Posted: 6/1/2012 10:23:55 PM EDT
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Had a fun experience this evening.
My wife, son's girlfriend and I dropped my son off at Ft Leonard Wood, MO. and started home. Low and behold there was one of those very annoying and somewhat questionable rights violation traffic check points. As we sat there for about 20 minutes waiting for the 9 cars in front of us to go through, my wife found our insurance papers. I pulled my DL and CCW permit out. Keep in mind we have sat for about 20 minutes waiting. (The officers were doing three at a time and I am relatively sure they had one drunk because they made him pull his car to the side.) I was fortunate enough to be the first one in the next set of three. Handed the officer my DL, CCW permit and Insurance card. Thirty seconds (30) was about all it took. He looked at the IDs, insurance card and said, "Sir, be careful on the way home. There are a lot of nutty people out there. I trust you are carrying safely. Have a nice night." 
Thank you - Mr. Officer. Hope you made it home safely too. 
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Some states, yes. MO - No, unless asked. However, as more than one instructor noted: Should you have to get out of the car, do you really want to do a, "Assume the position drill?" Even though you don't have to, professional courtesy goes a long way towards helping your case. Now, if someone wants to get their get their panties in wad, you aren't going to win anyways.
I know there are arguments both ways, but I prefer to take the high road as much a possible. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses It is a detention. That is incontestable. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses Seriously? |
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I know there are arguments both ways, but I prefer to take the high road as much a possible.
Until YOU are the one that is on the hood outside the car waiting for K9 to search your car all because of your courtesy, then a hour later told your free to go. Sorry fellow Missourian.... But I find "High Road" to be an interesting choice of words. It beggs the question of: The "Low Road" is when you excercise your rights? |
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I know there are arguments both ways, but I prefer to take the high road as much a possible.
Until YOU are the one that is on the hood outside the car waiting for K9 to search your car all because of your courtesy, then a hour later told your free to go. Sorry fellow Missourian.... But I find "High Road" to be an interesting choice of words. It beggs the question of: The "Low Road" is when you excercise your rights? Yup. I thought about those words when I wrote them. I can fight about it at 10:30 on a Friday night with the wife and son's girlfriend in the car or I can vote. I will chose to vote as often as possible. I vote literally, at the poles and with where I spend my money. The "high road" is choosing not to create a newspaper incident. The "low road" would have been being a complete ass to some poor officer who is doing his best to make a poor situation better. What is he supposed to do? Quit his chosen profession because he doesn't like the laws people vote in? Or make the best of it and make a difference while he can? Just repeating... I am NOT a fan of road blocks as they are in my humble opinion, unconstitutional. Until you help me vote in someone who will do away with them and the screwed up attorneys/judges who keep letting them occur, I will not ruin a fellows night who is being as professional as possible. |
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I know there are arguments both ways, but I prefer to take the high road as much a possible.
