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Posted: 10/30/2006 3:56:41 PM EDT
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Ok, I am looking for an affordable mil dot scope for my Middy and I came across Mueller as having a good reputation for decent glass for a decent price. I was checking on their website and am now confused by two of their models There is the Mueller 3-10x44 Tac II. It is a non illuminated Mil Dot reticle. 1/4" MOA clicks. MSRP: $299 Then there is the Mueller 4-16×50AO Tactical. It is an Illuminated Mil Dot Reticle, 1/8" MOA clicks. MSRP: $249 Why is the illuminated, more powerful, larger ocular lens scope less expensive? |
| i have both 3-10x44 tac II. the tac II is made in japan very nice glass i have that on a ar. i also have the 4-16 x 50 mildot very nice glass also . i think this is assembled in china. i have it mounted on a 17hmr rimfire. only thing i do not like is the 1/8moa clicks. also 4-16 x 50 is a very large scope. i had it on a flat top takes up a lot of space.shop around you can find a better deal. |
I noticed the other day that everyone finally gave up and let the 18 month old thread die... Oh well. If Trijicon would just put a BDC in their TR21 series, I couldn't give two damns for anything Mueller came out with afterward, even if it was $200 less. To be honest, I've owned two Mueller scopes. One was the 2-7 that Mueller refunded my money on for "fisheye" effect at all magnifications, and the original Tactical. I really wasn't impressed with the optical clarity and especially the brightness (or lack thereof). I've owned a SuperSniper and several Burris Fullfield II's, and they were all noticeably brighter and clearer than the Mueller. On the other hand, Mueller's illumination system is significantly better than Burris' sad attempt. Sometimes, "medium" and "high" just don't cut it. |
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iwouldnt say that! i have the 1.x4 cqb scope mounted now and have gotten notcie that the refined version should be in my hands for T&E in the next week or two..... Mueller wants it 100% before it hits the shelf i have been tourtre testing it and beating the hell out of it nad iam here to tel lyou its good to go so far i wont post all the photos i have o fit but i can say this it does exsist... in physical form  over 1k rounds through it on 223 and 12 gauge and it is current on a an hk91(308) getting trigger and match time....... |
more rare than bigfoot! mueller will sell a shitload of em if they do this right.
Hmm, very interesting...I'll be watching for your review... |
You wouldn't say what GW... that the thread is dead after 18 months? Well yeah, it kinda is.
Since you mentioned it, is this the "original" Mueller scope with the daytime illumination and BDC?
What exactly have you done to the scope that you consider "torture testing and beating the hell out of it"? That finish looks pretty good for a statement like that. Hell, I'd still be interested in hearing about an existing scope, after all, I went to the trouble of calling them about it over two years ago and starting the first freaking thread to gauge people's interest in a 1x-4x optic for under $300, so I'm certainly not going to write it off completely, but I'm a bit less than enthusiastic about it anymore. I bet DevL is still counting the days before it's release though. 
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i will have the new version with the updated reticle and illmuination system in about a week or 2 i belive. more to come..........price point should be the same...... What exactly have you done to the scope that you consider "torture testing and beating the hell out of it"? That finish looks pretty good for a statement like that. that pic was taken after i first got it..... as for toutre test your talking to a guy that broke a sopmod prototype but for your enjoyment scope was soaked in mud for 36 hours,,,in 45 degreee weather left out for 3 DAYS IN THE RAIN NO COVERS ON IT INCLUDING ADJ CAPS, scope had 400 rnds shot through it as fast as gun was loaded, scope was tested on remington 12 gauge 870 with over 30 rounds of 3.5 inch slugs fired/buckshot fired, was dropped onto range from height of 4 feet on the gun to deck....scope was then box tested for repeatablity (passed) and some more it is current on a hk 91 getting rattled around, by that as well it also went through through some drill by a local SRT team.... new features will included better lit reticle, differnt lens and coatings..... more to follow anything else................ |
Looks good, I have the perfect place for one of those. 1 inch tube or 30mm?
