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Page Handguns » H&K
Posted: 12/20/2005 4:21:31 AM EDT
Hey guys,

I don't know a lot about HK's so help me out. I've been considering buying a P2000 LEM (9mm) so I've been doing some research. From what I can tell, The P2000 was designed to basically replace the USPc and from what I've read, the P2000 is as good or better then the USPc in just about every catagory.

Assuming that's true, why does it seem like the USPc is much more popular then the P2000? I know the USPc are less expensive and has more trigger options. Are those the primary reasons the USPc's are more popular or does the USPc have some other advantage(s) that I'm not aware of?

Thanks
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 6:34:04 AM EDT
I passed on the P2000 because of the extremely long trigger pull. However the module grip does feel great. HK quality exist in both. If you have a chance to rent and shoot both do so.

That said, you might want to wait a little while until the P3000 is released before making a decision.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 6:45:48 AM EDT
Hey Marc, Thanks for the input


Originally Posted By M4arc:
That said, you might want to wait a little while until the P3000 is released before making a decision.



I've seen some stuff about the P3000 but I was under the impression that the P3000 was larger, designed to replace the full size USP were as the P2000 replaces the USP Compacts? I'm looking for something I can use for CCW that is why I'm leaning towards the P2000. Am I off?

One thing I do not like about the P3000 is the finger grooves (same thing I do not like about the Gen 3 Glocks). Not sure if the front strap will be replaceable on that model?
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 7:19:35 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/20/2005 7:28:04 AM EDT by M4arc]

Originally Posted By cgv69:
Hey Marc, Thanks for the input


Originally Posted By M4arc:
That said, you might want to wait a little while until the P3000 is released before making a decision.



I've seen some stuff about the P3000 but I was under the impression that the P3000 was larger, designed to replace the full size USP were as the P2000 replaces the USP Compacts? I'm looking for something I can use for CCW that is why I'm leaning towards the P2000. Am I off?

One thing I do not like about the P3000 is the finger grooves (same thing I do not like about the Gen 3 Glocks). Not sure if the front strap will be replaceable on that model?



You might be right about the P3000 being full size. The P2000 is roughly the same size as my USP9c so it makes sense the P3000 is a full size.

ETA: If you can get used to the trigger it would make a fine CCW. I'm just more of a SA/GA guy. The only DA/SA gun I shoot well is the big USP45.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 11:40:35 AM EDT

Originally Posted By M4arc:

Originally Posted By cgv69:
Hey Marc, Thanks for the input


Originally Posted By M4arc:
That said, you might want to wait a little while until the P3000 is released before making a decision.



I've seen some stuff about the P3000 but I was under the impression that the P3000 was larger, designed to replace the full size USP were as the P2000 replaces the USP Compacts? I'm looking for something I can use for CCW that is why I'm leaning towards the P2000. Am I off?

One thing I do not like about the P3000 is the finger grooves (same thing I do not like about the Gen 3 Glocks). Not sure if the front strap will be replaceable on that model?



You might be right about the P3000 being full size. The P2000 is roughly the same size as my USP9c so it makes sense the P3000 is a full size.

ETA: If you can get used to the trigger it would make a fine CCW. I'm just more of a SA/GA guy. The only DA/SA gun I shoot well is the big USP45.



+1 me too

I think you answered your own question regarding the popularity of the USPc. I chose it due to the fact I could carry cocked and locked OR locked with a round chambered hammer down.

I tried shooting the LEM and although travel is smooth I wasn't a fan of it's length. Probably just a familiarity thing, but it was enough to make up my mind.

var.1 USPc in .40 was my choice.

either way you're buying a great pistol...really can't go wrong.
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:09:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By cgv69:
Hey guys,

.....from what I've read, the P2000 is as good or better then the USPc in just about every catagory.




Disagree. P2000 is basically a USP Compact with slightly different ergonomics. However, the P2000 will never be better than my USP Compact until it comes with two important features: .45ACP chambering and single action only (variant 9)
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 5:46:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/20/2005 9:40:12 PM EDT
i bought the p2000 and while i liked how it fit my hand i couldn't get accustomed to the trigger. so i sold it.

Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:25:43 AM EDT
Thanks for the input everybody. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something like being unaware of some important feature or flaw. Thanks again.
Link Posted: 12/21/2005 3:43:35 AM EDT
I've never shot a 2000, but I have several thousand rounds through my USPc .40 with an LEM trigger. Great pistol.
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:25:38 PM EDT
P2000 in .40 is now my favorite pistol. It take time to get used to the trigger,
but it is not heavy, especially after replacing the firing pin block spring. Mine now breaks cleanly @ ~6lbs
and is much smoother than my glock 19 trigger.
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 8:05:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/25/2005 8:07:46 PM EDT by FireMedicDC]
some of you fail to mention that the P2000 is available in Variant 3 (conventional Double Action/Single Action, with decocker)... which is what I have, in .40s&w. ~11lbs DA/4.5lbs SA... which i like alot. This is real similar to the Variant 1 USPc but doesnt have the conventional safety. The trigger isn't that of my 1911, but then again, its not a finicky 1911.

