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Posted: 10/29/2004 2:39:09 PM EDT
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I was on their site looking to order the m-4 kit and had some questions. 16'' AR15 M-4 C.A.R. Kit OR 16'' AR15 M-4 C.A.R. Kit, 5.56 NATO, chrome lined chamber & bore? What is the diffrence between their Car stock and M-4 stock? (other that the $40 more for the m-4) Chrome lined chamber is? Chrome-moly and chrome-lined barrel is the same thing? Do I need a chrome bolt carrier? Does this kit bring the m-4 feed ramps? Cause I don't see it as an option? Bellow is the link! Thanks in advance! http://www.model1sales.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=KCEM46CL&storeid=1&image=carm416pre.gif# |
A Car stock is not the same as a M4 stock. The M4 stock is more solid looking and has more positions. A M4 stock is worth the extra cost. Chrome moly is not the same as chrome lined. There are a lot of opinions on the need for chrome lined barrels. For $50 extra, I'd definetely go chrome lined. You don't need or probably even want a chrome carrier. M4 ramps are not an option at Model 1 I don't think. They're not needed. |
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Guys... I dont think anything from Model one comes with true "M4 cuts" There is a lot more misinformation about this than good info. Please see this link: ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=191733 |
Well.... you wont make a wrong choice no matter what you do. Chrome lined, NATO spec chamber and bore is better. I always recommend it. M4 stock is better than CAR.... but its really personal preference. I have both... and for me, its really more about looks than function. They both function just fine. You DONT need to worry about M4 feedramps. You dont need a "totally hard chromed" carrier, but you do want a chrome lined carrier, on the internal surfaces. I would hope any decent dealer selling carriers considers this a minimum.... you should not have to specify that. |
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Their site says chrome lined chamber & bore, I'm guessing that this is what is refered to as chrome lined barrel? Under bolt carrier, they list standard or chrome bolt. 16'' AR15 M-4 C.A.R. Kit, 5.56 NATO, chrome lined chamber & bore = $490 Upgrade to m-4 stock = $30 Upgrade to chrome bolt carrier = $35 Total = $555 + S/H. I was quoted $110 + tax and background check, for a stripped new RRA lower. What do you guy think? |
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Before you commit to M1s take a look at this thread, you could assemble a much better kit for actually less money if you shop around..... M4 Build |
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Well let me tell you about my experience before you place the order. This might be kind of long winded so bear with me. When I first joined this site I decided to build an M4 but didn't know much about AR's, I saw Model 1 and thought "wow, $455 for their M4 kit plus $90 for a stripped Ameetec lower, that's only $545 for the complete gun". But then I started hearing about chrome lined barrels so then I decided "ok, $50 more for the chrome option, total $595 still pretty cheap". Then I realized that I wanted a M4 stock instead of the standard CAR stock so add another $30 so now that's $625. But then I found out that Model 1's M4 stocks have a pretty big Model 1 Sales logo on it. I didn't like that so I thought I'd get it without the M4 stock upgrade and buy a different one. Total now, back to $595 plus $70 for a M4 stock so $665 Then I started hearing about some troubles with Model 1's lower parts set and that RRA is the way to go. The lower parts set from Rock River Arms is $54. I figured I'd use the RRA kit and keep the Model 1 lower parts for spares. Total now $709. Add the Hogue grip and now it's $723. Well to wrap this up, I scrapped the Model 1 idea and now I have the Ameetec lower for $90(bought locally from Ameetec),a Hogue grip for $14(from Cheaper Than Dirt)a RRA LPK and a RRA M4 stock for $69(both from Eagle Firearms). Total $227. I'm going to get a M4 chrome lined barrel upper from CMMG for $499. Total cost $726 for a gun that's of higher quality than the Model 1 for roughly the same price. I didn't want to mess with building the upper, I don't have the tools anyway, building the upper you save a few more dollars I guess. If you own the tools already. Not telling you not to go with Model 1, just something to think about. I'm thinking about building a basic 16" CAR from Model 1 after my current build is done, just to have something cheap to mess around with, but for my first build, I want a high quality AR that works. |
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Add to the cost of the parts the tools which I guarantee you will use again.... Barrel vise jaws..... 14.95 Or action block ... 38.95 both will work.... Barrel Wrench 10.95 Or Multi tool 34.95 both will work.... Can't go wrong with good tools either And of course you will need a vise Sears has a good one or you can find a usable one from Harbor freight..... Doesn't have to be huge figure 25 to 35 for this ..... and you are in business for building uppers...... 
