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Posted: 2/12/2006 12:43:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/4/2006 7:41:03 AM EDT by blake711]
I just got my first AR and I taken it out once. I am having issues with FTF when I am atempting to charge it dosen't matter if I just insterted a new Magazine or if I try to manually cycle some rounds through it with the charging handle. I have searched around and haven't found a thread on this so I am posting this one. The rifle has a Stag Lower with 6 postition stock. Has a WOA Upper and Reciever group. A 16in Hbar Fluted Bushy barrel with reciever and barrel both having rifle ramps. I am using all new D&H mags black teflon. I am using Remington Express Rifle .223 ammo. I don't recall having any FTF when I shot the rifle last but when I try and charge it after inserting a magazine it will not feed the round instead it pushes the round almost strait forward instead of up the feed ramp and generally it hits below the feed ramps and hangs or barely starts its way up the feed ramp. I can normally hit the Forward assit a time or two and it loads. I have torn it down cleaned it everything looks ok. I need help from the experts. I have included some images below. Also If I cycle the charging handle to eject a shell the next round will pop up as the charging handle goes reward and as soon as it goes forward it drops down flat again then hits reciever below the ramp. I attached images of that also incase it matters.. Thanks

Here are the feed ramp failure pictures.

http://www.blakeh.com/images/ramp1.jpg


http://www.blakeh.com/images/ramp2.jpg

http://www.blakeh.com/images/ramp3.jpg


Here are the pictures of teh Rounds popping up after a round is ejected before the carrier group goes forward to charge the rifle.

http://www.blakeh.com/images/normal_ramp-eject-side.jpg


http://www.blakeh.com/images/ramp-eject.jpg
Link Posted: 2/12/2006 1:31:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/12/2006 4:49:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/4/2006 7:41:48 AM EDT by blake711]

Originally Posted By Dano523:

Originally Posted By blake711:
I am having issues with FTF when I am attempting to charge it doesn’t matter if I just inserted a new Magazine or if I try to manually cycle some rounds through it with the charging handle.



When charging the rifle, you are pulling all the way back on the charging handle, then letting it go (read not walking the charging handle back forward)? If yes, then lock the bolt back on the bolt catch, insert a mag, and while keeping the muzzle pointed down range, hit the bolt release and see if this solves the feed problem.

The bullet tips are making the correct contact on the feed ramps, so it boils down to one of these problems.

1. The mag is still rough (inner side walls, under feed lip contact area, and front ramp area).

2. The Recoil spring is on the weak side, and does not have the needed tension to strip and feed the first round on charge.

3. The hammer is catching on the firing pin collar on the forward stroke, and in fact this is what is stopping the bolt. To rule out this one, with the mag out of the rifle, pull back on the charging handle, and then walk the charging handle back forward. The B/C should not hang up on the way forward. If it does, slowly charge again to do the same test, but this time hold the trigger back (pulled).
Note: Holding the trigger pulled keeps the hammer retained on the disconnector (held lower in the receiver) and the hammer shouldn't bind on the firing pin collar.


P.S. In regards to the ten rounder feed angle, it's not correct.



Dano Thanks for the response.

1. I am not riding it I pull it back and let it drop on its own. Sometimes it feeds sometimes it dosen't more than not it dosen't.

2. Generally it will work properly if I have it the bolt back locked back and use the bolt release. Unfortunatly thats dosen't seem to always work either.

3. I checked to see it was hitting the firing pin collar. It does apear when I have the trigger pulled in and try and charge it that the binding issues about 1-1.5 inches back from the front is removed. Its like a notched felling as you pull it. I looked at teh bottom of the firing pin collar and you can see a mark on it where the hammer apears to be riding on it. I added some photos on and looked through the current threads found one about hammer rubbing to hard on carrier. Shows modifing the hammer. I included a side profile picture of the hammer also so you can see if it need to be cut.

4 as to your statement "P.S. In regards to the ten rounder feed angle, it's not correct."
I don't understand can you explain that to me? If it has to do with the Mags they are 30 rounders otherwise I am lost.
Thanks again.


Edit to add images.. Looks like it is rubbing for sure.

http://www.blakeh.com/images/hammer.jpg

http://www.blakeh.com/images/Clipboard01.jpg

http://www.blakeh.com/images/hammer2.jpg

http://www.blakeh.com/images/carrier.jpg

Link Posted: 2/12/2006 9:02:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 9:19:52 PM EDT by Dano523]
Link Posted: 2/12/2006 9:18:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/12/2006 9:23:45 PM EDT by Dano523]
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 4:36:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/13/2006 4:39:54 AM EDT by blake711]
Dano I don't know where you are getting the 10 round stuff at .. I have Ten New D&H 30 round Mags that is it. No 10 round mags, does that change anything? Am I missing something here? Not sure where the 10 round stuff is coming from.

Thanks for the help I will snap another photo this evening of the Fire control group. Also is it common to need to take new mags and clean them up before use?
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 5:36:50 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/15/2006 6:50:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/15/2006 6:51:20 AM EDT by blake711]
Well I cleaned my rifle and did a light lube of clp took out 5 mags last night. Numbered each one and loaded them with diffrent amounts of rounds and fired through each 5 times. I used the bolt realease the first 3 times thru each mag. No problems. I tryed charging manually each a couple times with no issues after that. Looks like everything seems to be ok. Just me being a noobie may have caused issues with my unfamiliarity of the rifle.

I shot the following for testing

1st group 4 rounds each Controled Fire
2nd group 5 rounds each Controled Fire
3rd group 4 rounds each Rapid Fire
4th group 5 rounds each Rapid Fire
5th group 6 rounds each Controled Fire

Next time I got out I will test my other 5 mags. I appriaciate your help and education about this problem Dano.

Link Posted: 2/15/2006 11:26:23 AM EDT
Looking at the pics that show the tops of the mag inserted into the rifle. Don't the lips of the mags look kind of thick to be AR mags? I don't have any mags in front of me, but it seems they should be thinner.
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