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Posted: 4/1/2010 2:37:59 PM EDT
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I just ordered one of these from Centerfirerifles. Does anybody know how old they are? Do they have good quality? Are the parts new? Will they take Romanian single stack mags?
http://www.centerfiresystems.com/akagunssr85c-01.aspx |
| Actually, those are just unmodified SSR 85C2's. That's how they come into the country, as "sporters". Small magwell & no evil features. TGI, & Armory before them, would then put on pistol grips, buttstocks, & US parts for compliance. However these are being sold just as they were imported. In this version, they don't need any US parts. I don't know what mags would fit. By the shape of the dimple, the receiver looks to be the 1.6 mm version, but I wouldn't bet a week's pay on that. Let us know about the receiver when it arrives. GARY N4KVE |
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Quoted: Quoted: I love my current SSR-85 and I'm tempted to get one of these and go to town on it. Good base rifle. Looks like a 1.6mm receiver to me also. Does yours have matching numbers and unused parts? Yup, all new rifle. 1500 rounds later it is one of my favorites. Mine is one of the early TGI imports with the 1.6mm receiver, wood furniture, threaded muzzle, etc. |
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Isn't TGI entangled in the ATF's web of red tape? No one really knows what happened for sure. TGI cant/wont talk about it. I've heard rumors that they legally imported fully automatic AK-74's and eventually decided to chop them up in to supposedly-legal parts kits or build new semi-automatic rifles from the parts. ATF decided this wasn't okay to do and confiscated several small truck loads of parts and/or rifles. Did that influence their decision to stop importing assault rifles? Possibly. Maybe they were planning to exit the manufacturing business anyways though. TGI never seemed to import many of these rifles to begin with. I dont know if ISD just doesn't produce enough AK's or if there's no importer willing to bring in a large number of them. I would love to see these become as available as the WASR's with a better build quality for a slightly higher price. |
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Quote from TGI on another forum: "We are no longer manufacturing rifles, including 922r conversions to ISD sporting rifles (SSR-85). We will only be importing C&R type surplus plus ammo and militaria." Oh man, the ATF sure knows how to stifle entrepreneurism in the civilian firearms market. What a great backdoor way to grab more guns. Just target the successful companies importing/manufacturing firearms with raids, ATF and IRS audits etc......Makes me sick to my stomach. |
| Okay, so I recieved my SSR-85C today. My impression of the rifle is that it is quite high quality. The finish is a nice parkerized one. Many milled parts and match parts are used on this rifle like the dust cover,barrel, and bolt. The trigger is a very smooth double hooked kind. I really liked the bakelite handguards used. However, the big problem was that I purchased 5 round single stack bulgarian mags from KVAR assuming that they would work in a Bulgarian gun and they aren't even close to fitting. What mags will fit this rifle?! |
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Exactly how are they not fitting? I had to rework some non-WASR Romanian single stack mags so they would work in my PAP. They wouldn't even come close to locking in until I did some serious filing on the locking lug area of the mags. Now they lock up tight and function great. |
I got one of these Bulgarian SSR-85's today from centerfire. I plan on doing a high cap conversion on it this weekend. It appears that the muzzle is not threaded, which is an easy fix. As far as I can tell, it looks like the magwell can be opened up fairly easy, just like on a WASR. For now, my compliance parts will be a Tapco double hook FCG and a 3-piece stock set from K-var. Im pretty sure these rifles are brand new. I cant find any wear on any parts to indicate prior use. I believe with a little elbow grease, these will make nice rifles!!  I measured the reciever, and it IS a 1.6mm.
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Quoted: I got one of these Bulgarian SSR-85's today from centerfire. I plan on doing a high cap conversion on it this weekend. It appears that the muzzle is not threaded, which is an easy fix. As far as I can tell, it looks like the magwell can be opened up fairly easy, just like on a WASR. For now, my compliance parts will be a Tapco double hook FCG and a 3-piece stock set from K-var. Im pretty sure these rifles are brand new. I cant find any wear on any parts to indicate prior use. I believe with a little elbow grease, these will make nice rifles!! I measured the reciever, and it IS a 1.6mm.Post some pics after the conversion. |
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I got one of these Bulgarian SSR-85's today from centerfire. I plan on doing a high cap conversion on it this weekend. It appears that the muzzle is not threaded, which is an easy fix. As far as I can tell, it looks like the magwell can be opened up fairly easy, just like on a WASR. For now, my compliance parts will be a Tapco double hook FCG and a 3-piece stock set from K-var. Im pretty sure these rifles are brand new. I cant find any wear on any parts to indicate prior use. I believe with a little elbow grease, these will make nice rifles!! I measured the reciever, and it IS a 1.6mm.Post some pics after the conversion. Will do!!!