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You better start buying small parts then for your next project..... That way you are not out a big chunk all at once.... Heck a bit more than a week ago I dropped over 400 on small parts alone from CMMG (Thanks guys!) And every time I get a chance I pick up a couple more Lowers..... Maybe a barrel..... some uppers....... Etc...Etc... |
You sir..... are wise beyond your years, for a newbie. |
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89grand, Thanks the info. It makes sence to me but it's like you said, I started with just a cheap build that I could throw around and not worry about scratches and what not..........a beater AR if you will. Then I start thinking of upgrading here and there and before you know it....... it's out of control. I might just go with the 16" Car, 5.56 too and see how the build goes, then buy a name brand (RRA, Colt, Bushy), M4 when the prices start coming back down! I'll think about it a little more and see.  Thanks for all the helpful comments. |
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P.S. By the way has anyone built the M1S 16" Car? I might do that for now with no upgrades, Just $415! Does anyone know if it's 16" = FS? Or is that lenth with the FS? What do they mean by NM front or rear sight! Link: http://www.model1sales.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=KCE160&storeid=1&image=car16pre.gif |
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Just got done building a M1S 16" Car using a Stag lower. Everything went together great with the exception of the pivot pin spring being a little long. I just cut a couple coils off and it works fine now. The fit and finish of the upper and lower are almost perfect. http://home.woh.rr.com/mrsphipps/AR15_A.JPG http://home.woh.rr.com/mrsphipps/AR15_B.JPG http://home.woh.rr.com/mrsphipps/AR15_C.JPG |
You actually said exaclty what I would. I was going to go the same route too. I picked up an Ameetec-Arms stripped lower($90) and their parts kit ($55) and a RRA M4 stock ($69) Then did looking to find that chrome lining was a better route to go than chrome moly, and for the $45-$50 price difference you can't beat it as far as adding life to a barrel. I have also looked at S/S an a barrel choice. Although I do prefer a Park'd barrel to the bling of S/S. I have my Multi-Tool now, and I'm waiting on getting the Action Block till I get my upper. I have a RRA upper and Bolt/Carrier planned. The barrel though is still my biggest hold-up. Trying to decide on the route I wqant to take with it. I figure when I'm finished with the rifle alone I'll be out around $675 and that's including the tools to assemble it. I'll just need a BUIS and some optics to finish it off. |
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Well, I've been pondering on this all day and it looks like it's gonna be the M1S 16" no frils Carbine kit for me, for now. Just like the on that scso33 built. I only hope that the color matches as good with the RRA lower! $415 for kit +$18 S/H + $137 for lower =$570!  |
I have one from model1 and mine has feed ramp cuts just like my issued colt, and shoots about the same, except for the 3 round burst part, i like the colt but i dont think it is worth $1000 or even $500 more than my model1sales. I have two rifles from m1sales, one is 5.56 and the other is a new 6.8. They both shoot good but the 6.8 really impressed me. I shot at a regular print paper sized target from 250 meters away, bench rest, and i hit it 9 out of 9 times, with 4 shots in or touching the 2" x 2" square center". I had a leupold mark 4 3-9x. The 6.8 is the 16"car kit. |
DONE!!!! My order has been placed with M1S for the their 16" Carbine in 5.56 1:9 A2. I also ordered the A2 mount and web sling for an additional $13! I placed my order on-line so I'll let you know when I get a confirmation e-mail. I'll keep you guys posted as far as delivery time, quality and I'll post some PICS too. Thanks again for all the advice. Oz |
OK, heres the 411. M1S sent the kit out today at 11:05AM. I received my e-mail with UPS tracking #. UPS site says that the ETA is Mon. 11-08! That would make it 7 Days from ordering to delivery! Not bad?! Bad news is that my RRA lower seems to be taking longer and longer!
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Update: Received my kit today as promised. I'm not sure if it's because of all the bad mouthing about M1S, or what, but I was surprised at the quality of this kit!!!! This is my first AR and I could not wait to hold it in my hands.........FINALLY!!!!!!!! I know it's not a complete rifle yet but the assembled upped felt good in my hands! The bad news is that RRA is months away from delivering their lowers and I don't know if I can wait that long? I was thinking of an ameetec lower, since I know a place that has them in stock! What to do, what to do?  
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