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Posted: 1/26/2006 9:34:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 1:17:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 1:23:02 AM EDT by Green0]
I've seen a few aimpoints with terribly scratched lenses with completely obscured FOV and a few that began to have mysterious battery life problems and some that wouldn't work with a new battery -- this was corroded contacts which should not have happened given the battery compartments were closed and had just airborne humidity of when the battery was put in to effect them. The problem is solved by scouring the compartment till it shines and re-installing he spring and battery. That is a no-go the way I look at it the compartment should be gold plated.

No EO's No ACOGs.

All field use. Never damaged any personally at home or in the field but have seend the aimpoints damaged and not working in my platoon.

The backup sights get used. I used mine for several lengths of time over in Iraq. My throwlevers sheared and I was using backups, my doctor optic broke and I used backups. The point is a fall back system is essential in most cases. You have to be contingencey prepared. Even with a USO scope which is like bullet proof who's to say it doesn't catch schrapnel or break a lense in an unfortunate fall off a roof or something? It will probably never happen but it might.

USO is the closest thing to an optic I would not feel the need for a BUIS system with, and due to past experience I would still say have the BUIS.

I knew SF guys that had the BUIS's mounted even though they had three fall back optical sights [like ACOG, Trijicon Reflex, EO tech, and Aimpoint issued to ONE SOLDIER]
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 5:45:23 AM EDT
GreenO, just because they are carrying extra optics does not mean they shouldn't also have BUIS. If in the middle of a fire fight a your main optic goes TU, flip it off or flip up the BUIS and carry on the fight. You are not going to go through your pack, find the next optic, properly place it on the correct rail location, then return to the fight.

BUIS are there because Murphey IS on the battle field.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 5:58:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 5:59:41 AM EDT by QUIB]
I carry an Aimpoint in my pack as a (BUES) Back Up Electronic Sight........in case my EOTech fails.

Link Posted: 1/27/2006 6:06:21 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 6:21:49 AM EDT by Frens]
take a look at this pic...things like this happens


Link Posted: 1/27/2006 6:40:32 AM EDT
My first thought was that the pic was faked because the hole looks too black. I changed the contrast settings in PaintShop and got this picture.



I'm not saying it couldn't be faked, but if it was altered, they didn't just throw a black blob up there to 'make' a hole.

I also insist on BUIS. I've just run into too many situations (mud, heavy rain, dust/sand) where an optics just wasn't working, and then Murphy kicks in too. BSW
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 7:55:04 AM EDT
mine get used everytime the rifle comes out, shoot with irons and optics
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 8:14:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 8:15:24 AM EDT by QUIB]

Originally Posted By briansmithwins:
My first thought was that the pic was faked because the hole looks too black. I changed the contrast settings in PaintShop and got this picture.

i2.photobucket.com/albums/y3/briansmithwins/scope2.jpg

I'm not saying it couldn't be faked, but if it was altered, they didn't just throw a black blob up there to 'make' a hole.

I also insist on BUIS. I've just run into too many situations (mud, heavy rain, dust/sand) where an optics just wasn't working, and then Murphy kicks in too. BSW



That pic is real. I saw it posted a year or so ago as well.
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 8:21:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By QUIB:

Originally Posted By briansmithwins:
My first thought was that the pic was faked because the hole looks too black. I changed the contrast settings in PaintShop and got this picture.

i2.photobucket.com/albums/y3/briansmithwins/scope2.jpg

I'm not saying it couldn't be faked, but if it was altered, they didn't just throw a black blob up there to 'make' a hole.

I also insist on BUIS. I've just run into too many situations (mud, heavy rain, dust/sand) where an optics just wasn't working, and then Murphy kicks in too. BSW



That pic is real. I saw it posted a year or so ago as well.



+1 real

www.usmc.mil/marinelink/image1.nsf/Lookup/20041128127
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 1:30:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 1:30:48 PM EDT by JosephR]
schrapnel, wasn't it?

nevermind. I learned to read
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 2:07:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 2:09:39 PM EDT by viper5194]

Originally Posted By Frens:
take a look at this pic...things like this happens





7.62 round thru the ACOG while the soldier was looking thru it. IT STOPPED THE BULLET and the soldier commented the ACOG still functioned. I believe I heard, Trijicon actualy replaced the guys ACOG. It was a gift from his father for him in Iraq... ACOG's indeed rule...
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 2:17:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 2:17:23 PM EDT by Frens]

CAMP BAHARIA, Iraq (Nov. 1, 2004)

A rifle-mounted scope designed to enhance enemy visibility on the battlefield saved the life of a Marine during a Sept. 17 firefight on the outskirts of Fallujah, but not the way intended.