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tstorm31, I was thinking about getting one but uncertain about fit and finish and functioning as the gun does not come w/ any mag. It would be nice to check reliability before conversion. Are the parts matching? Thanks Yes, all of the parts are matching. There seem to be no US compliant parts on it. As far as fit, it seems to be of top quality. No strange wobble or loose parts of any kind. The finish is very good and appears to be new. As for function, I have an SSR-85c2 that was converted by TGI. I have put over 600 rounds through it and havent had a single problem of any kind, and from what I can tell so far, this one will be no different. I heard a rumor that these guns were meant to go to TGI, but, they are no longer doing the high-cap conversions and thats why they are for sale as they were imported. There is no way to know if this is true or not, but it make since. I started the conversion today and managed to finish the magwell. I have converted a couple of WASR's in the past, and this one is no different, so it is fairly simple. All of the mags I tried in it lock up snug with little to no wobble. I hand cycled a few rounds and all is well so far. |
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Good deal tstorm! Show us some pics. Is the 1.6 mm receiver more difficult to cut than the WASR? What do you guys plan to do w/ the muzzle brake? I understand that there is no thread. I'll post some before and after pics as soon as I am finished with it. Today, I threaded the muzzle. No, its not really any harder to cut. It just has a little more metal to it. I have the furniture and pistol grip for it. I should have my US-made FCG and slant brake in a couple of days.
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What size was the barrel under the muzzle nut? Was the nut tack welded and easily removed? Was there enough meat left for 14mm threads or did you go with 12mm?
I've also read a rumor that some of the ISD guns had cast front trunions rather than milled, can either of you that have bought these recently either confirm or deny this rumor? I've been looking for another MAK to use for the basis for my planned rifle but one of these might be a viable option that's a little easier to obtain. |
I know!! I appologize for not having pics up yet!! Im not exactly computer-literate, so it may take me a little time to get them up. As for the muzzle nut, mine was simply pressed onto the barrel with no tack weld, so threading was easy with plenty of metal for 14mm threads. The magwell was also fairly easy to enlarge to high-cap size. The only thing about it is that it takes a little longer to cut than a WASR because it is a 1.6mm reciever. Again, I appologize for not posting more often, but, I work during the week and sometimes on saturdays, so im having to do this build a little at a time. Also, the Tapco FCG fits and functions perfect in this rifle.
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<a href="http://img217.imageshack.us/i/picture29rx.jpg/" target="_blank">http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/4459/picture29rx.jpg</a> Uploaded with ImageShack.us Ok!! All I have at the momment is a crappy webcam, so let me work with it and I will get some better pics up.
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Im sorry I had to keep posting seperate pics, but I havent figured out yet how to post more than one pic at a time!!  Anyways, she's finally finished!! I still havent got my stock set from kvar yet, so I put a set of refinished romanian wood and a chinese pistol grip on it for the time being. I also attached a russian sling. Today, I took it out and put 180 rounds through it to set the sights and test for function. Not a single mishap, everything went great!! I still havent decided whether I should keep it in its current form, or put the black kvar set on it when I get it. If I keep it as-is, I will have to change out the gas piston or pistol grip to keep compliant. For the time being, I use a tapco mag to stay compliant. The steel mag in the pics is just for posing. Anyways, thanks for everyones patience, and if you get a chance to rework one of these rifles, you should do so!! Its not very hard, you can build it the way you want, plus, you know it was done RIGHT and not by some monkey in a garage somewhere. 
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Looks like you removed the FSB to thread the barrel? Did it come off and on easily enough or did you have to press it off/on? Do these rifles already have a bullet guide installed? Since they were designed to be imported for conversion I'm assuming so but since they were designed around a different mag I'm not sure. Did you have to modify anything other than the outer receiver opening, to get the milsurp mags to fit and lock up properly?