If I were you, I would choose the P2000 for its similar "mid" size of the USPc, but its slimmer, supports ambidextrous controls. Form fitting features with its interchangable backstraps. But skip out on the LEM unless you're going to be duty-carrying in a department that requires Double Action Only pistols. Go V3!

-- O. Jeremy Miles
Link Posted: 1/2/2006 2:33:42 PM EDT
Anyone shot both the 40 and 9mm versions of the LEM 2000? Looking for one to let my gf shoot, but nobody rents them. She loves shooting my P12-45 and USP9, but didn't care for the Glock 23. I am thinking 40 recoil might be a bit much. Thanks.
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 8:41:09 AM EDT
My girlfriend shoots my P2000 .40 (DA/SA though) quite often...

-- OJM
Link Posted: 1/3/2006 5:25:59 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FireMedicDC:
some of you fail to mention that the P2000 is available in Variant 3 (conventional Double Action/Single Action, with decocker)... which is what I have, in .40s&w. ~11lbs DA/4.5lbs SA... which i like alot. This is real similar to the Variant 1 USPc but doesnt have the conventional safety. The trigger isn't that of my 1911, but then again, its not a finicky 1911.

If I were you, I would choose the P2000 for its similar "mid" size of the USPc, but its slimmer, supports ambidextrous controls. Form fitting features with its interchangable backstraps. But skip out on the LEM unless you're going to be duty-carrying in a department that requires Double Action Only pistols. Go V3!

-- O. Jeremy Miles



I have the SK (subcompact) version in a Variant 3 DA/SA w/ decocker. I shoot it better than my full size USP .40
Link Posted: 1/4/2006 3:21:07 PM EDT
I am looking at the P2000 right now for my next pistol. I am lefty and I love the ambi-slide release. I agree with the other folks about liking the SA/DA more than the LEM version
Link Posted: 1/5/2006 11:03:51 AM EDT
The LEM was designed for the Tactical #4> for legal, and other reasons. Law Enforcment Module is not as likely in a time of stress to have an accidental discharge, vs the lighter single action.
Link Posted: 1/6/2006 7:56:39 PM EDT
Just to clarify,

You can get a P2K in a DA/SA variant as well. It's pretty slick. It has a decocker on the rear to the left of the hammer.

Likewise, you can get a USPc (or USPf) with the LEM trigger.

I've owned a P2k with the LEM variant 2. I tried really really hard to make it work for me. I just can't shoot that thing worth a damn. I also own a USPf and a USPc in DA/SA configurations, and I like them a lot more.

I definitely recommend you try the LEM before you buy it. It seems to be a real love / hate thing. I wish I could have loved it. I've never shot the P2k DA/SA variant, but right now I know I definitely like the USPc DA/SA over the P2K LEM.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 11:15:34 AM EDT
I just had a major range day with my brother in law. I have owned an HK P2000 9mm for almost a year, now. My opinion is just that, not an end all and be all of the HK P2000.

While I could easily qualify with it, as far as I am concerned, I can't hit anything with it. With the other hand guns I shot (Sig 228 9mm, Sig 229 .40, Glock 22 .40, Browning Hi-Power 9mm), the 10-ring in the target was basically gone.

With the HK, I shot all over the place, and am very frustrated. I can only equate it to the LEM trigger. The rest of the guns were the traditional SA/DA, SA only, or the glock action.

I don't have an explanation. I am considering selling it, or trading it for an HK USP-C in .45 or for a rifle (Beretta Storm Rifle in .45, Springfield Arms Socom M1 Carbine, AK-47).

Before you buy, I would highly recommend shooting one, first. Let the "coolness" factor die down, and see how you really shoot with it. If all is well, then buy one. I didn't have the luxury of test firing.

mfm691
mfm691cfo@sbcglobal.net
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 11:44:59 AM EDT
Well just to follow up on this. I finally got to fondle both a USPc LEM and a P2000 LEM. Both fit well in my hand (with a slight edge to the P2000) but I see what you guys mean about the LEM trigger. Just drying firing it I could tell it was going to take more time and ammo then I want to use in order to learn how to use it effectively.

I also do not care for HK's style of mag release. Not that there is necessarily anything "wrong" per-say with it. I'm just to use to the normal placement that most other companies use and I can't really see any significant advantage to it that would make it worth learning. I am also not a DA\SA fan so it looks like the HK's are out for me.

I really wanted to like the P2000 (even if they do seem a little over priced) but when it's not right you know it. Thanks for all the input guys.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 1:42:27 PM EDT
Sounds like you're not nearly as impulsive as I am!

Regarding the mag release -- it's actually very nice for me. I can release the mag with the middle finger of my shooting hand without altering my firing grip at all. It's also IMO less likely to be accidentally bumped, because it's out of the way. That's one thing I happen to love about the H/Ks.

I also like how they point a lot like 1911s.
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