AK Sponsor
Posted: 7/12/2009 6:42:23 PM EDT
|
On an unconverted Rifle how is the reach to the Trigger ?
Is it awkward ? or is it the same as say a Ruger Mini-14 ? Thanks |
| if you've ever handled a Norinco hunter, the reach and trigger geometry are about the same. The 308 does not use the transfer bar link that the the Saigas do, but a long, curvy trigger that extends back from the trigger pin that pulls up and back rather than pivoting right above the trigger |
|
Yes the reach is fine. The trigger is horrendous. Either you:
A. Slam down the trigger with a ton of force very quickly, which may throw your aim off B. Slowly pull the trigger to its fully compressed position, but the gun will fire randomly anywhere from 1sec to 3sec after doing this I am definitely thinking about doing the conversion to move the trigger group forward... but am pondering whether to try to complete it myself, have a gunsmith do it, or sell the gun and buy a converted one. |
|
Quoted:
Yes the reach is fine. The trigger is horrendous. Either you: A. Slam down the trigger with a ton of force very quickly, which may throw your aim off B. Slowly pull the trigger to its fully compressed position, but the gun will fire randomly anywhere from 1sec to 3sec after doing this I am definitely thinking about doing the conversion to move the trigger group forward... but am pondering whether to try to complete it myself, have a gunsmith do it, or sell the gun and buy a converted one. Dude, converting a 308 Saiga is super easy. Mine had the holes for the pistol grip nut and the trigger already. All I needed to do was remove the trigger plate and install all the new parts. I ended up using the original hammer. The holes for the disconnector spring in the Tapco FCG were a bit small so I reamed them out a bit. Other than that no issues. 
|
|
Here is my order from Midway. I went the basic route as you can see from the pic. Figure $100.
ItemID Qty Price Description
–––––––– –––– ––––––- ––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––- 855434 1 $28.87 TAPCO Buttstock AK-47 Stamped Re... 799634 1 $27.22 TAPCO G2 Single Hook Trigger Gro... 254212 1 $17.32 TAPCO SAW-Style Pistol Grip AK-4... 685437 1 $9.49 Krebs Custom Guns Hammer and Tri... 815264 1 $6.59 TAPCO Grip Screw with Bushing AK-47 Postage, Handling & Insurance: $8.88 Order Total: $98.37 |
|
Stock trigger sucks. It's a slightly upward pull, a long bar of a trigger. LOP is long for smaller stature shooters, but they would probably be comfortable with the shorter skeleton stock version.
Conversion is the way to go. http://i323.photobucket.com/albums/nn460/humanguerrilla/krylonsaiga.jpg |
|
Quoted:
The biggest issue I see going with a Saiga in .308 over a FAL or G3/clone is mag pricing and availability. FAL mags are readily available and $20ish... G3 mags are $1 + shipping Hmm...what about accuracy? I like that the Saiga is lighter and has a shorter barrel. I guess I don't see a need to have more than 2-3 mags for right now and wait until they drop in price. |
|
The Saiga used to be a great value when they were $350-400 each. Unfortunately, they have risen to the point where they are $500-600ish. At that level, they loose their value. You have to put in about $150 worth of parts to get it into a pistol grip conversion. That puts you at $650-750ish. For just a little more you can get a FAL. PTR-91 rifles are about $1000-1200. You also have to take magazines into the equation. HK-91/PTR-91 mags are $2-10 depending on weather you get aluminum ($2ish) to steel ($10ish). FAL mags run $10-15ish, although you used to be able to get them for $7ish before the Nov '08 elections. Saiga mags run $35ish and FBMG just started selling them again. So factor in how many magazines you require. I like at least 10 spare mags minimum for rifles and 5 for pistols.
The FAL, PTR & Saiga are all reliable and decently accurate rifles. My PTR was the most accurate of the three. But it was the heaviest and hardest to clean. Also, mounting optics on it was a pain in the butt. The main advantage to the Saiga is you get piece it together over time. I bought my Saiga years ago when they were pretty cheap. I kept it stock for a little bit until I got some parts together. I stuck a Red Star Arms FCG group in it ($80) and used some furniture that I had in my spare parts bin. I than got a Krebs scope mount/rear peep sight ($250) and some spare mags (5x$30 each). I than had the barrel cut back to 18" and the barrel threaded for a YHM Phantom .308 sound suppressor ($240 for the thread, cut & relocating the front sight-$900 w/ tax for YHM sound suppressor). So I have $720 in parts (not including my YHM suppressor), but I did it over several years time. If I spent it all at once, I would go for something else (Kel-Tec RFB .308 bull pup?). With all that said, I really like my Saiga-308. It is pretty accurate and has been 100% reliable. It is about as quite as an unsuppressed .22lr w/ my suppressor on it. Not to mention, it isn't something you see everyday. On the down side, I won't get my money out of it unless I part it out. So it is probably going to be a long term keeper based on the money tied up into it alone. In the end, I paid less for my AZEX FAL w/ 30 magazines than I did for my Saiga-308. But at least I get to have the problem of having two reliable, accurate, semi auto .308 rifles. 