Until YOU are the one that is on the hood outside the car waiting for K9 to search your car all because of your courtesy, then a hour later told your free to go. Sorry fellow Missourian.... But I find "High Road" to be an interesting choice of words. It beggs the question of: The "Low Road" is when you excercise your rights? Yup. I thought about those words when I wrote them. I can fight about it at 10:30 on a Friday night with the wife and son's girlfriend in the car or I can vote. I will chose to vote as often as possible. I vote literally, at the poles and with where I spend my money. The "high road" is choosing not to create a newspaper incident. The "low road" would have been being a complete ass to some poor officer who is doing his best to make a poor situation better. What is he supposed to do? Quit his chosen profession because he doesn't like the laws people vote in? Or make the best of it and make a difference while he can? Just repeating... I am NOT a fan of road blocks as they are in my humble opinion, unconstitutional. Until you help me vote in someone who will do away with them and the screwed up attorneys/judges who keep letting them occur, I will not ruin a fellows night who is being as professional as possible. Thanks for the reply. I get where you're coming from. But seriously. Why do you think excercising your rights turns you into someone who is a complete ass? The people I hang with wouldn't be a complete ass about this and I certainly wouldn't be one either. Those who would should get what they deserve. |
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Ah, good old Lost In the Woods. Haven't been back there since basic training. St. Robert Missouri is one of the least desirable places on earth. I work on Fort Wood and agree completely. St. Roberts is like a tick on a dog. Do you like the new barracks at Kansas and Indiana? My dad built those. Never going back! |
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Ah, good old Lost In the Woods. Haven't been back there since basic training. St. Robert Missouri is one of the least desirable places on earth. I work on Fort Wood and agree completely. St. Roberts is like a tick on a dog. Do you like the new barracks at Kansas and Indiana? My dad built those. Never going back! Those the starships? |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses Seriously? yea seriously. Is it right for them to randomly stop you? probably not. Are they doing what they can to catch DWIs? Yeah. So if you have a wife and kids who also drive those roads, you should be a little grateful that theyr doin at least something to make the roads safer. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses Seriously? yea seriously. Is it right for them to randomly stop you? probably not. Are they doing what they can to catch DWIs? Yeah. So if you have a wife and kids who also drive those roads, you should be a little grateful that theyr doin at least something to make the roads safer. Sounds like a lot of your freedoms can be 'reasoned' away from you. I won't defend a position that I haven't taken. You want to believe that I'm against getting the drunks off the road instead of pointing out some faulty logic of yours. Checking for drunks is one thing, but disclosing the CCW thing is another. It doesn't matter if you have nothing to hide. I have been stopped at a checkpoint while carrying concealed. LEO asked me his questions. ( None of which had anything to do with guns/knives.) I answered them and didn't offer anything other than what he requested. Lasted 25 seconds... maybe. I was on my way. |
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??? I have a question. Last time I visited Ft Leonard Wood, the car was searched and I do nobelieveve there is any provision to Check your Gun at the Bar. 
Would you elaborate on that part of the story? Car wasn't searched at the post and other than the normal ID check, nobody asked. Son was in the back seat going in. Colt was in the trunk in the safe during the visit. We had dinner at Cracker Barrel, just up the road and I changed out there. Just in case. Heck, I probably violated some other law I didn't know about. Colt was back on hip when we got ice cream at the new Culver's on the way out of town.
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The three new ones by the double dining facility. Nice, the amount of work going on is incredible. The new buildings are very nice, much nicer than most of the older ones. Some of the "structures" were just embarrassing. You should have seen JBLM before, during and after the buildup. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses Seriously? yea seriously. Is it right for them to randomly stop you? probably not. Are they doing what they can to catch DWIs? Yeah. So if you have a wife and kids who also drive those roads, you should be a little grateful that theyr doin at least something to make the roads safer. Sounds like a lot of your freedoms can be 'reasoned' away from you. I won't defend a position that I haven't taken. You want to believe that I'm against getting the drunks off the road instead of pointing out some faulty logic of yours. Checking for drunks is one thing, but disclosing the CCW thing is another. It doesn't matter if you have nothing to hide. I have been stopped at a checkpoint while carrying concealed. LEO asked me his questions. ( None of which had anything to do with guns/knives.) I answered them and didn't offer anything other than what he requested. Lasted 25 seconds... maybe. I was on my way. I think we had a miscommunication... I never meant that directed at disclosing ccw. You are correct and I 100% agree that if you are not required to disclose ccw then you shouldnt. I was meaning that the checkpoints checking for drunks is not a big deal if you have nothing to hide |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses What we need is protection from you. You sound like Obama: "Let me take care of you because I know what is best for you and you are stupid." |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses Seriously? I hear you. It's very discouraging. 
