Posted: 3/18/2017 1:03:57 AM EDT
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Originally posted in General Discussion by mistake instead of here.
I am not an Operator, USPSA Grandmaster, shooting instructor, IDPA Champion, professional reviewer, and have never shot anyone with a pistol. I picked the gun up Wednesday morning the first day it was available to buy. I like Beretta. In the 80s I was a young Infantryman in a Ranger Bn and our rattling, best 1911s with unreliable even more beat magazines were turned in and we got M9s. We bemoaned the loss of 45 for 9mm but these shiny, sexy new pistols were accurate, reliable, and had great mags. They were kicking ass in Letha Weapon and Die Hard. They never really updated the 92, their first polymer framed gun was a failure, there next polymer framed gun lingers on not accepting that it is also a failed platform, and in 2017, Beretta finally enters the striker fired polymer frame market. Price. With the street price at $480.00 with three magazines it is priced competitively. The box is much nicer than the usual breaking clasp flimsy ones we have become accustomed to. It comes with a mag loader, rod, brushes, etc. the one year (three if you register) warranty is not the best out there. 
The grip feels fantastic. It has good texture. The subtle finger grooves should satisfy those that want them, and not be intrusive enough to bother those that hate them. I really like how the gun points. Some problems do occur with the grip. The full sized gun leaves little room to trim the grip for a compact or subcompact version. 
This appears to be due to a combination of the extra large trigger guard and mag release placement. Very reminiscent of the 92. On the 92, this led to not very compact Compacts and no Sub Compacts. The Cougar, PX4, and even the 9000 seemed to have addressed this, while the APX takes a step back. 
Other models of firearms allow for more shortening of the grip. 
Magazines have been available in popular lines and very reliable for decades with a notch or hole in the side. The APX magazine utilize a bulge on the front of the magazine. This complicates things for carry, tactical, and competitive mag pouch designs and options. They look very much like PX4 magazines except for this and the baseplate. The baseplates have a good design. I hope the plastic holds up better than the recent plastic seen in their other pistol lines. I hope the capacity to length ratio issues of the 92 are not present in this design. The front bulge is a very unfavorable design in my opinion. I prefer flush designs. 
The sight design will not appeal to those that like slick no snag carry sights. It is great for tactical, one handed slide actuation. I like the shape of the sights. They seem robust. The proprietary dove tail is an idiotic move. The large front dot and smaller rear dots are above average fast, but not the fastest design I have used. They already easily fill will funk. They provided mediocre accuracy for a service pistol. It would be nice to readily change them. Adjustable fiber optic sights are 109$ on the Beretta site. I find this a turn off, for new novice buyers, competitors, or professionals.. In the day of slide mounted optics, why in the living fvck did they design a striker block disengaged indicator sticking up on the top of the side? I am pulling the damn trigger, what in the world do I need a visible and tactile indicator for? Sheer idiocy. Another step back. The slide serrations I initially wrote off as a styling affectation. They are extremely functional. The most effective and functional ones I have utilized. The shape of the mag release is great and also effective. Placement is suboptimal. A fraction too low for what I feel would be optimal. The slide release I find to be horrible ergonomically. Placement is fine, but if you design a trigger guard large enough for a lineman wearing arctic trigger finger mittens to use, why in the hell make a slide release you can barely feel or actuate with your bare thumb? Plus, I can conceive of no possible reason to make this monstrous ass take down lever, but put a dinky little slide catch on. Almost like an after thought. "Oh shit, that big lever is not the slide release, it's the take down lever, can you squeeze a slide catch in?" Take down is simple. I just pull the trigger. I am not going to use a tool to take it down advertised as a feature that it can be taken down without pulling the trigger. Shooting consisted of 100 rounds of Winchester White box, 100 rounds of Federal Champion, 100 rounds of Fiochhi NATO, and 100 rounds of my subsonic 147 grain Missouri Bullets reloads. Function was flawless. It recoiled more than a 92, PX4, and Cougar I brought. It recoiled less than a Glock 19. It felt similar to an XDM 5.25 I brought, I suspect due to its lower bore axis. It has a favorable recoil impulse. Unfortunately, accuracy was underwhelmingly mediocre. Favorable compared to the Glock 19. Comparable to a Compact PX4, less than the 92. With regards to striker guns, the XDM 5.25 shot circles around it. Two things negatively affected accuracy. The sights were not as fast or precise as the XDM's. And I found the trigger pull and reset better on the XDM. Compared to stock Glocks, initial trigger pull is better and less "sproingy." Reset is a better pull, but longer to get to. They made this huge, flat trigger that should have felt great. But my drop safety does not pull flush. It sticks out over a millimeter. Pressing a thin ridge of a trigger significantly degrades trigger pull quality in my opinion. As far as modularity goes, who cares? Are you really going to buy a bunch of frames and uppers? I would rather just have another full gun. Overall, if you are a Beretta collector, get one. But far better options with cheaper magazines, better factory support, a larger aftermarket, etc. exist. It is not that the gun is horrible, unreliable, or a piece of crap. It's just that there are several models of gun that offer more in the polymer framed, striker fired market. Beretta did some really stupid things with this gun. Things that make it unattractive to a wide variety of users. I was wrong about the grip and slide being for looks, they are very functional. But I was painfully and unfortunately correct about other predictions. I had hoped to be proven wrong. |
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Quoted:
I'm not sure I fully understand your comment about the grip length. Now imagine the trigger guard was bigger and came down another quarter inch on the grip and the mag release was there. Now you can't fit your Pinky on a grip of a gun the size of the G19. This is what will happen to the APX if they trim the grip down for a compact. |
| This is just my uneducated deduction about the slide catch. I would say based off of the shape of it, it was not intended much to be used as a release, as there is no "shelf" or edge on it to press on with your thumb. I would venture to think that they intended the "sling shot" method to be used on this pistol to release the slide, not the catch. |
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They specifically refer to it in documentation as being a slide catch and slide release.
