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Ammunition review - Federal/Lake City XM193 (Page 2 of 3)
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Off-the-shelf SR-556.
Have used it with 100% success. Alternate it with Hornady 55gr training when I am too tired to pick up the brass (long-handled magnet  ).
FWIW, the Hornady cases end up fairly well scattered. I use piston setting 2 for them. The 193 cases end up in a two-foot radius on setting 1. |
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Thousands of rounds fired through CMMG 11.5. Issue, multiple blown primers in LC 08 head stamped XM193 and some in early LC09 XM193 (primers not crimped). Blown primers were reported in Personal ARs used at the PD as well as issued Colt Commandos. Latest PD purchase of XM193 LC09 seems to be trouble free, shot a couple thousand rounds through CMMG without issue and no further reports from the SRT of any more blown primers in our Colts. It's training ammo, we'll keep buying it and shooting it as long as the price is right. |
<I visited BOTS to troll and all I got was this lousy account lock. -NorCal>
Temperature : 35 F Altitude : 6900 Feet Lot Number : SMQ09J037-372 No FTF, No FTE, all action was positive. Accuracy was acceptable, focus of test was on velocity differences. |
[NO TEXT, well, sort of anyway...]
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I have shot 720 rounds of the Federal xm193 through LMT MRP CQB16 piston rifle (1/7 twist rate) with no feed problems, accuracy and flash are acceptable. Rifle has not been cleaned since the initial cleaning and lube upon purchasing it new in January of this year. Ammunition was shot over a 7 month period beginning with January 2010, and has been shot in 12 degree weather up the the heat of the summer (103 deg) and in the rain as well. There were about 6 trips to the range in this time frame, the least I ever shot at one time was 60 rounds and I think the most was around 250. Piston and bolt were periodically removed for inspection but not cleaned. The bolt did fail to lock back after the last round was fired on one magazine but I was breaking in 4 new pmags early on in the test and I would attribute it to that rather than a weak round (I didn't notice any difference in the sound / recoil) or rifle malfunction. I have 800 rounds left and I plan on buying more. I have noticed no deformities (other than discoloration from the annealing process) Ammo was purchased from Ammoman.com during a sale.
I'm planning on buying more. Oh, I should mention I'm testing this rifle for reliability in poor conditions / maintenance. I was going to push it to failure, but am thinking of cleaning it and of just calling it good enough. |
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Originally Posted By RileyS: I've experienced several instances of blown primers with an 07 batch of XM193A, these failures occurred in a carbine that has successfully run many types of 5.56 pressure ammo in the past with no ill effects, including earlier lots of XM193, only to have popped primers with this XM193A at a rate of about 6/1000. The gun cycled fine, but was unable to go fully into battery due to the primer prohibiting BCG closure. In some cases, the BCG was far enough forward that the hammer was able to drop. Other primer failures may have occurred and gone unnoticed if the primer did not bind BCG movement. At .006% that's too high for me, considering I bought this ammo for serious use. I just had this happen to me. I bought a 200 round pack, head stamp LC10, and couldn't get through 2 magazines. Every 10th round or so a primer would pop. In one case, the damn anvil was stuck behind the locking lugs, not just the primer. Like stated above, I may have blown even more primers, but unless something was preventing the next round from going into battery, I wouldn't have known it. I've shot the stuff before and had no problems. I'd hate to have to not use it anymore for fear of blown primers. |
Some people will leave their mark on this world, while others leave merely a stain.
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I shot 100rds this past weekend and had at least one blown primer. I saw a shell casing on the ground with a blown primer, but wasn't sure whether it came from my gun or not. When I cleaned the rifle that evening, there was a primer in the lower receiver. I was surprised...I used to shoot a ton of this stuff back around '02-'04 but got out of the game for a few years. This is the first time I've shot any of the newer stuff (09 headstamp).
ETA - 5.56 chamber |
I hear voices...and they don't like you.
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I bought 1K of XM193BK in an ammo can at the Orange Country Crossroads of the West Gun show. The bulk ammo was Federal marked LC10, but no NATO cross.
