Posted: 8/23/2013 5:30:51 AM EDT
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What's the difference between the regular models like a 442 that would need a price increase I'd almost double just for the shield or body guard models?
I googled and besides material, I can't really tell. This will be my first revolver purchase. |
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Smith basically has three types of J frames
Exposed hammer guns, these are generally SA/DA but a few can have the hammers ground down for DAO firing. Models 36,37, 60 Enclosed Hammer guns, these have the hump back and are DAO firing. Models 442, 642, 640 Shrouded Hammer guns, these have a hump but the top of the hammer is exposed. These are SA/DA firing. Models 49, 649, 638 The newer Bodyguard is different design with enclosed hammer and internal laser sight system. CD |
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Smith basically has three types of J frames Exposed hammer guns, these are generally SA/DA but a few can have the hammers ground down for DAO firing. Models 36,37, 60 Enclosed Hammer guns, these have the hump back and are DAO firing. Models 442, 642, 640 Shrouded Hammer guns, these have a hump but the top of the hammer is exposed. These are SA/DA firing. Models 49, 649, 638 The newer Bodyguard is different design with enclosed hammer and internal laser sight system. CD So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? |
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. 
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You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. |
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these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. 360pd is an AirWeight. Scandium frame with titanium cylinder. I have the 340pd(shrouded hammer) it's a pretty sweet little revolver only 11-12oz. |
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these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. |
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Yep.... They charge more because scandium (added to the aluminum for strength ) and titanium are more difficult to work with. The biproduct is a revolver that's lighter and stronger/ more rigid allowing it to handle magnum pressures. but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. |
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There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. can you rank it in order of good to bad? the internals are the same right? |
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but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. Quoted:
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Yep.... They charge more because scandium (added to the aluminum for strength ) and titanium are more difficult to work with. The biproduct is a revolver that's lighter and stronger/ more rigid allowing it to handle magnum pressures. but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. I don't think you can go wrong with a 442. What's there to brag about having scandium? |
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I don't think you can go wrong with a 442. What's there to brag about having scandium? Quoted:
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Yep.... They charge more because scandium (added to the aluminum for strength ) and titanium are more difficult to work with. The biproduct is a revolver that's lighter and stronger/ more rigid allowing it to handle magnum pressures. but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. I don't think you can go wrong with a 442. What's there to brag about having scandium? Its so light its ridiculous, much more comfortable to pocket carry than a steel frame revolver. But I bought my 340pd used for about 600$. I would never pay full retail for one. |
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but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. Quoted:
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Yep.... They charge more because scandium (added to the aluminum for strength ) and titanium are more difficult to work with. The biproduct is a revolver that's lighter and stronger/ more rigid allowing it to handle magnum pressures. but if i only want to shoot 38 all i need is the 442 then. but id like to have the scadi just to say i haveit. Pay more to have a less shootable gun? Makes no sense. It almost guarantees you won't practice much with it. Who exactly do you want to "say you have it" to? Why? IMO, there is no practical advantage to using the scandium frames. The aluminum airweight models carry just fine. The scandiums are so light that there can be case separation issues in the ammo on board when it's fired with hot rounds. It's just a bit too much energy on the small frame for shooting magnums comfortably or reliably. I'd be searching for a used, older model with no lock on it personally, but YMMV. Cheers! -JC |
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can you rank it in order of good to bad? the internals are the same right? A good to bad list is hard to make for you. We don't really know how you plan to use it. Is it for carry, back-up gun, range use mostly, just to have and learn revolvers? etc. 3 main frame styles within the S&W J-frame collection. The J-frames are their smallest , most have the "snub-nosed" barrels. Other S&W frame sizes have 2" barrels too. The frame style is as important as the materials. The 3 Js are : Several models in each style exist. Standard - hammer exposed. 637 for example. Bodyguard frame (not the model) - shrouded hammer. 638 is one. Centennial - Internal hammer. It is not "hammerless". 442 as an example. First revolver? An exposed hammer will help you learn revolver manual of arms more thoroughly. You can always bob it off later for carry. Hard to go wrong with the Airweight models built on an aluminum alloy frame with a steel cylinder. None of the snubs are fun to shoot. If it's not for frequent carry, the heavier the better for learning to shoot a snub revolver well. Weight also is only a big consideration if pocket carried. Pocket carry is not for me and a steel or aluminum revolver carry fine in a holster. Good luck. The S&W line is huge and can be overwhelming. But first define what the tool's primary function is and then go from there to narrow things down. Cheers! -JC |