I just don't know how they get to their final products. They are a string of failed platforms at this point. I can't imagine anyone saying, "Let's make a gun too small to be a full on service pistol / comp gun, but be sure it is bigger than a Glock 19." |
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It doesn't bother me I guess. I traditionally run the slide and don't use the catch/release anyways, so that point doesn't bother me honestly. I just picked up one myself today. So far I absolutely love the way it feels in my hand. The medium backstrap that was on it out of the box is what I'm leaving on it. Whether you think that slide design is ugly or attractive, I don't think you can argue it's usefulness and so far I love it. We'll see when I get it to the range.
On a side note, I noticed in one of the Beretta vids about the APX it showed a police officer drawing from a duty type holster. Does it fit in any existing safariland holsters that we know of? |
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Quoted:
This is just my uneducated deduction about the slide catch. I would say based off of the shape of it, it was not intended much to be used as a release, as there is no "shelf" or edge on it to press on with your thumb. I would venture to think that they intended the "sling shot" method to be used on this pistol to release the slide, not the catch. |
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I picked up one this past week. Also got the grey frame.
I'm impressed with some bits, not so impressed with others. It feels good in the hand. And it's taken into account that people have different sized hands by including 3 separate backstraps: S, M, and L. Didn't think I'd like the flat trigger, but it feels better than I expected and am growing to like it. The trigger breaks where it resets, so you don't have to learn to ride the reset. The front sight dot definitely catches the eye and Beretta has fiber optic and tritium sight options coming to market very soon per their US webstore. I like that they went with a modular frame that is user swappable and that each frame includes a magazine release rather than requiring swapping that as well. I thought the trigger assembly was going to be a single enclosed unit ala the G3, so it was disconcerting when the trigger bar went down as the slide stop levers went up, but that was easily sorted. The stock sights are solid metal, not plastic like some makers and the rear sight is plenty solid for charging the pistol on a solid surface. Unimpressive bits: magazine catch. Holy hell. This fits one of my concealed pouches. Exactly one and even that's pushing it. The APX mag fits in the rear pouch on my RCS double mag carrier. Not the front, so I could carry 2, just the rear. It fits the HSGI Taco pouch just fine, but those don't conceal terribly well. So this will have to be an aftermarket fix. I'll be seeing a local kydex holster maker for his input and see what can be done. I'm still a couple of weeks from being able to go to the range because of a recent shoulder surgery, but that hasn't stopped me from dry firing it. As noted above, I'll be replacing the stock sights with the fiber optic front and black blade adjustable rear as soon as they hit the Beretta webstore, which also currently has bulk packaged, red follower APX mags for $29 each before shipping. Their webstore also appears to be the only source of holsters currently available. So I'm debating waiting for aftermarket holsters, getting one when I get the local mag pouch, or getting their 'civilian competition' holster. |
You must have longer thumbs than I do, because this isn't an issue for me at all. I still haven't gotten mine to the range yet either, been so stinking busy with school and family and work that I just haven't had the time. Hopefully this week I'll get to run some rounds through it and my new to me Sig P226 Extreme!! 
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Quoted:
In your review you state that Beretta's first polymer gun was a failure. Are you referring to the 9000S or the PX4 series? Explain why you think that please. Just trying to understand your view point. Horrible ergs. Difficult to manipulate slide. Safety decocker difficult to manipulate. QC issues. Deteriorating grip material. Some guns shipped that fired when decocker. Trigger Horrible. Pulled after little time on market and little consumer interest. |