As far as I can tell, the red primer sealant is in place. There is no sealant at the neck. So far, my only issues are with inspecting the cases along the lines of reloading. The primer crimps are sub-standard, and the primer pocket diameters are beyond specification at +0.176" I have not shot that many, but the brass is not reloadable due to the primer pocket diameter. I disassembled a sample and that primer pocket is also too large. The sealant and poor crimp may be all that is holding in the primers and the posts are sounding like statistical failures of the crimp and sealant....... |
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Originally Posted By RegionRat:
I bought 1K of XM193BK in an ammo can at the Orange Country Crossroads of the West Gun show. The bulk ammo was Federal marked LC10, but no NATO cross. As far as I can tell, the red primer sealant is in place. There is no sealant at the neck. So far, my only issues are with inspecting the cases along the lines of reloading. The primer crimps are sub-standard, and the primer pocket diameters are beyond specification at +0.176" I have not shot that many, but the brass is not reloadable due to the primer pocket diameter. I disassembled a sample and that primer pocket is also too large. The sealant and poor crimp may be all that is holding in the primers and the posts are sounding like statistical failures of the crimp and sealant....... That's probablely why it was selling so cheap on gunbroker.com. I saw 400 rounds go for $105. |
Common Sence...Isn't
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Where can I puchase some of this? AIM doesnt seem to have it right now.
I found this but not sure if its the same kind as I am not seeinf "AF" or "LC" on the box.. Cheaper than Dirt. |
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Originally Posted By CleanMoostang:
Where can I puchase some of this? AIM doesnt seem to have it right now. I found this but not sure if its the same kind as I am not seeinf "AF" or "LC" on the box.. Cheaper than Dirt. That is it. Palmetto State Armory has it for $5.99/20. S&H is $12 for 1000 rounds. If you don't need that many, split it with a friend. |
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I'm new on this board...hope I'm doing this correctly...trying to add to the XM193 ammo thread.
I have had problems with this ammo. Using a stock Ruger SR-556 with about 1,500 round through it, (cleaned after every session). My first batch of XM193 (200 ea) worked very well. The next batch with a different lot number (#SMQ09M037-405...LC 09 head stamp)...I had 5 failures to chamber the next round out of 100 (light load?). I also had one primer blow out of the casing, it got stuck between the BCG and the receiver, requiring quite a bit fussing around to get the BCG loose. This blown primer caused a pretty nasty score/gash in my receiver, (not very happy about that). I emailed Federal with details five days ago...no response as yet. I have 600+ more rounds from this lot number. I will not be using it. |
| UPDATE...Federal contacted me, asked me to ship the remaining ammo back to them for evaluation. They said that they would reimburse me for the ammo cost and the return shipping charges. If this all plays out, I will be very impressed with their customer service. |
| We fired a 500 round case in my academy class with zero problems. I've fired a hundred or so of my own out of my 16" Stag upper with no issues. |
"The test of character is not 'hanging in' when you expect light at the end of the tunnel, but performance of duty and persistence of example when you know no light is coming."
- Admiral James B. Stockdale
- Admiral James B. Stockdale
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I considered the American Eagle black box XM193 my go-to ammunition for my 14.7 CMMG since I've had it.
Bought a lot of a thousand and began to experience blown primers and failures to extract. My rifle experienced no similar malfunctions with any other ammunition, including surplus Green Tip and Black Hills 75 grain loadings. I thought this might be a barrel issue and had my rifle checked by two separate smiths with no problems. While I normally shoot between two and three hundred rounds per session, I clean my rifle religiously before it goes back in the safe, so I know this is not a maintenance issue. I loved this ammo as it is loaded relatively hot and always gave me good accuracy, but the issue with the primers has me concerned. I bought a 100round bulk pack in September and had zero problems with it, so hopefully this has been fixed. Anybody else had similarly good experiences with new batches of this ammunition? |
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I've put approximately 1,400 rounds of this through my 16" BCM BFH upper on a Spike's lower with zero problems.
The only problem I've had is I've come across a few rounds with badly dented cases that I did not use. But I can live with throwing away 3 or 4 rounds out of 1,000. |
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RRA 16" midlength 1/8 SS
- About 700 rounds of Federal XM193 from the 500 round cases - 100 or so rounds were suppressed with no problems except a 1/4" POI shift @ 25 yards. - All rounds fired and ejected as designed. Bushmaster 20" 1/9 CL - About 8-900 rounds fired from 500 round cases - Between 2-300 rounds were suppressed - No failures whatsoever. SIG556 Classic SWAT 16" 1/7 (Melonited) - About 4-500 rounds fired from 500 round cases - Between 100-150 rounds fired suppressed. - No failures but accuracy was terrible. Could be more the shooter than the firearm. |
Rifle > Carbine
| Multiple blown primers. Read here: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/568432_What_do_I_do_with_bad_ammo_.html |
http://www.gunsite.com
http://www.vickerstactical.com/
http://www.vickerstactical.com/
Accuracy isn't the best, isn't the worst either. Rifle is a SR-15 with a 2 moa Aimpoint T-1.