|
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
The biggest issue I see going with a Saiga in .308 over a FAL or G3/clone is mag pricing and availability. FAL mags are readily available and $20ish... G3 mags are $1 + shipping Hmm...what about accuracy? I like that the Saiga is lighter and has a shorter barrel. I guess I don't see a need to have more than 2-3 mags for right now and wait until they drop in price. i would take a siaga over an fal... im actually getting one in about a year. i can get one for $400 iirc. Its an ak action, accurate, 16" barrel... as for mags, its $50 for a 25 rounder, 5 more rounds than fal mags. How many are you gonna get. u will never need more than 3. |
|
Quoted: I need some help, and I thought this would be the best place for my question. How/where does the bolt stop spring go? I tore down my gun and didn't pay enough attention. Pics would be great. Thanks In this picture you see the hollow part of the bolt carrier on the RS of the picture? The spring goes in there as you push the whole bolt carrier forward with the long recoil spring in place. Then, when it' sall the way forward, you push down slightly and let it back and there is a small grove that the rear or the bolt recoil spring goes into, sort of a retainer slot. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/bolt_in_place_308_with_space.jpg Make sure that you push down on the bolt at the small "slot" arear on the left side when pushing the whole bolt carrier forward. The bolt has a grove on it that fits into the left slot and rides along it when recoiling back and forth and is stopped from popping out of the receiver by the funny looking tab affair at the back of the bolt recoil spring affair. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/bolt_in_grove_308_close.jpg You see the gap on the left and the small grove affair on the left side of the bolt in the above picture. The bolt HAS to fit in the gap provided on the left, while also keeping the right side of the bolt carrier in it's slot as well. Once you do this a few times, it's second nature. BTW the thing on the back of the bolt recoil spring is called a "Limiter" and it does exactly that. It "limits" the amount of travel that the bolt carrier can go to the rear before going back forward again. Witout the limiter, the carrier could go too far to the rear and spring up the bolt through that gap on the left side. This is because the .308 Saiga has a 3rd lug on the bottom and that pushes down pretty heavily on the hamer, or the hammer pushes up pretty hard on it. Either way, it has enough pressure that without the limiter it will pop the bolt out of place and then you're stuck. |
|
My Saiga .308 with some added furniture. Tapco Intrafuse fore grip and collapsible stock, as well as SAW pisto grip. Tuff Force side scope mount, along with a 25 round Sure Fire magazine. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/saiga_308_converted.jpg And a target at 100 yards shot with factory Remington 150 gr PSP Core LOKT bullets 5 shots... I know...should have shot 10, but maybe this spring if I haven't sold it by then. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/Saiga308/308_saiga_rem150psp.jpg Old Pizza Hut box with a magic marker dot I put on it. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
I need some help, and I thought this would be the best place for my question. How/where does the bolt stop spring go? I tore down my gun and didn't pay enough attention. Pics would be great. Thanks In this picture you see the hollow part of the bolt carrier on the RS of the picture? The spring goes in there as you push the whole bolt carrier forward with the long recoil spring in place. Then, when it' sall the way forward, you push down slightly and let it back and there is a small grove that the rear or the bolt recoil spring goes into, sort of a retainer slot. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/bolt_in_place_308_with_space.jpg Make sure that you push down on the bolt at the small "slot" arear on the left side when pushing the whole bolt carrier forward. The bolt has a grove on it that fits into the left slot and rides along it when recoiling back and forth and is stopped from popping out of the receiver by the funny looking tab affair at the back of the bolt recoil spring affair. http://vernsdidj.com/pictures/guns/bolt_in_grove_308_close.jpg You see the gap on the left and the small grove affair on the left side of the bolt in the above picture. The bolt HAS to fit in the gap provided on the left, while also keeping the right side of the bolt carrier in it's slot as well. Once you do this a few times, it's second nature. BTW the thing on the back of the bolt recoil spring is called a "Limiter" and it does exactly that. It "limits" the amount of travel that the bolt carrier can go to the rear before going back forward again. Witout the limiter, the carrier could go too far to the rear and spring up the bolt through that gap on the left side. This is because the .308 Saiga has a 3rd lug on the bottom and that pushes down pretty heavily on the hamer, or the hammer pushes up pretty hard on it. Either way, it has enough pressure that without the limiter it will pop the bolt out of place and then you're stuck. Thanks for the help! I found this 
|
AK Sponsor