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Posted: 2/14/2013 12:33:52 PM EDT
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I am thinking of offering up my SGL21 for trade for a SGL31 or SLR105. I would be looking to trade it with my ammo and mags and get equal in return for the trade so I wouldn't have to deal with getting mags and ammo in this shit panic buy gun economy.
I already have an SLR106 to cover my AK chambered in a locally available caliber. I am contemplating trading for a few reasons. I like the terminal ballistics of 5.45, I like some of the newer Russian/Belarusian optics that are available with 5.45 BDC calibrated reticles, and I also like it for the same reasons I enjoy 5.56(low weight and low recoil). I do enjoy 7.62x39, but I am having a hankering for a Kashtan and cannot justify adding another rifle to my collection. I have a habit of making rash decision when I am craving something, so this is why I am seeking some community feedback. Looking for thoughts on the subject and an open discussion. Any input is appreciated and hopefully this is the correct forum. |
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If it were me and I could find someone willing, i wouldn't hesitate a bit. I love the 5.45 compared to the 7.62. lighter to carrry, more accurate, cheaper, and about equally as deadly.
Also there is no shortage of 7.62 mags, but 5.45 mags are in short supply, at least for the time being. |
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Both the SGL-31 and SLR-105 will likely command a premium to the SGL-21 -- the SLR-105 to a greater extent. If you do decide to make a change, you're probably going to come out on the short end of the stick, in terms of quantity of equipment (ie, I wouldn't trade an SLR-105 for an SGL-21, unless the SGL-21 came with 10 more mags than I was giving up). In other words, while you may be able to arrange an economically even trade, you're going to end up giving away more of your equipment than the other guy in order to so.
If I were in your shoes, I'd stick with the SGL-21. It's a great firearm, and 7.62x39 ammo will come back down in price within two years. I'd also recommend buying one of the more recently introduced, 5.45-chambered 74's that have come onto the market. it sounds as though your motivations behind the purchase are driven by the caliber. That being the case, authenticity and origin/heritage should be less important. Waffen Werks and Interarms both make a high quality 74s, with chrome lined US barrels (not a big deal to me), and they can be had for a hell of a lot less than an SGL-31. |
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I pretty much switched to 5.45 for the same reasons, minus the optic. You could use the Kashtan on your SGL21 with a 300m zero, though obviously the lower chevrons would be off quite a bit. Also, isn't there a domestic optic available for 7.62x39 with the inverted horseshoe? That may be a viable alternative. As mentioned above the SLR or SGL31 is pretty much going to command a higher price from a similarly equipped SGL21. The biggest issue though I would see is mag availability. As I'm sure you know rifle/mag packages occasionally pop up on the EE or other websites, though they're very rarely looking for an exchange to another rifle/caliber.
You could always offer everything up in a WTT ad, and see where it goes from there. Just make sure you're really interested in 5.45 and/or the optic. |
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As far as price is concerned, my SGL21 has a triangle folder and that model happens to cost the same and also seems to have the same commonality as it's SGL31 counterpart. Also add that 7.62x39 is more expensive than 5.45x39 and that the mags I have for the SGL21 are not any cheaper than 5.45 mags and I would think I would be able to break out pretty even in the trade.
Quoted:
I'd also recommend buying one of the more recently introduced, 5.45-chambered 74's that have come onto the market. it sounds as though your motivations behind the purchase are driven by the caliber. That being the case, authenticity and origin/heritage should be less important. Waffen Werks and Interarms both make a high quality 74s, with chrome lined US barrels (not a big deal to me), and they can be had for a hell of a lot less than an SGL-31. I don't want anything that doesn't have a CHF barrel. Quoted:
I doubt anyone would trade AK74 mags even up for 7.62x39 mags when the AK74 mags are going for $30-$50. I only use Circle 10 mags, so the price difference is really nonexistent. Thanks for the input so far, keep it coming. |
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Quoted:
As far as price is concerned, my SGL21 has a triangle folder and that model happens to cost the same and also seems to have the same commonality as it's SGL31 counterpart. Also add that 7.62x39 is more expensive than 5.45x39 and that the mags I have for the SGL21 are not any cheaper than 5.45 mags and I would think I would be able to break out pretty even in the trade. Quoted:
I'd also recommend buying one of the more recently introduced, 5.45-chambered 74's that have come onto the market. it sounds as though your motivations behind the purchase are driven by the caliber. That being the case, authenticity and origin/heritage should be less important. Waffen Werks and Interarms both make a high quality 74s, with chrome lined US barrels (not a big deal to me), and they can be had for a hell of a lot less than an SGL-31. I don't want anything that doesn't have a CHF barrel. Quoted:
