it can be loaded a little hotter than a Uberti and I planned to hunt with it. So far, it hasn't been worth the extra 100 fps or so I gain from the Vato. First the bolt drags the cylinder making a line around the cylinder which irritates me to no end, so I had to make a new hammer plunger to correct this problem. Next the trigger pull was horrible, so I had to install a Wolff spring kit and work on the trigger/hammer engagement. Next it shot 4" left @ 25 yds. and low. The low was no problem, but the only way to correct the windage is to bend the front sight slightly to the left. Finally it wasn't all that accurate and I found the cylinder throats were too small relative to the barrels groove diameter. So I had to send it to the Cylindersmith to have that corrected. Now the accuracy is better but there's still the windage issue. The Ruger does have a transfer bar so you can carry six rounds. If you buy a Colt repro it doesn't have a transfer BUT the newer models have a pivoting block that when the hammer is in the half-cock (safe) position, prevents the hammer from falling on a loaded round. My Uberti's are both a little older and don't have this feature, but I carry them (GASP!!) loaded with 6 rounds and on half-cock. Seriously, unless you're a clumsy oaf prone to falling and dropping firearms or think you may be rolling around on the floor of a saloon in a fist fight while wearing your pistol, I'd say the odds of an accidental discharge are infinimently low. If I had it to do again, I'd have bought another Uberti instead of the Ruger. The one thing the Ruger has over Uberti's are the sights. Typically Uberti's come with a small narrow V rear sight and a tapered or "pinched" front blade. I took both my Uberti's a machine shop and one of my Dad's buddies milled the V groove out to a 1/8" notch, about the same as the Vaqueros. Then by the time I filed the front sight down to regulate them, it was down to the thicker portion of the sight, and I had a pretty arn good sighting system. |
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I'm with you, I much prefer fixed sight revolvers. Uberti's have been wonderful handguns for me. I currently own two in .44 Special and they both, expectedly, shot low when I got them. Like someone else said, they come with tall front sights so they can be regulated, which is exactly what I did. I regulated the sights on both mine with my hunting load (255 - 260 gr. SWC @ 1000 fps) and they shoot plenty close at 50 yds. with my practice load (255- 260 gr. SWC @ 850 fps). I wanted a 45 Colt and decided on a 4 3/4" Vaquero for no real other reason than it can be loaded a little hotter than a Uberti and I planned to hunt with it. So far, it hasn't been worth the extra 100 fps or so I gain from the Vato. First the bolt drags the cylinder making a line around the cylinder which irritates me to no end, so I had to make a new hammer plunger to correct this problem. Next the trigger pull was horrible, so I had to install a Wolff spring kit and work on the trigger/hammer engagement. Next it shot 4" left @ 25 yds. and low. The low was no problem, but the only way to correct the windage is to bend the front sight slightly to the left. Finally it wasn't all that accurate and I found the cylinder throats were too small relative to the barrels groove diameter. So I had to send it to the Cylindersmith to have that corrected. Now the accuracy is better but there's still the windage issue. The Ruger does have a transfer bar so you can carry six rounds. If you buy a Colt repro it doesn't have a transfer BUT the newer models have a pivoting block that when the hammer is in the half-cock (safe) position, prevents the hammer from falling on a loaded round. My Uberti's are both a little older and don't have this feature, but I carry them (GASP!!) loaded with 6 rounds and on half-cock. Seriously, unless you're a clumsy oaf prone to falling and dropping firearms or think you may be rolling around on the floor of a saloon in a fist fight while wearing your pistol, I'd say the odds of an accidental discharge are infinimently low. If I had it to do again, I'd have bought another Uberti instead of the Ruger. The one thing the Ruger has over Uberti's are the sights. Typically Uberti's come with a small narrow V rear sight and a tapered or "pinched" front blade. I took both my Uberti's a machine shop and one of my Dad's buddies milled the V groove out to a 1/8" notch, about the same as the Vaqueros. Then by the time I filed the front sight down to regulate them, it was down to the thicker portion of the sight, and I had a pretty arn good sighting system. Wow, your ruger had a lot of problems.
To others: I COMPLETELY understand fileing the front sight. My Taurus Gaucho SHOT WAY WAY WAY HIGH (like a foot at 20 feet) Shooting HIGH would meen grinding down the REAR sight, ie; FRAME! FUCK TAURUS! I think I'll try the uberti from Cabelas when I get more points on my cabelas card. |
| There's no better single action than the Rugers. Any fixed sight gun is going to vary depending on ammunition used but I've found with my fixed sight New Vaquero Bisley that it shoots POA with good ammo. Crappy ammo groups differently, that's a fact of life. I'm no fan of Taurus and there are some very well made Italian replicas but I prefer American guns and I've never had a problem with a Ruger. If you like fixed sight single actions you won't do better than a Ruger. |
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To others: I COMPLETELY understand fileing the front sight. My Taurus Gaucho SHOT WAY WAY WAY HIGH (like a foot at 20 feet) Shooting HIGH would meen grinding down the REAR sight, ie; FRAME! FUCK TAURUS! I think I'll try the uberti from Cabelas when I get more points on my cabelas card. 
No need to yell . No one was yelling at you , just trying to help thats all . |
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No need to yell . No one was yelling at you , just trying to help thats all . Quoted:
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To others: I COMPLETELY understand fileing the front sight. My Taurus Gaucho SHOT WAY WAY WAY HIGH (like a foot at 20 feet) Shooting HIGH would meen grinding down the REAR sight, ie; FRAME! FUCK TAURUS! I think I'll try the uberti from Cabelas when I get more points on my cabelas card.
No need to yell . No one was yelling at you , just trying to help thats all . People kept reiterating about filing the front sight. That wouldn't work on mine. |