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses What we need is protection from you. You sound like Obama: "Let me take care of you because I know what is best for you and you are stupid."  haha wtf? how about you elaborate and make a point jackass. Bottom line unless you are a frikin anarchist and want no cops, then having checkpoints to check for drunks is law enforcement
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses What we need is protection from you. You sound like Obama: "Let me take care of you because I know what is best for you and you are stupid." haha wtf? how about you elaborate and make a point jackass. Bottom line unless you are a frikin anarchist and want no cops, then having checkpoints to check for drunks is law enforcementIn my home state it's illegal and it seems to work just fine. Of course drunk driving is stigmatized there, so it's less of a problem. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses What we need is protection from you. You sound like Obama: "Let me take care of you because I know what is best for you and you are stupid." haha wtf? how about you elaborate and make a point jackass. Bottom line unless you are a frikin anarchist and want no cops, then having checkpoints to check for drunks is law enforcementThis isn't Russia... yet. So you don't need to answer, but.... Would you mind disclosing your age? |
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22 and again, wtf? what does that have to do with anything? How bout you and your boy who apparently needs protection from me explain what yalls issue is with random dwi checkpoints? because neither of you has yet to explain thx. no problem, thanks for the insight
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses It is a detention. That is incontestable. By that reasoning... I could press unlawful detention on other drivers for causing traffic jams too. Which is what this sounds like it was causing. |
| I've been pulled over once in MO and I was carrying of course and it was a very positive experience. However it was because I had a headlight out at dark, not for one of the Gestapo checkpoints. I've never ran in to one of those, just heard about them from time to time. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses It is a detention. That is incontestable. By that reasoning... I could press unlawful detention on other drivers for causing traffic jams too. Which is what this sounds like it was causing. The definition of a seizure in the context of an interaction with the police is in Terry v. Ohio. |
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I like st Robert. It's improved over the years for sure. As to driving on base with unregistered weapons - you are playing with fire. If you don't disclose coming through the gate an show them reg papers you run the chance of permanently confiscated gun. None of my guns go on post ever. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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The three new ones by the double dining facility. Nice, the amount of work going on is incredible. The new buildings are very nice, much nicer than most of the older ones. Some of the "structures" were just embarrassing. You should have seen JBLM before, during and after the buildup. Guy I work with was there then. He was as impressed at the order as the scale of that operation. |
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sat for about 20 minutes waiting They're treading on unreasonable detention if you're waiting 20 minutes to get through their checkpoint. haha nice try but nowhere close cowboy. waiting in your vehicle is not detention. And if you have nothing to worry about and nothing to hide, whats the big deal with random checkpoints?? unless your a fan of drunks gettin behind the wheel, get over it and see it as protectin the public from dumbasses It is a detention. That is incontestable. By that reasoning... I could press unlawful detention on other drivers for causing traffic jams too. Which is what this sounds like it was causing. The definition of a seizure in the context of an interaction with the police is in Terry v. Ohio. "whenever a police officer accosts an individual and restrains his freedom to walk away, he has 'seized' that person." Now I'm not too familiar with these police checkpoints but can't you just do a U turn and drive away up until the point you've made contact with the officer? So up until that point you are not detained? |
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By that reasoning... I could press unlawful detention on other drivers for causing traffic jams too. Which is what this sounds like it was causing. The definition of a seizure in the context of an interaction with the police is in Terry v. Ohio. "whenever a police officer accosts an individual and restrains his freedom to walk away, he has 'seized' that person." Now I'm not too familiar with these police checkpoints but can't you just do a U turn and drive away up until the point you've made contact with the officer? So up until that point you are not detained? Depends. U-turns are not always legal. Also, every checkpoint I have been stopped at had police officers waiting for drivers to do just that. I imagine anyone that would have made such a U-turn would have been detained "slightly longer" than those that chose to wait in line like good sheep. Not to mention that EVERY "DUI safety checkpoint" that I have been stopped at has been at like 4 or 5pm, long before drunks would be leaving a bar or going on a beer run. But that is another topic. Editted to kill the quote tree. |