Sgt. Todd B. Bowers, a member of the 4th Civil Affairs Group, I Marine Expeditionary Force, spotted enemy snipers during a security patrol outside the restive town of Fallujah. While returning fire, a sniper-fired round hit Bowers’ advanced combat optical gun site, mounted on his M-16A2 service rifle. Fragmentation from both the ACOG and the bullet were peppered across the left side of Bowers’ face.

“It was about a four-hour firefight. Bullets were flying everywhere, and as I returned fire, it felt like my weapon blew up,” said Bowers, 25, a native of Washington, D.C.

A Navy corpsman removed a piece of fragmentation and applied a pressure dressing to his left cheek.

As the corpsman began calling for a medical evacuation, Bowers refused and kept on fighting alongside his fellow Marines.

“After he was cleaned up, I knew he would be okay, but I was surprised that he didn’t want to leave on a medical evacuation,” said Sgt. Jung Kil Yoo, a member of 4th CAG.

Small pieces of fragmentation can still be seen on the left side of his face.

“Luckily, I had my ballistic goggles on to protect my eyes, without them I probably would not be able to see out of my left eye,” said Bowers.

He can still see the bullet lodged in his scope, which was given to him by his father, John Bowers, two days before leaving to Iraq.

“The last time I saw my dad was the day he handed me the scope,” said Bowers.

His dad was a former sergeant in the Marine Corps, who didn’t want to see his son go into combat without a useful piece of gear.

“The ACOG was the best purchase I have ever made in my life,” said John to his son during a phone conversation.

Bowers’ heroism and loyalty to his unit impressed even those who knew him well.

“I knew he was a good Marine,” said Yoo, 28, a native of Neptune, N.J. “Where some would freeze up, he stood his ground and continued to press forward.”

“Sgt. Bowers was able to keep a cool head about the whole situation,” said Lance Cpl. James J. Vooris, 20, a native of Albany, N.Y., and a combat photographer with Headquarters Company, Regimental Combat Team 1.

With all that was going on around him, Bowers did not have time to stop and think about what happened.

“I didn’t realize how lucky I was till later that day when I sat down to think about it,” said Bowers.

As a constant reminder of how the scope possibly saved his life, Bowers plans to keep the scope and mount it on his mantel when he returns home.

“It’s (the bullet) there and I am glad it stayed there,” said Bowers as he pointed to his ACOG still mounted to his weapon.

Bowers, who has been in Iraq since August, is currently serving a seven-month deployment, his second tour in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom.



from usmc.mil
Link Posted: 1/27/2006 2:31:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/27/2006 2:38:32 PM EDT by Green0]
My point is that getting you optics broken is far more likely to happen doing something mundane than in the heat of a firefight.

It's easier to "Oh shit" someone nocked it over or I dropped it or hit a bump and it landed wrong on the steel floor than to actually ruin it when you have both hands on the rifle.

I was talking to an SF guy about rifles dropping and breaking optics and another team member walked over with a carabiner wolf tail sling and joined the conversation and rested his hand on the grip of his rifle when his cheap carabiner's locking gate failed and his rifle took a dive on the concrete. No broken parts and his ACOG was fine but the point is that is how most of the crap gets broken in my experience. He was pretty embarassed but it happens to us all- just not likely at that inopportune of a moment.

I still have backup sights but don't expect to need them in a heartbeat as much as for a few weeks if something breaks and needs to get repaired.

To clarify I reccomend back up iron sights. I don't have any crazy ideas about needing them in a seconds notice but I do use them and I think having them availible promotes more confidence in the weapon-- if you ever started shooting and realized your optics aren't zeroed you could remove them and use the irons-- condingent systems are a good idea.

like the other posts say:
incliment weather
Broken optics in/out of battle
non- zeroed optics
battery failure at the wrong time
dirty lenses without something to clean them with you name it if something stupid happens sometimes it's nice to have something to fall back on.
Link Posted: 1/31/2006 3:36:02 PM EDT
This EOTech took a round in Iraq and luckily for the soldier it absorbed much of the energy of the impact. (Notice that he doesn't have a BUIS.) Trijicons and EOTechs are pretty tough but even a bullet or shrapnel can take them out. It may not happen often, but it can happen -Murphy's Law.
Link Posted: 1/31/2006 6:56:47 PM EDT
And that right there is proof why you need a BUIS, like a spare tire or Home owners insurance, you may carry it you entire life and never need it....but the one time you need it....it sure is nice to have it their.

Don't know about the rest of you, but I suck at predicting the future... so I run a BUIS with my Aimpoint

Proper planning prevents piss poor performance...... words to live by.

Now if your a paper plate shootin off a bench hobby shooter kinda guy who will never use your AR for anything more then that........then this princible does not apply to you. Blast away with no worries.....
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