By comparison, Speer 55gr Gold Dot 5.56mm...I was holding center on this group. On the XM I was holding on the bottom (6 o'clock) of the outer red ring...rifle has a 50 yard zero. The Gold Dots are about $.50-.80 cents more a round too. 
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It shoots very well for me. Standing at 25m.
M193 is my favorite flavor bar none. This group was shot from a 1/9 lightweight midlength. http://i.imgur.com/QoKNz.jpg |
| I didn't have good luck with the american eagle xm193. I shoot a dpms ar 15 with a 18" barrel 1/9 twist, all stock and brand new. out of every 100 round box i get 5-8 rounds that dont fire at all, some times it wont fire the first time and will fire the second time i try it. no other malfunctions have occured with the ammo just the miss fires. i have tried about 700 rounds of american eagle xm193 and have had this with every box. i thought it might be my rifle but i have no problems with other brands and my own reloads. so now i don't shoot it anymore since i cant fire every round or even get through a 30 round mag without problems. |
| There are so many variations and lots for Fed XM193 that it's hard to generalize. I had a few cases of LC 08 that had numerous off-center bullets. They still shot OK though. All other lots have been very good. Most recent was LC 11 with Nato + that looks and shoots great. |
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Originally Posted By BamaInArk:
I was breaking in a new gun today. A bushmaster Predator with 20 inch 1/8 twist barrel...non chrome lined chambered in 5.56. This is the first time I've shot it since I bought it 2 months ago. I was pumping different rounds through it and cleaning the barrel/chamber after about every 20 rounds. I shot a box of Federal American Eagle Black Box XM193C. Lot # V 49 W575, I've had this ammo since late last year. I seem to remember reading of some issues with the black box stuff and I believe that specific lot # vs the white or brown box. I had shot a few boxes of this ammo when I first received it in my first Bushy Patrolman, 16 incher. I didn't notice any issues then. Today however out of the one box of 20 I had 3 blown primers. Two of the primers fell out onto the shooting table I was using. I shot 2 boxes of brown box XM193, a box each of Monarch brass FMJ and soft points, a box of 69 and 75 gr PRVI and 2 boxes of Monarch steel. None of the other ammo appeared to have any issues. One thing I seemed to notice was a bigger dent made by something in the base of the Fed AE (black box)brass which none of the other brass or steel seemed to be near as bad. Oh and I did have one round fail to chamber fully. I was using a Bushmaster 5 round magazine. I thought I had a FTFire. When I pulled the trigger is snapped but when I looked the round was not in battery and I could still see brass. I ejected that round and reinserted it back into the same mag and it fed ok the next few rounds until empty. I didn't use the 5 rounder anymore just in case. Regardless of the packaging it comes in, all Federal XM193 is the same. The letter suffix after XM193 doesnt relate to the ammunition; it only indicates what sort of package it is in. |
It's gotten to the point where the news media is no longer a source of information, rather, it is now simply another resource for those asserting control over the citizenry.
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I have shot probably close to 2,500 rds of this thru my Daniel Defense and have close to 10,000 rds thru my Colt 6940. Have had zero ammo related malfunctions only had a couple Failure to Feed due to a worn out mag. It is clean burning and accuracy is better than most except for higher dollar rounds like Black Hills.
ETA: Have shot out to 300 yards and accuracy is better than most. Although at longer distances I prefer at least a 62 gr. load. For all around range shooting or SHTF stash at NORMAL prices this is hard to beat. |
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Don't count this as a vote. But such a strange experience.
I am new to the AR and new to the forum. I bought 500 round in the brown box from a member (this has nothing to do with him). It is marked LC 05, Lot 118. Just to check it, I opened a random box. 19 shells! Seriously, one empty space. Picked out 1 round and it had a dent that a BB could sit in. ....starting to get pissed. Picked through a few more plus a second box. It was all ok, most had tiny dents. Definitely not pretty. Have seen some references to Lot 118 as problematic. But what are the odds of 19 rounds and a major dent in my first ever box of XM193? |
Ammunition review - Federal/Lake City XM193 (Page 2 of 3)
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