Sorry for all of the questions but I'm still debating between one of these and another MAK so I'm trying to get as much info as possible to see what I would be up against with both. By the time I pay for one of these, shipping, FFL transfer, etc, I can probably find a good unconverted MAK locally for close to the same cash outlay. The MAK is a known quantity as far as quality goes and it doesn't need mag well mods, but it doesn't have the FSB detent pin or provisions for a cleaning rod. Just wondering outloud what the overall reliability/durability difference between these two rifles would be. Looks very good, and you did a great job on the mag opening. I would leave it as is, but then again I'm just not that fond of black pastic on an AK. I would just change out the PG to get it compliant. If you like that particular style, Ironwood makes one very similar and you can order just the PG. |
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Looks like you removed the FSB to thread the barrel? Did it come off and on easily enough or did you have to press it off/on? Do these rifles already have a bullet guide installed? Since they were designed to be imported for conversion I'm assuming so but since they were designed around a different mag I'm not sure. Did you have to modify anything other than the outer receiver opening, to get the milsurp mags to fit and lock up properly? Sorry for all of the questions but I'm still debating between one of these and another MAK so I'm trying to get as much info as possible to see what I would be up against with both. By the time I pay for one of these, shipping, FFL transfer, etc, I can probably find a good unconverted MAK locally for close to the same cash outlay. The MAK is a known quantity as far as quality goes and it doesn't need mag well mods, but it doesn't have the FSB detent pin or provisions for a cleaning rod. Just wondering outloud what the overall reliability/durability difference between these two rifles would be. Looks very good, and you did a great job on the mag opening. I would leave it as is, but then again I'm just not that fond of black pastic on an AK. I would just change out the PG to get it compliant. If you like that particular style, Ironwood makes one very similar and you can order just the PG. Yeah, I had to remove the FSB to cut the threads. It came on and off fairly easy, but it did have to be pressed on. Yes, bullet guide is already installed. In my opinion, I dont think they even make low-cap mags to fit these. I believe they put them on low-cap recievers just to get them in the country, knowing that they would be opened up after getting here. The only other thing I had to do with the magwell was to trim down the rails that hold the mags in place. The dimples dont actually hold the mags in place. These have the same type of rails that a WASR has. The only trick is to not trim off too much, or you will have alot of mag wobble, like in some WASR's. I just took my time so the mags would lock in good and snug. As for choosing to do one of these or a MAK, thats a pretty tough choice! They are both excellent quality rifles. I would say, with what I put in this one, I could have just gotten another MAK. But, I truely enjoyed making a rifle the way I wanted it and knowing it was done right. I have decided to change out the gas piston this weekend and keep the pistol grip thats on it. I guess when I get my kvar set, I will put it on one of my Century 74's. If you decide to try one of these, just contact me and I will be glad to help.
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Thats very nice!! I love the wood on it!! Is the finish Gunkote?
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Yeah, I had to remove the FSB to cut the threads. It came on and off fairly easy, but it did have to be pressed on. Yes, bullet guide is already installed. In my opinion, I dont think they even make low-cap mags to fit these. I believe they put them on low-cap recievers just to get them in the country, knowing that they would be opened up after getting here. The only other thing I had to do with the magwell was to trim down the rails that hold the mags in place. The dimples dont actually hold the mags in place. These have the same type of rails that a WASR has. The only trick is to not trim off too much, or you will have alot of mag wobble, like in some WASR's. I just took my time so the mags would lock in good and snug. As for choosing to do one of these or a MAK, thats a pretty tough choice! They are both excellent quality rifles. I would say, with what I put in this one, I could have just gotten another MAK. But, I truely enjoyed making a rifle the way I wanted it and knowing it was done right. I have decided to change out the gas piston this weekend and keep the pistol grip thats on it. I guess when I get my kvar set, I will put it on one of my Century 74's. If you decide to try one of these, just contact me and I will be glad to help. Thanks for the reply. I had the same thoughts about the mags since they don't supply one and I've never heard of anyone having a single stack that worked in one. Everything you've said was what my mind told me but it's nice to have it confirmed by someone with first hand experience. I'm still on the fence between a MAK and one of these. I read on another thread elsewhere (posted by TGI) that they sold their stock of these rifles to Centerfire. But TGI had one of these listed on Gunbroker for a good price, so I used the "ask the seller a question" feature