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*SNIP* can you rank it in order of good to bad? the internals are the same right? As someone else mentioned, there really is not "good to bad" as it all depends on what you're looking for with it. That said, if you're looking for a back up gun or pocket carry gun, a j frame is an option. I personally would just get a 442/642 as .38+P really is the most you want use out of a 2" or less barrel. Also, for the price of the scandium frame J frames, you can get a 442/642 and a case of ammo which, in my book, puts you a lot farther ahead than just having a super lightweight revolver.... Again, YMMV, but it all depends on what you're looking for. |
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There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. 442is a scad fram too |
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As someone else mentioned, there really is not "good to bad" as it all depends on what you're looking for with it. That said, if you're looking for a back up gun or pocket carry gun, a j frame is an option. I personally would just get a 442/642 as .38+P really is the most you want use out of a 2" or less barrel. Also, for the price of the scandium frame J frames, you can get a 442/642 and a case of ammo which, in my book, puts you a lot farther ahead than just having a super lightweight revolver.... Again, YMMV, but it all depends on what you're looking for. Quoted:
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*SNIP* can you rank it in order of good to bad? the internals are the same right? As someone else mentioned, there really is not "good to bad" as it all depends on what you're looking for with it. That said, if you're looking for a back up gun or pocket carry gun, a j frame is an option. I personally would just get a 442/642 as .38+P really is the most you want use out of a 2" or less barrel. Also, for the price of the scandium frame J frames, you can get a 442/642 and a case of ammo which, in my book, puts you a lot farther ahead than just having a super lightweight revolver.... Again, YMMV, but it all depends on what you're looking for. ithink i am getting the 442, and maybe a xds 9 |
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442is a scad fram too Quoted:
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So basically it's like old model versus new technology? But should it be almost double? You'd help us by listing model numbers, IMO. I'm betting you're looking at some of the Scandium framed guns versus the older style aluminum alloyed framed models. The Scandium models are indeed a bit pricier than their brothern. Again, give us some specifics & we can nail down better answers for you. these are the ones I want, all I can really tell beside the hammer/hammerless 442 340mp 340scpd 360pd they pretty much look the same, but like I said, I think the internals maybe different and the allow material. There are significant differences between those options. The 442 is an aluminum alloy frame with steel cylinder The 340MP is a scandium alloy frame with a steel cylinder The 360PD is a scandium alloy frame with a titanium cylinder. The differences in cost you're seeing are related to materials, production costs and margin built into making smaller runs of the scandium framed revolvers. 442is a scad fram too That's news to me. The Smith & Wesson website clearly lists the 442 as being an aluminum alloy frame. Cite Please cite your source, if I'm wrong I'd like to know. |
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It clearly lists the material as aluminum alloy frame, carbon steel cylinder. The "overview" section is stock language that is incorrect. Quoted:
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first sentence on that site says scad alloy, is tjat not scadim ? It clearly lists the material as aluminum alloy frame, carbon steel cylinder. The "overview" section is stock language that is incorrect. So the stats are right, the description if off. That's super miss leading. |
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Of the ones listed, my recommendation for you would be the 442.
I have several J-frames, from all steel, airweights, to a scad/titatium. The one I actually use is a 642. It weighs a tad more than the super-lightweights, but frankly that scad/ti kicks like a mule. I actually practice with the 642, and carries easily in the real world. Overall, the 442 you have listed is the best combination of carryability, shootability, and value. You can change out the grips to give you better control, better concealability, etc. depending on your needs. Some grips will add bulk, but make it easier to shoot. Some will make it easy to hide/carry, but a PITA to shoot. Some are good comprimises. The factory rubber J-frame grip is a useable compromise to get you started. You can experiment and see what works for you. It would be hard to go wrong with the 442. |
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While I do like the 442 and the other Centennial frames there is an advantage to having a hammer that can be manipulated. Not at all so single action can be used though (in fact, IMO, all carry revolvers should rendered be DAO).
It's so you can index the cylinder to do a check to be sure there is ammo in all the holes, are no high primers or separated cases. It's also nice to thumb the hammer on re-holstering so as to keep a ND at bay. If you use a holster with a thumb break a retention strap it works better with a hammer too. My first choice in a j-frame revolver is a "Bodyguard" frame. The 638 being the most widely available example. The hammer is shrouded to be snag-free, but is there to use when you need to. A traditional revolver with the hammer bobbed is next best IMO. Cheers! -JC |
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I prefer the Scandium guns for carrying it as a backup.
The 442 and 642 are gentle shooters and the Scandium isn't bad at all with .38 loads. If you are not and active shooter that trains a lot and slightly recoil sensative I'd stay away from the Scandium .357 guns. I don't mind them but they do have a sharp recoil. Obviously the easiest J-frame to shoot is a 640 and the easiest to carry is a 342 so it's up to you to choose what gear fits your mission. |