I doubt anyone would trade AK74 mags even up for 7.62x39 mags when the AK74 mags are going for $30-$50. I only use Circle 10 mags, so the price difference is really nonexistent. Thanks for the input so far, keep it coming. I don't want to be a troll here, and tell you that you're wrong. But I suspect you're wrong in your assumptions. The key here is perceptions. The fact that you have a triangle folder definitely does increase the value of your rifle, but 7.62x39 being more expensive than 5.45x39 doesn't really help your cause. From a mags perspective, even if your particular mags are of the same value as 5.45 mags, I personally wouldn't do a 1:1 trade. In the future, there is greater risk that 5.45 mags will become non-existent -- even if your mags are the same price today, I may not be able to find surplus 5.45 mags in the future, and the American polymer offerings really aren't as good (probably the one area where American made AK components fall short of their foreign counterparts). This means that while I could replace expense 7.62 mags with reliable, but cheaper, steel surplus, I can't replace 5.45 surplus mags nearly as easily. For me, the future risk of availability makes 74 mags worth more in my hands than 7.62 mags, even if they cost the same today. If I'm going to spend $40+ on a mag, it better be a 5.45 -- I'll never pay $40+ for a 7.62 mag, period. From a barrel perspective, I can understand your concerns. Nonetheless, if Americans can make chrome lined barrels good enough for the US Army, then I trust them in my 74. All that to say, if you can find a counterparty willing to trade straight-up (ie, same equipment, features, and quantity), then I'd say make the trade! However, I wouldn't hold my breath, as high-end 74s are usually owned by knowledgeable people, and I suspect they're going to share the same biases I have. |
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As much as I enjoy 5.45x39.....
Don't get rid of your 7.62x39. Mags and ammo will always be around, be it russian commercial manufacture or surplus ammo. 5.45 is a different story. Sure someone will start making it when the surplus dries up, but the infrastructure is not in place. Only way I would trade is of you have the finances to dive into 5.45 and pick up at least 7-10k rounds of ammo. With 5.45 rising in prices (looks at the ammo thread) you quickly get into new 7.62 pricing. If you are dead set on a 74/5.45 gun save up and have both. I've traded calibers before and ended up buying another 7.62 rifle down the road, a song most here have sung. The exception to that is those who dropped the coin on a 74, 15+ mags, and a shit ton of ammo when it was cheap. My worthless $.02 |
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Quoted:
I really like the 5.45, have gone down the road of selling off all my 7.62x39, twice, and here I am buying 2 more. You just can't really pull away from the 7.62x39 completely if you're a true AK enthusiast IMO. Well, I know some can, but I haven't been able to. I would echo this sentiment. If you can't get a straight up trade for your package (ie, gun for gun, mag for mag), I wouldn't get rid of the SGL-21. I view it as the Colt 6920 of 7.62 AKs, and love mine. |
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Quoted:
As much as I enjoy 5.45x39..... Don't get rid of your 7.62x39. Mags and ammo will always be around, be it russian commercial manufacture or surplus ammo. 5.45 is a different story. Sure someone will start making it when the surplus dries up, but the infrastructure is not in place. Only way I would trade is of you have the finances to dive into 5.45 and pick up at least 7-10k rounds of ammo. With 5.45 rising in prices (looks at the ammo thread) you quickly get into new 7.62 pricing. If you are dead set on a 74/5.45 gun save up and have both. I've traded calibers before and ended up buying another 7.62 rifle down the road, a song most here have sung. The exception to that is those who dropped the coin on a 74, 15+ mags, and a shit ton of ammo when it was cheap. My worthless $.02 This. |
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Seems pretty much everyone thinks it's bad idea on the other 2 forums I posted it in as well.
Looks like the verdict is in and I'll keep the SGL21 and just bide my time on getting into a 5.45 rifle. I can always use the Kashtan(if I am able to get one) on my SLR106 and just use hold overs, the BDC probably won't be too far off. Thanks for the feedback. |
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You should have picked up a basic 5.45x39 Saiga when they were cheap. Simple conversion was easy and a complete conversion could have been done when you decided.
I bought two at the time that I think cost $359.00 in 2009 or so. I also picked up two in 7.62x39, one for $225.00 and one in .308 for around $325.00. I sold off a PoHF AK74 build, a SAR-2, 6 SAR-1s, a BWK-92 and two milled SLR-100Hs over the years and regret it some but I still have all 5 Saigas, an SLR105R and a SA85M. I could probably bring myself to part with one 7.62x39 and one 5.45x39 Saiga but would never get rid of the others I have unless it was for an amount of money that was hard to walk away from. I've got too much ammo stashed. |
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