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Posted: 1/19/2015 9:01:47 PM EDT
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Trijicon ACOG (300blk reticle) or Aimpoint T-2 or the mini ACOG?
Which should I put on my 300blk Spikes Tactical Compressor if Uncle Sam lets me take it home? I know very little about the ACOG or ACOG mini, so please school me on which would be the better pairing. |
| your intended use should dictate the optic . I have an aimpooint pro and use it on a carbine for stuff from 0-100 yds and an acog on a 20 inch rifle for shooting further out . never tried the acog on a blackout but the new 4 power led with the improved blackout reticle looks promising especially for a gun used for hunting . |
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your intended use should dictate the optic . I have an aimpooint pro and use it on a carbine for stuff from 0-100 yds and an acog on a 20 inch rifle for shooting further out . never tried the acog on a blackout but the new 4 power led with the improved blackout reticle looks promising especially for a gun used for hunting . What he said. |
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aimpoint to me is absurd, everything except the PRO is just priced too closely to an ACOG, which i feel is the better optic. i use it like a red dot just fine. but i have instant magnification if i need/want it. and it comes with a useable mount.
factor in the cost of a mount and a T2 can be more expensive than a TA33, which is my preferred ACOG. now add in the magnifier, and it costs more than an ACOG, add up the weight of a T2+magnifier, and their 2 mounts, and you get a bulkier heavier optic set up with no advantage to an ACOG (that's my opinion anyways), so to me, no matter what situation you're planning on using this rifle for, the answer to me is get the ACOG. i own an aimpoint PRO, and it's ok, not anything bad to say about it honestly. but it cost me less than half what my acog cost me. if it had cost any more, i wouldn't own it. |
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Trijicon ACOG (300blk reticle) or Aimpoint T-2 or the mini ACOG?
Which should I put on my 300blk Spikes Tactical Compressor if Uncle Sam lets me take it home? http://www.spikestactical.com/st-compressor-sbr-300blk-nfa-p-792.html I know very little about the ACOG or ACOG mini, so please school me on which would be the better pairing. ACOG https://www.trijicon.com/na_en/products/product3.php?pid=TA31-C-100413 With Post 9/11 vet discount is $935 Micro http://www.laruetactical.com/aimpoint-micro-t-2 $761 Is the ACOG $170 better or more convincingly is it the full $797 better and the discount makes it even sweeter? |
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Depends on use. I would recommend taking a look at the TA33 ACOG. I use a TA31 and TA11 for work (M16/IAR respectively) and have a T1 on my HD rifle.
The TA31 is okay for CQB but the eye relief demands frequent training for a reliable sight picture under pressure. With such a short eye relief +/- just a bit will yield weird sight pictures. At medium range the TA31 shines. The TA11 has a longer eye relief and is therefore a little more forgiving in terms of snap shooting. My TA11 has the horseshoe reticule which I vastly prefer to the chevron. The TA33 has similar eye relief but is much smaller & lighter than the TA11. The T1 is great for close range but it has some draw backs 1. if you have a astigmatism like I do its a fiery ball even with glasses on. 2. The lack of magnification results in any shot over 100m or so being a "minute of man" type shot. I've taken it out to 300m but at that range I was simply aiming for the target. Accuracy isn't tainted by a 1x optic and hits can be walked on with ease but precision goes out the window. So again it comes back to use. I would recommend a TA33 for an all around optic for the reasons listed above. I plan on buying a TA33 w/ a red horseshoe for my 300blk with Trijicon's promo this year. Too good to pass up. The TA44s-10 is also an option. It has the benefits of an ACOG (astigmatism, no batteries, etc.) but is 1.5x zoom, more similar to a red dot than a scope. |
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Depends on use. I would recommend taking a look at the TA33 ACOG. I use a TA31 and TA11 for work (M16/IAR respectively) and have a T1 on my HD rifle. The TA31 is okay for CQB but the eye relief demands frequent training for a reliable sight picture under pressure. With such a short eye relief +/- just a bit will yield weird sight pictures. At medium range the TA31 shines. The TA11 has a longer eye relief and is therefore a little more forgiving in terms of snap shooting. My TA11 has the horseshoe reticule which I vastly prefer to the chevron. The TA33 has similar eye relief but is much smaller & lighter than the TA11. The T1 is great for close range but it has some draw backs 1. if you have a astigmatism like I do its a fiery ball even with glasses on. 2. The lack of magnification results in any shot over 100m or so being a "minute of man" type shot. I've taken it out to 300m but at that range I was simply aiming for the target. Accuracy isn't tainted by a 1x optic and hits can be walked on with ease but precision goes out the window. So again it comes back to use. I would recommend a TA33 for an all around optic for the reasons listed above. I plan on buying a TA33 w/ a red horseshoe for my 300blk with Trijicon's promo this year. Too good to pass up. The TA44s-10 is also an option. It has the benefits of an ACOG (astigmatism, no batteries, etc.) but is 1.5x zoom, more similar to a red dot than a scope. what promotion is this? |
| I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. |
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I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways. |
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300 blackout isn't a long range round. Either will work fine. I'd use an Aimpoint H-1 to save money unless you actually own night vision.
