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Posted: 1/19/2006 9:36:59 PM EDT
I've got a couple of kits that have the original bluing on them in various conditions, including a couple of milled kits. I've got the receivers from Firingline in OK, and I'm considering having them do the build for me. Problem is, they don't do blue work and they only do Molycoat or Duracoat.

Can someone who has a weapon with this finish tell me how it compares to blueing? I'd like to keep the rifles as original as possible, but it's kind of a compromise anyway since the receivers have that big eagle on the side.

Link Posted: 1/19/2006 10:18:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 10:25:41 PM EDT by Darkest2000]
the finishes are totally different although I think either one would look good. A molycoat/duracoat type finish will certainly have a lot better corrosion resistance than blueing.

If you really want blued finish you can always find a special refinisher that does blueing, such as Accurate Plating and Weaponry www.apwcogan.com

The problem is that a lot of times the parts get over polished, meaning they remove too much material during surface preparation and so the parts/edges may look rounded after it's done, and I personally don't like that. Some refinishers do it and some are more careful.

I think a better alternative to the Molycoating/Duracoat and blueing would be IGF's environtech black finish, it's very corrosion resistent and very thin (the molycoat/duracoat, which are really thick in comparison), has a nice satiny texture, almost like matte blue but slightly more reflective. Also, the Environtech finish wears evenly, where as moly type coating would chip instead.



Here you can compare the Environtech finish(SA M7 Classic) to blued finish (Polytech Legend)


Also, if you don't mind me asking, you're in CA right? How did you manage to get Firing Line receivers? Is it considered a non-listed receiver?
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 10:26:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 10:34:06 PM EDT by Adventurer_96]
Thanks for the great pics! The top photo of the IGF finish is really nice, and if I go with something other than blue I'd like to go with a finish with characteristics like you describe. Would you say that the molycoat type finishes come closer to the AK-100 series finish, or what's found on a Bulgy kit?

Incidentally, I haven't picked up a ChiCom AK for the collection, and a Legend is high on the list, I'm jealous.

Fair question regarding AWs and CA, being stuck w/orders to CA, I had to register them as AWs prior to moving here, I applied for a Military Assault Weapon permit which covers all my AWs as I'm active military forced to move here.

There's a local shop that does most of the bluing (I'll settle on a spelling eventually) in the area but I think it's just because they're grandfathered from EPA restrictions, not because they're the best.

These guns will be infrequently to the range so durability isn't really the issue, other weapons would take their place for that.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 10:40:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/19/2006 10:47:59 PM EDT by Darkest2000]

Originally Posted By Adventurer_96:
Would you say that the molycoat type finishes come closer to the AK-100 series finish, or what's found on a Bulgy kit?


Yes, the Russians uses some sort of baked on enamel finish, the Bulgies uses a really shitty spray on type finish, kinda reminds me of krylon, both of which are applied (sprayed) over the metal surface, just like moly or duracoat.

The Environtech kinda mimics a moly type refinish since it is also applied to the metal surface, but the layer is much thinner, keeping the dimension of the parts true, and I believe it's also the hardest. I once accidently slipped my screw driver on the lower stock tang, and it didn't even put a scratch on it. I was quite amazed by it. should the same thing happen to a blued/moly finish, you would see a very noticeable scratch where the screw driver went through.
Link Posted: 1/19/2006 11:25:53 PM EDT
Darkest,

Where did you get that furniture on the "Classic?" Absolutely gorgeous. Did you simply refinish the stock set?

Regards,

Bud
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 12:48:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/20/2006 12:48:53 AM EDT by Darkest2000]

Originally Posted By Bachelor_of_Science:
Darkest,

Where did you get that furniture on the "Classic?" Absolutely gorgeous. Did you simply refinish the stock set?

Regards,

Bud



Thanks, the stock is Chinese, the handguards are Bulgarian dark hardwood (from a parts kit), and the pistol grip is Polish hardwood. I refinished all the wood pieces for a matching finish.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 2:18:44 AM EDT

My AKS 47 build with a FL reciever.. the bluing on the barrel and stock are the origional
so i blued the reciever to match the rest of the gun.. a worn splotchy look matches
after all this AK is over 50 years old and seen some hard times .. so i kept it looking
old..


Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:34:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 4:57:24 PM EDT
I bought a receiver from the Firing Line too and they assembled my rifle.

At the recommendation of Troy Sellars at In Range, I had mine blued by Checkmate Custom in Florida. They did a good job and didn't over polish it. I included very specific instructions when I sent it and they did exactly what I asked. I'm very happy with the job that they did.





Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:04:33 PM EDT
Damn, Patm41 posted that same picture of that old beat up AK again!
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:24:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mike_f:
I bought a receiver from the Firing Line too and they assembled my rifle.

At the recommendation of Troy Sellars at In Range, I had mine blued by Checkmate Custom in Florida. They did a good job and didn't over polish it. I included very specific instructions when I sent it and they did exactly what I asked. I'm very happy with the job that they did.

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/Early_AK47_T3_Project_Rifle2.jpg

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/T3Receiver.jpg




Mike,

I absolutely love your AK47, the only problem I have with it is the selector stops, canyou explain why they were done that way? They just don't look right to me. Other than that, This is exactly what I want to do with my PLO AK47 kits.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:26:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By xcibes:

Originally Posted By mike_f:
I bought a receiver from the Firing Line too and they assembled my rifle.