to clarify a few things about the rifle listed and the deal in general. Never got a reply but the day after I asked my questions they raised the original listing price. Yep, same rifle, same listing number. There where no bids so they modified the listing by adding $60 to the starting bid amount. I've used online auction sites many times before and always recieved answers to my questions about the item. I use that to gauge both the item and seller and I've never been disappointed in all these years. If a seller doesn't reply it is a red flag for me so I avoid them. With Gunbroker in particular, when you add in dealing with a transfering FFL and all, communication is important. My FFL guy only faxes his signed license directly to the seller so her expects to be able to communicate with them. IFf they won't answer a potential buyers questions it makes me worry about the transaction as a whole. Maybe I'm just a stickler but between the price increase and not getting a single question about the auction item answered I've decided to pass on that one, and TGI in general. If I get one of these it'll be from another source. If I do go this route I may very well contact you if I run into any issues or more questions, so thanks for the kind offer and the information already given. |
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Hey cottontop, that looks great!. What furniture is on it? |
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After closer examination of the pics, it doesn't appear that ISD's park skills have improved. Still as thin as ever. Still love these rifles though. I just sunk $300 into my SSR-85 in the form of a Krebs Beryl-style rail, would only do that on a rifle I truly love. Very tempted to pick one of these C1s up. tstorm31, got a pic of your magwell template? I may want some inspiration if I buy one of these rifles. |
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After closer examination of the pics, it doesn't appear that ISD's park skills have improved. Still as thin as ever. Still love these rifles though. I just sunk $300 into my SSR-85 in the form of a Krebs Beryl-style rail, would only do that on a rifle I truly love. Very tempted to pick one of these C1s up. tstorm31, got a pic of your magwell template? I may want some inspiration if I buy one of these rifles. Liquidmetal, I hate to be a pest in this thread but could you tell me the difference between your rifle and one of these? It seems like you're confident in the quality of yours so just trying to gauge the similarities or differences between the two. How many rounds have you ran through yours? Any issues? I've just seen too many horror stories recently about various AK builds having receiver, or other issues regarding durability/reliability/quality. I can deal with finish issues since I plan to duracoat it anyway. Thanks |
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Quoted: Quoted: After closer examination of the pics, it doesn't appear that ISD's park skills have improved. Still as thin as ever. Still love these rifles though. I just sunk $300 into my SSR-85 in the form of a Krebs Beryl-style rail, would only do that on a rifle I truly love. Very tempted to pick one of these C1s up. tstorm31, got a pic of your magwell template? I may want some inspiration if I buy one of these rifles. Liquidmetal, I hate to be a pest in this thread but could you tell me the difference between your rifle and one of these? It seems like you're confident in the quality of yours so just trying to gauge the similarities or differences between the two. How many rounds have you ran through yours? Any issues? I've just seen too many horror stories recently about various AK builds having receiver, or other issues regarding durability/reliability/quality. I can deal with finish issues since I plan to duracoat it anyway. Thanks Trying to make an informed purchase decision doesn't make you a pest, it makes you smart. These C1s are identical to my C2, the only difference being who did the conversion. TGI did the conversion on my C2, and the end user does the conversion on these C1s. TGI added Beech furniture from Ironwood Designs, opened up the magwell, and threaded the muzzle on the C2s they sold. My C2 has been flawless, any and all function issues I have had (only a couple) could be contributed to ammo or mags, not the rifle itself. My SSR runs like a raped ape. I have somewhere in the neighborhood of 1500-2000 rounds through mine, probably closer to 2K. I have numerous AKs and like to shoot them all, so putting a huge round count through any one of them takes time (and money). I am tempted to get a C1 because I am not sure I will get another shot at a second one in the future. |
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After closer examination of the pics, it doesn't appear that ISD's park skills have improved. Still as thin as ever. Still love these rifles though. I just sunk $300 into my SSR-85 in the form of a Krebs Beryl-style rail, would only do that on a rifle I truly love. Very tempted to pick one of these C1s up. tstorm31, got a pic of your magwell template? I may want some inspiration if I buy one of these rifles. Thats true. The park is a little on the thin side. At some point, I may put on some gunkote, or some other finish. But, for now, I think I'll just leave it as it is. It kinda has an "authentic" look to it.  Im going out to the shop later today to change out my gas piston. I will take a pic of my template and post it later today.
