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Posted: 1/13/2013 8:19:36 PM EDT
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So I recently traded my AR for an AK, which I was told was an Arsenal Bulgarian. I've looked at the very informative ak-47.us site, and from what I can tell, the rifle I have just come into possession of appears to be Russian. It's milled, and has AB and OA fire selector detentes, and the Izvhesk/Izmash factory markings.
Anyone know if this is legit and what kind of origin it has? Receiver, bolt, and bolt carrier are matching, barrel is new with struck markings parallel to the barrel. http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/6484/ak1a.jpg |
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I'd be interested in seeing the whole receiver. That is either (1) a re-weld (2) a receiver of unknown origin that someone spent considerable time and money making (3) not legal. I don't believe It's option 3, as it has struck importer marks. The electro penciling struck me as odd though. In the first picture, I edited out the SN due to the nature of the internet, its four digits. There's no evidence of a ground off original SN, and I've tested the function of the fire selector, I assure you the rifle is only semi-automatic. Whole rifle, importer: D.I.G. , Va. Beach, Va. . No reweld marks on receiver from what i can tell. http://img803.imageshack.us/img803/4783/53472090.jpg right side of receiver http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/2696/bulgy3.jpg Safety and fire selector http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/5796/safetyt.jpg Barrel http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/983/bar1g.jpg http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/293/bar2x.jpg |
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That appears to be an Arsenal Bulgy that was produced by the Kazanlak state military factory just as they were changing production over to the Circle 10 factory in 1956. It looks like a reweld. Very nice rifle! |
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That would line up with the information I was given, but the Izhevsk factory marking confuses me. How can you tell if the rifle Is a reweld? I would've figured it would be obvious if the receiver had been cut and re-welded. The man who recommended me to post this on arfcom also said there's the possibility to legally turn this rifle into an automatic NFA firearm due to it's date of manufacture, but I'm extremely skeptical (i don't live in an NFA state anyway). Any info on this?
This link also shows the fire selector markings as being Egyptian, but I'm not sure how credible the source is. http://jamesbevan.com/images/Marks.pdf |
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That would line up with the information I was given, but the Izhevsk factory marking confuses me. How can you tell if the rifle Is a reweld? I would've figured it would be obvious if the receiver had been cut and re-welded. The man who recommended me to post this on arfcom also said there's the possibility to legally turn this rifle into an automatic NFA firearm due to it's date of manufacture, but I'm extremely skeptical (i don't live in an NFA state anyway). Any info on this? This link also shows the fire selector markings as being Egyptian, but I'm not sure how credible the source is. http://jamesbevan.com/images/Marks.pdf I think you've got a whole lot of bad information there. Judging by the photos and those roughly engraved markings, it would appear someone decided to make their rifle (probably a Bulgarian receiver) look like a Russian Type III rifle by doing some engraving themselves. The outcome looks pretty crude and rough. Especially the selector markings and the detents. Very "garage" quality with a bit of a shaky hand - ask me how I can know to recognize such work (many years ago, I tried on a rifle and the outcome was extremely similar!) These markings on the original, true rifles were stamped into the metal, not engraved such as that. In all fairness, it's a bad job of engraving but it's not something that's a "can't live with" kind of thing. Perhaps in time, you can have a professional AK gunsmith re-do them for you. Also, note the barrel pin at the trunnion area - the original rifles were screwed in, not pinned such on this rifle. You CANNOT turn a rifle back into a fully automatic NFA firearm. You cannot turn one back, you cannot turn one into. It just doesn't work that way. The information from your friend is quite inaccurate. But for the sake of discussion, let's presume your rifle was a true and original Russian Type III with that 1958 date and was somehow made into a semi-automatic rifle. It would need to have been registered before 1968 to bring it back to its original function. Additionally, the fire selector markings are Russian Cyrillic - look closer at the country references in the link you posted. Not sure where you're getting that the reference shows them as Egyptian. |
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That would line up with the information I was given, but the Izhevsk factory marking confuses me. How can you tell if the rifle Is a reweld? I would've figured it would be obvious if the receiver had been cut and re-welded. The man who recommended me to post this on arfcom also said there's the possibility to legally turn this rifle into an automatic NFA firearm due to it's date of manufacture, but I'm extremely skeptical (i don't live in an NFA state anyway). Any info on this? This link also shows the fire selector markings as being Egyptian, but I'm not sure how credible the source is. http://jamesbevan.com/images/Marks.pdf There are a few people who are very good at making rewelds, if done well you'd never know it wasn't an original. Member turbothis (at least I think he's a member here) is a wizard at rewelds, there's no seam or mark of any kind. Sadly, there's no way to (legally) convert this to full auto. The registry was closed in May of 1986, full autos made after that can only be legally owned by law enforcement of licensed dealers/manufacturers. |
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I figured as much, I own both a Mosin and sks and the serials are stamped on both, so it struck me as strange that the serial and factory markings were so shoddily done. Looks like I didn't correctly read the information in my own link, its real late but that's not an excuse!