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The one I got from them broke almost immediatly. As in less than four rounds and it shit the bed. |
Well that was one I got from them almost a year ago, maybe longer. I am sure they'll fix whatever the problem was. These were intended, as I remember it, as an inexpensive alternative for those who wanted a tactical type scope for competition, or something other than "Behind enemy lines" type stuff and did not want to cough up the cash for something like a Short Dot or even a meopta. Oh I got to shoot a Shot Dot ealier this year-very very cool but I did notice that although forgiving it was still a regular scope you still had to get your head into a correct position (v. an aimpoint). edit the guys a Meuller were very nice to deal with, apologized profusely, said that they would fix whatever the problem was before production, gave me my money back, offered to have me try a production model etc. |
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Yup, sure was. They told me some other guy had one shooting 3 gun or something and had used it a lot with no problems. Not me, it went down after a couple of rounds of 5.56. Neat idea if they get everything worked out. edit on mine the reticle came loose and started to rotate. In my limited experience if that's going to happen it usually happens right away. |
When the new ones come out I may get one to try out.
Nope, that about covers it... Thanks for the detail. I bought a $50 ZOS scope about a year ago while waiting for this one... So far, the ZOS scope is doing SIGNIFICANTLY better than I ever imagined it would, but then I haven't torture tested it either.  Since you have identified yourself to those of use who followed the original thread, I have another question... When you say "better lit reticle", you mean better than the one you have, (which IIRC was NOT the same as the one Aimless had) but the same as what was eventually settled on for the design, or are you saying "new and improved" over the last advertised design? The one I remember you shooting had the "new and improved" projected illumination system, but it was a single dot, and the rest of the reticle was a German P4 or something. The one that Aimless and others had was a traditionally illuminated model with an etched glass reticle. The last I recall, the final version was supposed to be a horse-shoeish EOTech-like projection illumination reticle with a BDC on the lower verticle stadia. |
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the newest version to be T&E in the next few weeks will have the same horseshoe styled reticle that is enclosed at the bottom and has a 1 moa dot in the middle the line that closes off the horseshoe is for 300yds then so on down the has marks to 500 yds i belive it will also have a shorter stadia line than the first one ( i belive myself and aimless have the same model (glass etched reticle) hten new revision will have a much brighter intensity to the reticle. i have really followed that thread in along time! so im unclear if we had the same revison. i can see the scope with these improvments being a good gap in the market for use i really look foward to the newest model the one i have current is horseshoe glass etched illuminated the newest will be brighter differnt lens and shorter stadia |
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All I remember is that SOMEBODY had a T&E scope with the "new technology" projected reticle that was visible in daylight and was using it for 3-gun. I don't think more than a couple existed. Pics were posted of it on top of an M1A. They were sent to Mueller specifically to show off that particular projected dot reticle. The intermediate design like I believe Aimless had was the same black reticle, but the illumination was like all other Mueller scopes and was not visible in bright daylight. |
i got one of those as well. wish they still had them at cdnn. i like the 30mm and the reticle, even with the large dot. i just use 2" orange pasters at 100yds, and the dot sits in the middle with a little orange ring around it. def worth $50. |
Damn, did I misspell Simmons again?  ZOS Optics... Discontinued and renamed REX optics. Would have bought the simmons for the same price, but this one was illuminated and I needed that for dillos. Mine looks just like this, except it says ZOS on the side instead of REX.  infsqdldr - I had mine on top of a Denny's RECON barrel for a while, and I found that if I zeroed it dead center of dot at 50 yards, I would hit somewhere within the dot from 50 - 250, and top of line below the dot was 300-ish. It really ain't bad for the price I paid, but the dot was too big for a Denny's recon barrel. |
i had the dot zeroed at 100yds, and the top of the bottom post was on at 200yds. with 75gr handloads. ill have to try the 50yd zero, thanks. yeah the dot is not the best for precision work. i got it to test out the variables/dot type optics before dropping $ on an ior or nightforce. |
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