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Yeah, I had to remove the FSB to cut the threads. It came on and off fairly easy, but it did have to be pressed on. Yes, bullet guide is already installed. In my opinion, I dont think they even make low-cap mags to fit these. I believe they put them on low-cap recievers just to get them in the country, knowing that they would be opened up after getting here. The only other thing I had to do with the magwell was to trim down the rails that hold the mags in place. The dimples dont actually hold the mags in place. These have the same type of rails that a WASR has. The only trick is to not trim off too much, or you will have alot of mag wobble, like in some WASR's. I just took my time so the mags would lock in good and snug. As for choosing to do one of these or a MAK, thats a pretty tough choice! They are both excellent quality rifles. I would say, with what I put in this one, I could have just gotten another MAK. But, I truely enjoyed making a rifle the way I wanted it and knowing it was done right. I have decided to change out the gas piston this weekend and keep the pistol grip thats on it. I guess when I get my kvar set, I will put it on one of my Century 74's. If you decide to try one of these, just contact me and I will be glad to help. Thanks for the reply. I had the same thoughts about the mags since they don't supply one and I've never heard of anyone having a single stack that worked in one. Everything you've said was what my mind told me but it's nice to have it confirmed by someone with first hand experience. I'm still on the fence between a MAK and one of these. I read on another thread elsewhere (posted by TGI) that they sold their stock of these rifles to Centerfire. But TGI had one of these listed on Gunbroker for a good price, so I used the "ask the seller a question" feature to clarify a few things about the rifle listed and the deal in general. Never got a reply but the day after I asked my questions they raised the original listing price. Yep, same rifle, same listing number. There where no bids so they modified the listing by adding $60 to the starting bid amount. I've used online auction sites many times before and always recieved answers to my questions about the item. I use that to gauge both the item and seller and I've never been disappointed in all these years. If a seller doesn't reply it is a red flag for me so I avoid them. With Gunbroker in particular, when you add in dealing with a transfering FFL and all, communication is important. My FFL guy only faxes his signed license directly to the seller so her expects to be able to communicate with them. IFf they won't answer a potential buyers questions it makes me worry about the transaction as a whole. Maybe I'm just a stickler but between the price increase and not getting a single question about the auction item answered I've decided to pass on that one, and TGI in general. If I get one of these it'll be from another source. If I do go this route I may very well contact you if I run into any issues or more questions, so thanks for the kind offer and the information already given. Cant blame you for being cautious. I didnt get mine from TGI, though. I bought mine at Centerfire. I only live about 14 miles from them, so I just drove down one day and picked it up. Plus, I kinda like the idea of being able to inspect before I buy. Honestly, I never had any problems from TGI, but thats just me. The other SSR-85c2 that I have had a loose lower handguard, so I called them and they fixed the problem right away and was very courteous. |
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Yeah, I had to remove the FSB to cut the threads. It came on and off fairly easy, but it did have to be pressed on. Yes, bullet guide is already installed. In my opinion, I dont think they even make low-cap mags to fit these. I believe they put them on low-cap recievers just to get them in the country, knowing that they would be opened up after getting here. The only other thing I had to do with the magwell was to trim down the rails that hold the mags in place. The dimples dont actually hold the mags in place. These have the same type of rails that a WASR has. The only trick is to not trim off too much, or you will have alot of mag wobble, like in some WASR's. I just took my time so the mags would lock in good and snug. As for choosing to do one of these or a MAK, thats a pretty tough choice! They are both excellent quality rifles. I would say, with what I put in this one, I could have just gotten another MAK. But, I truely enjoyed making a rifle the way I wanted it and knowing it was done right. I have decided to change out the gas piston this weekend and keep the pistol grip thats on it. I guess when I get my kvar set, I will put it on one of my Century 74's. If you decide to try one of these, just contact me and I will be glad to help. Thanks for the reply. I had the same thoughts about the mags since they don't supply one and I've never heard of anyone having a single stack that worked in one. Everything you've said was what my mind told me but it's nice to have it confirmed by someone with first hand experience. I'm still on the fence between a MAK and one of these. I read on another thread elsewhere (posted by TGI) that they sold their stock of these rifles to Centerfire. But TGI had one of these listed on Gunbroker for a good price, so I used the "ask the seller a question" feature to clarify a few things about the rifle listed and the deal in general. Never got a reply but the day after I asked my questions they raised the original listing price. Yep, same rifle, same listing number. There where no bids so they modified the listing by adding $60 to the starting bid amount. I've used online auction sites many times before and always recieved answers to my questions about the item. I use that to gauge both the item and seller and I've never been disappointed in all these years. If a seller doesn't reply it is a red flag for me so I avoid them. With Gunbroker in particular, when you add in dealing with a transfering FFL and all, communication is important. My FFL guy only faxes his signed license directly to the seller so her expects to be able to communicate with them. IFf they won't answer a potential buyers questions it makes me worry about the transaction as a whole. Maybe I'm just a stickler but between the price increase and not getting a single question about the auction item answered I've decided to pass on that one, and TGI in general. If I get one of these it'll be from another source. If I do go this route I may very well contact you if I run into any issues or more questions, so thanks for the kind offer and the information already given. I wouldnt worry about TGI being bad, In fact they have had the best customer service I ever dealt with in the last 2 years, tied with centerfire..I didnt get respsnes from them either on emails I sent, but they were great on the phone..Id just call em though if you didnt get an email response. the email you sent maybe a question they couldnt answer right away, then forgot to reply. |
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