The rifle shoots well, has zero problems in the way of reliability that have surfaced, and I'm happy with it. I guess at this point, anything else is just character 
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slight issue with embedding, but here ya go for non-action side pics
http://imageshack.us/f/14/20130114181333.jpg/ http://imageshack.us/f/23/20130114181443.jpg/ |
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I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that is probably a Bulgarian SA93 (in one pic it looks like it's missing the lower stock tang, hard to tell though) that someone dressed up as a Russian. Looks like they welded the barrel pin smooth and roughly ground over it. Then went to town trying to replicate Russian markings freehand with a dremel.
It's a nice looking rifle. If it was mine I would probably have the poorly done markings scrubbed off and maybe redone with Bulgarian markings. |
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That looks to me like someone faked a Russian AK with a dremel. The 1956r shouldn't even be on a Type 3 AK. The Russians stopped marking them like that after the T2 ended in 1955. I suspect this "engraving" for the date was copied from an SKS. The font style (with the long extender on the '1') and the 'r' following the date, with the full four digit date is exactly how Izhevsk marked the SKS. So some creative artist use some jeweling engraver tools to do some simulated Russian engraving. Unfortuantely they didn't know what not to do, likle use the 'r', and like use the football-style detents set in a radius, rather than the chisel-edge detents stacked one on top of the other. Anyway, somebody clearly was dressing up a milled Bulgy; like an SA-93 as already mentioned. Show a photo of the lower tang rivet and we'll probably be able to make a guess about that. -Thirtycal |
| I've been recently looking at the tang differences in origin countries, and It does appear to be bulgarian. there is NO lower stock tang, only an upper. I didn't notice it before until it was pointed out to me, but the barrel does appear to be pinned. the SA93 would definitely line up with the DIG import mark. How would I go about scrubbing and restriking the markings? and the bolt carrier and bolt itself are electro penciled the same as the receiver, but the originals could have been scrubbed too. Regardless of the foolishness involved in the "dressing up", I know bulgarians are nice rifles still. I'm happy with it. |
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I've been recently looking at the tang differences in origin countries, and It does appear to be bulgarian. there is NO lower stock tang, only an upper. I didn't notice it before until it was pointed out to me, but the barrel does appear to be pinned. the SA93 would definitely line up with the DIG import mark. How would I go about scrubbing and restriking the markings? and the bolt carrier and bolt itself are electro penciled the same as the receiver, but the originals could have been scrubbed too. Regardless of the foolishness involved in the "dressing up", I know bulgarians are nice rifles still. I'm happy with it. The ugly markings would have to be welded over, then ground smooth again. Then re-engraved with whatever you want. Most people pay an AK smith to do this for them. |
| There seems to be an issue here. If it's indeed a debanned SA-93, there would be a Bulgarian serial number engraved on the top of the area around the barrel trunnion (non action side). Based on your initial pics, that area has been scrubbed and hand-engraved with something else. Original SA-93 would have a dot-matrix type engraving on that area that indicates the legal serial number. It does not appear to have been de-milled so the question arises in terms of legalilty of said rifle. There's been a lot of debate regarding the ability of anyone, including licensed gunsmiths, to deface an existing registered serial number on a rifle. You can't even relocate it, let alone alter it. A rifle requires a serial number, manufacturer (or importer) name and location. |
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