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Posted: 7/20/2005 3:10:20 PM EDT
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Fellow Shooters, I hope this is the correct forum. I recently ditched my Jard trigger for a number of reasons. I reinstalled a factory trigger group, and performed the "15 minute trigger job" on a set of springs. It is working well, and everything goes bang like it should. I was looking through Brownells and spotted a screw that goes in through the grip screw loacation to take some of the take-up out of the trigger. As the Jard has a similar screw, I though what the heck and installed just the takeup screw. It does indeed take up a very small amount of the slightly gritty takeup. I have not functioned checked it yet live, nor have I impact tested it for safety (which I will do), but I was wondering if you who are more knowledable might have any thought about what I did, or the 40 dollar screw available from Brownells. I am mostly worried about the trigger sear geometry, and whether or not it is safe to take a little slack out. I can say that when I depress the trigger, I still get that small amount of hammer lift, but it is much shorter and much lighter, probably due in part to the spring work. And the disconnect and safety are clearly working. Thanks, Craig Thanks, Craig |
| The hammer 'lift' you are getting is from the positive engagement angles between the sear (trigger nose) and the hammer engagement surfaces. From the side it appears that the hammer is rolling to the rear and then the trigger releases the hammer. The $40.00 screw and the JARD screw will not remedy or address this issue. Neither will lighter springs. The screws and springs frequently give the shooter the illusion of a trigger improvement. But the gadgets do not address the basic issues of sear and hammer engagement. for a comparison I generally charge on the order of $50.00 for a trigger job. The trigger jobs I do generally reduce the positive condition to a minimum, or, completely eliminate it altogether. I am a gunsmith and have done many AR trigger jobs for many clients. I hope this helps you make an informed decision. Charles. |
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Bearbait1, Your question of a free play take up set screw is not new (removing not needed trigger travel before safety engagement), and is a trick used very often on standard FCG for a clean start point for trigger work. To do this, you install a 1/4" x 28 pitch x 1/2" Allen set screw up the receiver pistol grip threads. With the selector set on safe (and pushing the selector detent pin up to hold the selector in the correct sideway alignment), you tighten the set screw until the back of the trigger snugs up against the bottom of the selector (read still able to turn the selector off safe), and then the pistol grip screw is shortened for the thread distance that is occupied by the new set screw. This does not change any of the geometry of the sears; it just removes any travel from the trigger at rest, to the point that it engages the safety/selector set on safe (read reduces the total amount of creep via trigger at rest to the safety engagement point, while still retaining the same safety engagement point to trigger break/release point). Note: The one downfall to this is if you need to remove the selector/trigger, you will need to loosen the setscrew to get either one out (read one blown primer and without tools, your screwed trying to pick out a blown primer cup/anvil caught under the trigger with twig). |
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Thanks guys for the help. I appreciate the clarification of the geometry, or rather a confirmation. I am pretty clear on exactly what all is happening, after fiddling and tweaking the Jard for a couple of years now. Charles, I am very clear on your points. The set screw does take up a very small amount of initial movement. As the screw sit now, when I engage the safety, there is zero amount of room for the trigger to move. So, it is basically taking up that amount of play that you feel when engaging the safety and moving the trigger slightly to the rear. The problem that I have now, and the reason that I will not be taking you up on your offer for trigger work is that I have a no name, source forgotten FCG. I picked it up as a spare, if I needed to replace the Jard. I have had enough with the Jard. It is a good trigger, but a little too needsome. I have all of the screws completely fixed with Loctite, except the screw that holds the hammer to the hammer pin. I do not want to Loctite that one, as it defeats the ability to easily remove the FCG in the event of something getting into the works. Without Loctite, that screw works loose every couple of hundred rounds, and causes issues with the precisely adjusted disconnect and sear. Not to mention the lighter mass hammer is a pain with the 22 conversions. This is all an issue as I have the MGI QCB and need my FCG to work with all of my barrel configurations, my 20 Varmint, my 20" LR barrel, my 458 hunting barrel and my 16" 556 go to barrel. MY no name FCG is now pretty well adjusted, but the lower quality of it is still making that first little bit of takeup a little rough. Not bad, not competition, but room for improvement. I will look into getting a quality FCG and have someone like yourself tweak it for me, if I have no luck. I am pretty good with my gunsmithing skills, but I usually stop at sear work. Dano, thanks for the tip on the setscrew clearance. I have not cheked that, but it is one of the reasons for going back to a factory FCG. I want to be able to clean and fix any issues without my collection of tools. Trying to find that happy medium between good to go for "duty" (although any duty would be not for the military or police) and good enough for long range work. Thanks again for confirming my hopes on the geometry issues. Craig |
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