Aimpoint Pro is a great red dot and half the cost of the cheapest Trijicon. ACOG. The 1.5x, 2x mini ACOG's have very limited eye relief which is a liability IMO. |
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In a dynamic multi-target close up environment, my experience is an ACOG is not as fast as a RDS. It is a significant disadvantage. Also, there are lighting conditions that are a disadvantage for an ACOG. Therefore, I have an offset T1 on all my ACOG rifles.
Offset irons are seriously inferior to an offset T1. Low light capability is poor on irons. Irons are slower than a RDS. In a SHTF scenario, you are far more likely to need your offset T1 over your ACOG. But, having an ACOG and an offset T1 enables you to handle any situation that arises. No one can predict where there bad guy will arrive. So, your gun should be setup accordingly. P.S. I am a HUGE ACOG fan. It is my favorite optic bar none. It just has limitations like everything else on the planet. |
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40% off for post 9/11 vets!? That's awesome, where do I sign up!? It's 40% off the full msrp though. Not as amazing as you'd think. The 6x48 acog I'm interested in was pretty much the exact same price as I could buy it for else where. And a ta33 would actually cost me $120 more than I bought mine for. |
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What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways. Quoted:
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I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways.  I've killed an ACOG (TA31). Prism came disconnected from its mount while shooting. I wasn't going to bring that up because people have broken Micros too... it happens... both the micro and the ACOG have great track records for reliability so it was a non-issue IMO. Trijicon was also super awesome about it and replaced the tritium lamp for free while they had it apart but, yes, they do break. If you can make shots indoors @ < 20m just as quickly and accurately w/ an ACOG as with an RD, snaps for you man but I really don't believe you if you want me to be honest. And what exactly do batteries have to do with anything... seems like a kinda nonsensical just got thrown out there at the end ??? Also, you can just set your VCOG to 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, or 6x and leave it there if you have that much of a boner for "instant magnification"
People like different shit but I am not really all that sure where your opinion comes from... doesn't make much sense to me. |
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I've killed an ACOG (TA31). Prism came disconnected from its mount while shooting. I wasn't going to bring that up because people have broken Micros too... it happens... both the micro and the ACOG have great track records for reliability so it was a non-issue IMO. Trijicon was also super awesome about it and replaced the tritium lamp for free while they had it apart but, yes, they do break. If you can make shots indoors @ < 20m just as quickly and accurately w/ an ACOG as with an RD, snaps for you man but I really don't believe you if you want me to be honest. And what exactly do batteries have to do with anything... seems like a kinda nonsensical just got thrown out there at the end ??? Also, you can just set your VCOG to 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, or 6x and leave it there if you have that much of a boner for "instant magnification"
People like different shit but I am not really all that sure where your opinion comes from... doesn't make much sense to me. Quoted:
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I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways. I've killed an ACOG (TA31). Prism came disconnected from its mount while shooting. I wasn't going to bring that up because people have broken Micros too... it happens... both the micro and the ACOG have great track records for reliability so it was a non-issue IMO. Trijicon was also super awesome about it and replaced the tritium lamp for free while they had it apart but, yes, they do break. If you can make shots indoors @ < 20m just as quickly and accurately w/ an ACOG as with an RD, snaps for you man but I really don't believe you if you want me to be honest. And what exactly do batteries have to do with anything... seems like a kinda nonsensical just got thrown out there at the end ??? Also, you can just set your VCOG to 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, or 6x and leave it there if you have that much of a boner for "instant magnification"
People like different shit but I am not really all that sure where your opinion comes from... doesn't make much sense to me. people run iron sights because their RDS may fail, or the batteries may die. acogs almost never fail, neither do aimpoints, but aimpoints run on batteries acogs don't so it most certainly wasn't nonsensical. a ta33 gives you enough eye relief that acquiring a sight picture just isn't an issue. maybe the 4x models don't, but i can shoot just as fast with my ta33 as i can with my aimpoint pro. sure, the vcog may work for that, but it wasn't listed as a choice, and i have no experience with it. |
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people run iron sights because their RDS may fail, or the batteries may die. acogs almost never fail, neither do aimpoints, but aimpoints run on batteries acogs don't so it most certainly wasn't nonsensical. a ta33 gives you enough eye relief that acquiring a sight picture just isn't an issue. maybe the 4x models don't, but i can shoot just as fast with my ta33 as i can with my aimpoint pro. sure, the vcog may work for that, but it wasn't listed as a choice, and i have no experience with it. Quoted:
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I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways. I've killed an ACOG (TA31). Prism came disconnected from its mount while shooting. I wasn't going to bring that up because people have broken Micros too... it happens... both the micro and the ACOG have great track records for reliability so it was a non-issue IMO. Trijicon was also super awesome about it and replaced the tritium lamp for free while they had it apart but, yes, they do break. If you can make shots indoors @ < 20m just as quickly and accurately w/ an ACOG as with an RD, snaps for you man but I really don't believe you if you want me to be honest. And what exactly do batteries have to do with anything... seems like a kinda nonsensical just got thrown out there at the end ??? Also, you can just set your VCOG to 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, or 6x and leave it there if you have that much of a boner for "instant magnification"
People like different shit but I am not really all that sure where your opinion comes from... doesn't make much sense to me. people run iron sights because their RDS may fail, or the batteries may die. acogs almost never fail, neither do aimpoints, but aimpoints run on batteries acogs don't so it most certainly wasn't nonsensical. a ta33 gives you enough eye relief that acquiring a sight picture just isn't an issue. maybe the 4x models don't, but i can shoot just as fast with my ta33 as i can with my aimpoint pro. sure, the vcog may work for that, but it wasn't listed as a choice, and i have no experience with it. True. 5yrs between battery changes isn't too bad tho. $10 worth of batteries will last longer than the tritium lamp in the acog and triji will charge you a fortune to replace it. acogs are great optics... i have owned a lot of them but i still don't see how you can say you are as fast with a 3x optic (3x vs 4x isn't a huge difference and i have owned a ta33 and it didn't really change things... i do like the ta33 better than the ta31) as you are with an RD. It makes no sense to me but if you can legitimately tell yourself that without feeling a little dishonest about it, great.... i can't tho. Inside, my eye wants to focus on the more well lit area... if where i am aiming is better lit than other areas in the house, my eye picks it up pretty easily but if the reverse is true... my left (non dominant) will naturally want to take control. I worked with it awhile to the point where i could make it work but it took more concentration than I would have liked and i was not confident enough that in a high stress situation, i would be able to use it effectively. I haven't used one in these situations but have plenty of friends who used them in the mil and they all said they looked over the top of the ACOG in a lot of circumstances. My first ACOG was actually one my friend used in Iraq on his first deployment but wanted to trade it for my EOTech/Mag combo bc the ACOG made him uncomfortable when clearing houses (which is basically all his unit did there). Obviously YMMV ETA w/ a long forgotten about pic 
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True. 5yrs between battery changes isn't too bad tho. $10 worth of batteries will last longer than the tritium lamp in the acog and triji will charge you a fortune to replace it. acogs are great optics... i have owned a lot of them but i still don't see how you can say you are as fast with a 3x optic (3x vs 4x isn't a huge difference and i have owned a ta33 and it didn't really change things... i do like the ta33 better than the ta31) as you are with an RD. It makes no sense to me but if you can legitimately tell yourself without feeling a little dishonest about it, great.... i can't tho. Quoted:
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I personally like the micro... I honestly don't believe that the ACOG falls into the civ niche without help from an offset RMR or something similar. Unless you do a lot of recon/observation or your planning on using your rifle in that 300-500m range most of the time the hinderances of the ACOG outweigh the benefits. The glass is excellent, they are well built, and I like the reticles but where I struggle with this optic are probably the places I will most likely have to use the rifle in a bad situation (SHTF or HD). I would consider a VCOG but I can't see myself going back to an ACOG for anything other than something like an A4 "clone" or some other limited use range toy. If you have eye problems, you may be forced to go with something other than an RD but still, VCOG>ACOG 24/7 365 unless I am running an offset RMR which would make it just short a 2k investment after mounts. What hindrances? When making close up shots it's just as fast as my aimpoint. Unlike a vcog, if I need magnification it's instant. Even at a couple hundred yards you can make 2 eyes open shots. After that close one eye and your in business for 300-500. I'm really not sure what you mean by you need an offset rmr. That's one of the worst set ups IMO, there's no advantage to having a red dot to transition too. When you're acog is already essentially a red dot. You could say for back up! But how likely are you to kill an acog? And most acogs don't have batteries so.... Offset fixed iron sights make more sense to me then an offset rmr seeing as they'll never be used anyways. I've killed an ACOG (TA31). Prism came disconnected from its mount while shooting. I wasn't going to bring that up because people have broken Micros too... it happens... both the micro and the ACOG have great track records for reliability so it was a non-issue IMO. Trijicon was also super awesome about it and replaced the tritium lamp for free while they had it apart but, yes, they do break. If you can make shots indoors @ < 20m just as quickly and accurately w/ an ACOG as with an RD, snaps for you man but I really don't believe you if you want me to be honest. And what exactly do batteries have to do with anything... seems like a kinda nonsensical just got thrown out there at the end ??? Also, you can just set your VCOG to 2x, 3x, 4x, 5x, or 6x and leave it there if you have that much of a boner for "instant magnification"
