Posted: 6/11/2009 3:47:17 PM EDT
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I keep seeing a bunch of threads here asking about the "best" ammo for the little snub nosed revolvers. People trying to wring out the best terminal performance possible out of a small gun. The problem is that terminal performance is the last thing you worry about with ammo selection. More important is reliability & accuracy. The best bullet in the world isnt worth a shit if your wizbang wolff gunspring kit wont set off the hard primer or the wonderbullet hits 4" low and 3" left of point of aim even on a perfect shot.
Fixed sight JFrame revolvers come with the fixed sights factory regulated for a specific weight bullet at a specific velocity at a specific distance. Change any of those factors and they do not shoot to point of aim. For example the sights on my 442 are factory regulated for a 158Gn standard velocity load at 15-yards. 148Gn SV shoots low. 135Gn +P shoots low. 130Gn +P shoots low. 125Gn +P shoots even lower. 125Gn Standard velocity shoots low. 115Gn SV shoots low. 110Gn +P+ shoot really low and left. 66Gn +P shoots really low and right. Whats the best load for your JFrame? The one that shoots to point of aim from your revolver with you behind the trigger. If you find two or three loads that do that then the best load is the most accurate of those. Then you look at muzzle flash and recoil. finally at the very end you can use terminal performance of the projectile as a tie breaker if you find more than one round thats accurate, shoots to point of aim, is reliable, has low muzzle flash and manageble recoil for you. But terminal performance comes last on that list. |
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148Gn SV shoots low. 135Gn +P shoots low. 130Gn +P shoots low. 125Gn +P shoots even lower. 125Gn Standard velocity shoots low. 115Gn SV shoots low. 110Gn +P+ shoot really low and left. 66Gn +P shoots really low and right. Are you noticing a pattern here?? The lighter you go the lower you shoot. You first need to pick a bullet with good performance. and practice shooting with that. if you have to adjust your aim then you can practice that. If you want to shoot 158gr that hits point of aim, carry what makes you feel good.. heavy bullets tend to not gather a whole lot of speed out of snub noses, making semi jhps not expand.. I highly doubt you are going to be taking percision shots in a self defence shoot anyway! most are fast and withen 7-15 yards. if you have time to take percision shots its probably criminal and not self defence! |
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148Gn SV shoots low. 135Gn +P shoots low. 130Gn +P shoots low. 125Gn +P shoots even lower. 125Gn Standard velocity shoots low. 115Gn SV shoots low. 110Gn +P+ shoot really low and left. 66Gn +P shoots really low and right. Are you noticing a pattern here?? The lighter you go the lower you shoot. You first need to pick a bullet with good performance. and practice shooting with that. if you have to adjust your aim then you can practice that. If you want to shoot 158gr that hits point of aim, carry what makes you feel good.. heavy bullets tend to not gather a whole lot of speed out of snub noses, making semi jhps not expand.. I highly doubt you are going to be taking percision shots in a self defence shoot anyway! most are fast and withen 7-15 yards. if you have time to take percision shots its probably criminal and not self defence! A gunfight is no time to be calculating kentucky windage. A flat nosed lead solid through the heart and spine works better than the majic bullet of the day in the abdomin. |
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148Gn SV shoots low. 135Gn +P shoots low. 130Gn +P shoots low. 125Gn +P shoots even lower. 125Gn Standard velocity shoots low. 115Gn SV shoots low. 110Gn +P+ shoot really low and left. 66Gn +P shoots really low and right. Are you noticing a pattern here?? The lighter you go the lower you shoot. You first need to pick a bullet with good performance. and practice shooting with that. if you have to adjust your aim then you can practice that. If you want to shoot 158gr that hits point of aim, carry what makes you feel good.. heavy bullets tend to not gather a whole lot of speed out of snub noses, making semi jhps not expand.. I highly doubt you are going to be taking percision shots in a self defence shoot anyway! most are fast and withen 7-15 yards. if you have time to take percision shots its probably criminal and not self defence! A gunfight is no time to be calculating kentucky windage. A flat nosed lead solid through the heart and spine works better than the majic bullet of the day in the abdomin. I dont think you read what I wrote. Pick the bullet you like and practice with it. You have already answered your question if you say 158 is point of aim for your gun and you are not worried about terminal performance. I dont think gold dot or any other manufacture makes 158 gr hp ammo in 38. most modern sd ammo for 38 is 125-135 mostly because they can get a projectile in that weight to 850fps out of a short barrel and it will expand.. GD comes in 158 in 357 but the bullet will not expand if loaded at 38 velocity. A guy not to long ago cronoed some 158 out of a 2" 38, I want to say it was pushing 450-500 fps. Im not going to say that wont kill someone because we know it will. It just isnt at the top of my list. 135 GD 38 +p is loaded in my J as well as my wifes k frame 4in 357. |
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buffalo bore 158grn soft lead swc-hc. Made for a short barrel and gets good expansion and penetration in the tests I've seen (over 12"). Check brassfetcher. That load penetrates WAY over 12" I can't find the testing on brassfetcher anymore, but I don't remember it over penetrating. I do remember that it got decent expansion and sufficient penetration even from a short barreled weapon. |
| You should start with good SD rounds and only compromise if necessary. If you're forced to old school wadcutters because your gun is far off with good SD loads, then OK. Mine shoots to POA at 7 yards with 125gr Gold Dot Double Tap and Corbon DPX 110gr. These loads both outperform wadcutters in that they have adequate penetration and they expand well. Also remember that you can lower the front sight with a file. It's an SD gun. Less useful if it doesn't shoot POA with actual SD rounds. |
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buffalo bore 158grn soft lead swc-hc. Made for a short barrel and gets good expansion and penetration in the tests I've seen (over 12"). Check brassfetcher. That load penetrates WAY over 12" I can't find the testing on brassfetcher anymore, but I don't remember it over penetrating. I do remember that it got decent expansion and sufficient penetration even from a short barreled weapon. You may be referring to 'Buffalo Bore Ammunition 150gr standard pressure Hard Cast Wad Cutter (Part # 20D)' at http://www.brassfetcher.com/Buffalo%20Bore%20Ammunition%20150gr%20standard%20pressure%20Hard%20Cast%20Wad%20Cutter.html. 23 inches of penetration does seem a bit on the excessive side. When looking for stuff on brassfetcher make sure you go the 'old web site' link. That's where a lot of stuff is. I reallyI like that site. They seem to be very methodical and while I've seen some results that have issues (and they typically acknowledge as such, like the 135 Gold Dot 38 special results as discussed on the THR forum), it's a great source of actual information rather than internet BS. |
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You may be referring to 'Buffalo Bore Ammunition 150gr standard pressure Hard Cast Wad Cutter (Part # 20D)' at http://www.brassfetcher.com/Buffalo%20Bore%20Ammunition%20150gr%20standard%20pressure%20Hard%20Cast%20Wad%20Cutter.html. 23 inches of penetration does seem a bit on the excessive side. Thats the one I was thinking of. |