At the recommendation of Troy Sellars at In Range, I had mine blued by Checkmate Custom in Florida. They did a good job and didn't over polish it. I included very specific instructions when I sent it and they did exactly what I asked. I'm very happy with the job that they did.

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/Early_AK47_T3_Project_Rifle2.jpg

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/T3Receiver.jpg




Mike,

I absolutely love your AK47, the only problem I have with it is the selector stops, canyou explain why they were done that way? They just don't look right to me. Other than that, This is exactly what I want to do with my PLO AK47 kits.



THe lower one is just how they look on the FL receivers. I'm assuming he did the top one that way so they would match.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 5:42:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/20/2006 6:09:20 PM EDT by xcibes]
I see it differently, the lower one has what looks like a small selector stop inside the larger stop ...if you look closely enough you can see a dark spot inside the lower selector stop.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 6:46:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By xcibes:
I see it differently, the lower one has what looks like a small selector stop inside the larger stop ...if you look closely enough you can see a dark spot inside the lower selector stop.



xcibes, you are right. The reason it looks that way is to try to correct for the standard Firing Line selector notch which is basically just a horizontal line.

I ordered the receiver and specifically requested "no selector markings" and called to confirm it a couple of times during my very long wait for the receiver. They left off the letters, but still cut the horizontal line for the selector notch.

I had already waited over a year for the receiver with a custom serial number and the Firing Line didn't have a scheduled date for when they were going to make their next batch of threaded receivers. I couldn't have the horizontal line welded up because I was going to blue the gun. So I was left with the choice of not building a rifle with this $400 receiver or finding someone to try to make the best of the situation.

Ted Marshall did his best to try to make the selector ticks look somewhat authentic. I think he did a great job considering what he had to work with. The upper notch was added to look like the lower one. It simply was the best that could be done with that receiver.

Cosmetically, there are several other things that I dislike about the Firing Line receiver. But they have a monopoly on the milled AK receivers in the US right now, so it's their way or no way.

Link Posted: 1/20/2006 6:57:22 PM EDT
I am aware that you cannot just go ahead and weld these and re-do them if you are going to blue the rifle as it will show up in the form of different colors in the bluing...too bad though. I think I know what other things you do not like about the receiver, including the giant eagle on the side. i heard they changed this but I will believe it when I see it. That is one of the reasons I have not ordered a receiver from them. I was waiting for Todd to build one but this seems to be going nowhere.

Anyway, back to the original topic of this thread, the best is of course to have the FL do the build and then send it elswhere to be blued.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 8:30:25 PM EDT
Great replies, thanks.

Mike, I think you answered my questions but to confirm FL did the assembly, Ted did the markings and you had the gun blued by Checkmate, is that right?

Of the two Russian kits I have, I think I might make one look kind of like patm's pic since there is a good deal of wear and a little pitting on one, and I'm not sure rebluing would fix it. The other looked to be in decent shape, and I might have it assembled by FL and blued elsewhere.

Two things: First, when the FL receivers showed up (threaded fixed stock and underfolder) the FFL had a pained look in his eye and it hurt him to say that these looked like really nice parts... for an AK!

Second, the customer service at The Firingline in OK has been awesome, they worked with me since I was a bit under the gun to get the receiver shipped out to me prior to the move to CA. They are great guys to deal with, I can't wait until the receivers are built up.
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 8:32:10 PM EDT
RS39, it's funny you mention that, I've got a Yugo with overall great bluing that I might want to try to match. What I was thinking was to blue the stamped receiver and then go ahead and cold blue the rivets after the build, but if this stuff works as advertised it might be a better option.

I've got to find the wife's digicam cable for some pics when they're through of the "family."
Link Posted: 1/20/2006 8:48:01 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mike_f:
I bought a receiver from the Firing Line too and they assembled my rifle.

At the recommendation of Troy Sellars at In Range, I had mine blued by Checkmate Custom in Florida. They did a good job and didn't over polish it. I included very specific instructions when I sent it and they did exactly what I asked. I'm very happy with the job that they did.

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/Early_AK47_T3_Project_Rifle2.jpg

home.comcast.net/~mike_f/T3Receiver.jpg



DAMN , THAT AK IS TIGHTTT AS HELLLL !!!!
Link Posted: 1/21/2006 5:53:58 AM EDT








Blued Polish kit from AK-USA.

Spooky
Link Posted: 1/21/2006 3:17:12 PM EDT
Spooky, nice looking rifle!

BTW, are you DE ANG by any chance?
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 8:48:26 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 8:59:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By xcibes:
I see it differently, the lower one has what looks like a small selector stop inside the larger stop ...if you look closely enough you can see a dark spot inside the lower selector stop.



HERE is a photo of a original russian type 3 - selector notches - IMO MIKE_F's Ak
looks nicer !!!!!!!!

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c141/buzgn/th_realrussianmarkingsandanglecutts.jpg
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 9:04:43 AM EDT
Excellent pic. I knew his looked a little strange but I was not exactly sure how. yes, Ted marshall did a decent job of trying to fix FL selector stop. Wish there was a way to get them just right other than having a real Russian type III which is not happening for me any time soon. Oh well, one can still dream...
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 9:27:08 AM EDT
I HATE ALL OF YOU..... now I need to buy another AK

-C4-
Link Posted: 1/22/2006 5:52:07 PM EDT
Blued WASR by AK USA....





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