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Posted: 10/4/2003 5:17:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/17/2003 9:00:50 AM EDT by GunDraw]
To all you scope buffs out there I have a question. I'm looking to put a decent scope on top of my flat-top bushy varminter.

I was looking at something around 6-24, but decided (given the length and lack of adjustment (.223 does drop, hehe) that 4-16 would probably suffice)

Anyway, I had heard nothing but great things about the Bushnell ELITE (notice the descrepancy there), now I have a chance to purchase a burris for a decent price. (maybe black diamond?) At any rate, what would everyone's suggestion be between the two? I know burris's stuff is a little more pricey, is it justified?? What about Bushnell. After gathering some info for some time. I hear most say the Elite series are a sweet pieces of glass, while I had one person with the old B & L version said there were some downsides with the adjustment turrets.

How about Burris's rings and mounts?(Signature posi alighn??) Burris's scopes in general?

Confused with all the choices!!
Gundraw
Link Posted: 10/6/2003 4:28:16 PM EDT
Anyone care to comment...please. hehe. I imagine both are probably great scopes, but burris seems to flaunt some of their special features like posilock, and the 30mm tube. Are these items worth it. I've never had a 30mm tube. What are the advantages?? (other than paying more for rings, hehe) Gundraw
Link Posted: 10/6/2003 4:43:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 9:01:44 AM EDT
Anybody care to comment on the advantages of 30mm scopes?? I've never had anything but a 1" in the past, so I have not clue what makes them superior optics(if they are). Gundraw
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 9:37:30 PM EDT
A bigger tube gives you more windage and elevation adjustment. That is the primary advantage. It is also stronger, but I have badly abused some 1" scopes and never had one break. The marketing guys might tell you that 30mm tube are brighter and clearer, but in my experience glass quality is much more important. I have a 4200 and it is an excellent scope. I don't know anybody with a Burris so I can't compare the two.
Link Posted: 10/17/2003 9:00:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/17/2003 9:06:43 AM EDT by GunDraw]
Okay, How does burris compare to Bushnell, Nikon, Leupold?? I've always thought they were (generally) ranked: Leupold Burris/Nikon Bushnell But then some have said the Elite series from Bushnell is superior to the Burris Black Diamond series. Anyone know if the Armalite one piece mount would work for a 6-24 burris Black Diamond 50mm Adjustable objective?? (would it allow it enough forward mounting/be tall enough to clear the objective from the handguard?) Any more experience with Bushnell OR Burris would be much appreciated. Gundraw Thanks everyone so far!
Link Posted: 10/17/2003 9:42:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/17/2003 9:44:13 AM EDT by imposter]
Originally Posted By GunDraw: I've always thought they were (generally) ranked: Leupold Burris/Nikon Bushnell
View Quote
The Bushnell 4200 has better glass than the Leupold VXIII. I have both and have compared them side-by-side, and the Bushnell is brighter and clearer.
Link Posted: 10/17/2003 10:07:10 AM EDT
This isn't intended to start a flame war, but IMHO, Leupold scopes are outrageously over-priced and of inferior optical quality. They have a reputation for being rugged, and have a lifetime no BS warranty, but so does Burris. When shopping for a 3-9x scope for my hunting rifle, I went to Cabelas and compared a Burris Fullfield II ($200), Nikon Monarch ($300), Zeiss Conquest ($400), Bushnell 3200 ($230 IIRC), Leupold VXII ($350 IIRC). My "comparison" was looking at a game mount about 80 yds away on the wall, at 3x and at 9x, looking at FOV, brightness, clarity (being able to pick out detail on the hide). My rankings were: 1) Zeiss (clearly picked up 3 spots of decreasing size) 2) Nikon (clearly got 2 spots, and 50% of the smallest) 3) Burris (clearly picked up 2 spots, and 25% of the smallest) 4) Bushnell (picked up 2 spots, definitey not as clear) 5) Leupold (could barely pick up the largest spot, not even close to the other 3 in clarity/brightness) Was the Zeiss $100 better than the Nikon? Nope! Was the Nikon $100 better than the Burris? Nope! Was the Zeiss $200 better than the Burris? Definitely NOT! Was the Burris better than the comparably priced Bushnell? Definitely. Was the $200 Burris head & shoulders better than the $350 Leupold? ABSOLUTELY! Hands down, I think Burris makes the best scope for the money. --Otter
Link Posted: 10/17/2003 3:57:58 PM EDT
I love my two Elites. I've had Nikon and Leupold Vari-X III's in the past. The Bushnell is clearly a better deal and a better product. Never had a Black Diamond Burris.
Link Posted: 10/20/2003 10:02:48 AM EDT
I appreciate the honest insight from everyone. Ottergt - I definitely agree there are better deals than simply, "you get what you pay for". What you pointed out is true with what I've usually found. I still can't decide. The deal is, the dealer has marked down his burris's for an awesome sale. I had my mind made up on the Bushnell (4200) up until now. But I don't want to pass up possibly getting a little better optics for the same price now that this sale has come up. I feel both are probably superb scopes. But I'm also wondering if a scope like that is overkill for an AR?? Does anyone know if these massive objectives will fit on a flattop ar with the Armalite mounts?? Will it position the scope far enough forward for proper eye relief?? Thanks again for all the help so far. Gundraw
Link Posted: 10/20/2003 10:25:01 AM EDT
Don't know how much discount we're taling about for the Burris, but you could always buy it and if it's not to your liking, sell it on ebay, gunbroker, or the EE here. Black Diamond vs 4200...can't say, since I have no experience with those specific models. I don't think you'll go wrong with either. --Otter
Link Posted: 10/20/2003 4:42:24 PM EDT
The BUSHNELL elite 4200 is the brightest and clearest for the money and if it rains there is no comparison thier rainguard works ,it just makes me sick to think how much my schmidt and bender cost and how close my elite4200 comes to it .the 4-16x50 I have is hard to beat. SWFA and the optic zone have good prices on them .
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