People like different shit but I am not really all that sure where your opinion comes from... doesn't make much sense to me. people run iron sights because their RDS may fail, or the batteries may die. acogs almost never fail, neither do aimpoints, but aimpoints run on batteries acogs don't so it most certainly wasn't nonsensical. a ta33 gives you enough eye relief that acquiring a sight picture just isn't an issue. maybe the 4x models don't, but i can shoot just as fast with my ta33 as i can with my aimpoint pro. sure, the vcog may work for that, but it wasn't listed as a choice, and i have no experience with it. True. 5yrs between battery changes isn't too bad tho. $10 worth of batteries will last longer than the tritium lamp in the acog and triji will charge you a fortune to replace it. acogs are great optics... i have owned a lot of them but i still don't see how you can say you are as fast with a 3x optic (3x vs 4x isn't a huge difference and i have owned a ta33 and it didn't really change things... i do like the ta33 better than the ta31) as you are with an RD. It makes no sense to me but if you can legitimately tell yourself without feeling a little dishonest about it, great.... i can't tho. the 3x vs 4x acog isn't about the actual magnification, it's the amount of eye relief you get that makes it better suited for CQB. you need to have your head set up just right to get a sight picture with the 4x models. the 3x it's really easy to get a sight picture, because your reticle is still showing up, almost no matter where your head is positioned. when you're shooting with both eyes open it's literally point n shoot. doesn't matter if you're using an acog or a RDS in that regard. if you're shooting with 1 eye then it's a different situation, but you're not using the acog as intended at that point. i'm not worried about the batteries dying, but that's the argument people make for having BUIS with a red dot. and yeah they're supposed to last 5 years, but that's not a guaranteed thing. |
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the 3x vs 4x acog isn't about the actual magnification, it's the amount of eye relief you get that makes it better suited for CQB. you need to have your head set up just right to get a sight picture with the 4x models. the 3x it's really easy to get a sight picture, because your reticle is still showing up, almost no matter where your head is positioned. when you're shooting with both eyes open it's literally point n shoot. doesn't matter if you're using an acog or a RDS in that regard. if you're shooting with 1 eye then it's a different situation, but you're not using the acog as intended at that point. i'm not worried about the batteries dying, but that's the argument people make for having BUIS with a red dot. and yeah they're supposed to last 5 years, but that's not a guaranteed thing. I don't shoot with one eye shut... thats what i was saying. With both eyes open, looking through a magnified optic, you are only going to get proper focus out of one eye. Typically your dominant eye will take over and you will get the reticle and proper sight picture but in less than ideal situations, this doesn't always happen because your brain will choose the image that makes the most sense to it and sometimes that is the eye that is not behind that magnified optic so you have to really train yourself to switch focus between eyes. Outside, i find this very easy... i can scan with my left eye and then adjust focus back through the scope. Inside this takes way too much concentration for me. I understand what you are saying about your eye box (probably a better term here than simple eye relief bc it accounts for being off front to back and side to side) but I was never talking about that. I could get behind the optic pretty well... it was a "which eye is going to dominate?" the instant I do get behind the scope. Go turn the light on in a room and try to aim into a dark room and see how it goes. I don't know man... acogs are good optics but I just can't get behind what you are saying. This isn't the first time I have heard someone say they are just as good in these situations with an acog but i have never seen it. I've seen many attempts, I have attempted myself, and no one can do it as fast and as accurately but maybe you are just better than all of us IDK. I just can't find any situation where I think the acog is the best optic for the job... it is a good optic but with the advances in variable powers, i don't think the slight weight savings are worth being stuck with a fixed 3x or fixed 4x when you can have something that can be in the 1x range (the VCOG is a good true 1x and can work very well for HD) and then give you 33% more magnification if you need to reach out. The micro is so different from the ACOG/VCOG tho its kinda hard to compare. I just think the micro has a better place in the civilian world. Rather have an ACOG if i'm defending an OP in afghanistan... rather have a micro in Cola SC. I don't know what else to say. |
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A revised mini acog is due out at shot show. Whatever you pick, wait to see what's out next. Source? I'm not seeing one, but he might be referring to the TA44-C-400138 on Trijicon's website.(138 is the Amber reticle, 140 Is the green, and 141 is red. Just so we know they still offer all three colors) I can't find any differences between it and the TA44S-10, though. Think it's supposed to be an updated eyepiece or something. It's not exactly a really popular model,(Shockingly) even though it's amazing for people with astigmatism. Probably because it's 1.5X and costs between $750 and $950. Either way, it's probably one of the better options for civilian shooters, since it's about as fast as a red dot up close and gives you a considerable edge at longer distances. |
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