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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Good Surplus .308 (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 8/14/2006 6:38:57 PM EDT
| It is getting harder to find Port., Austrailian, or IMI surplus every day? Does anyone know about Hindenberger ammo? Where can I find good surplus ammo other than L.C.? Why are the prices on all ammo going through the roof? |
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If you want surp 7.62x51 get it now as it will get harder to find. Port, almost gone, Hirtenberger, basically out unless you can score some at a show. Aussie, Same thing, out there but skimpy, RG, same. Malasian, out there some but about the same. Really the only true surp out there right now in quantity is SA and the supplies are dwindling and the prices are going up little by little. I suspect that dealers have quite a bit stored away in the back room they will pull out once it gets harder to find it in bulk. It won't be 3 or 4 bucks per 20 tho. Hopefully more will hit the shores but I'm not holding my breath waiting til it makes it here either. |
Ouch. That's more than twice the price of SA from AIM. It is reloadable though. |
shit four beers and Im double tapping, tapping 
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No S#$t I bought 200rds of this IMI stuff haven't got to the range with it yet. I think all the ammo distributors are totally trying to hose us! No I do not believe delivery costs have gone up as I ship things all the time UPS ground and those rates haven't changed for awhile. No I don't think it's because of increased material costs as I reload and haven't seen these dramatic increases in any of my components. I think just like the oil companies the distributors are trying get us use to seeing these high prices so when they lower them a little you'll think "hey that's great this ammo was $20.00 more for 500rds last month" when actually you're going to be paying $30.00 more than you would have 3 months ago. Start reloading and send the distributors the message that you're not going to get bent over just because you like to shoot. Let them sit on that ammo for 6 months and see if the prices don't drop. There is no shortage of ammunition just greedy distributors controling the amount they release on the market.Too bad we can't refine crude oil a home!
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The cheapest 7.62x51 Surplus on the Internet, Rifle Company, XXIV Corps, updated often ... |
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Georgia Arms sells 500 rounds of 150gr FMJ for $180.00 all day long and they are not going to run out. The make it themselves. www.georgia-arms.com/canned_heat.htm |
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I think you are about 18 months too late for Aussie, RG, Hirtenberger, etc..... and way too late for cheap ammo of any kind, (cheap.... as in what it used to cost us). Go for the AIM South Africian, which is OK ammo, os sit back and prepare to go dry for some time to come..... or just buy commercial. Ted Kennedy and Diane Feinstein should call the Pres every day and thank him for the war in Iraq...cause until that's over, surplus ammo is going to get harder and harder to find. After that ends....who knows. |
I don't know that the war in Iraq has anything to do with it. This is mostly much older ammo and 7.62 NATO is not the primary ammo anyway. |
| Up to three months ago I was getting 500rds of FMJ LC delivered for $159.00 I don't believe the war is causing any shortages of the ammo I'm using. They did away with the M60 and as for M193 we only give that to the NG so I still say this is a contrived shortage to get you to pay more. Everyone, once again, start reloading! I've been reloading pistol ammo, .45ACP, .357 mag., for over 20 years now I'm going to get my dies for .223 and .308. You'll make better ammo than the surplus for about the prices you use to pay last year and I find reloading to be almost as much fun as shooting. It isn't rocket science to assemble quality ammo especially if I can do it! As I said earlier in this thread if the distributors had to sit on thier ammo for 6months the prices would drop. If we could all stop driving for 6 months gas prices would drop, same thing. Also I'm not going to buy someone elses reloads with no idea of thier quality control. As for the SA .308 DPMS sent me a special flyer warning me off of this stuff in my AP4 as well as the Malaysian, Indian, and Paki. they said this ammo is not NATO spec. Like I said I'll be pumping out my .308 reloads soon and I'll be hoping the ammo distributors have to eat thier over priced surplus! Boycots work that is a fact people, I not rich and can't shell out $199.00 for 500rds delivered I need that money for my two boys, Later my soap box just fell over! |
Well DPMS thinks their rifles are obviously second rate I guess, but my FALS, M1As, and 308 Garand eat SA for lunch with nary a glitch. $147 per 980 was when I mostly stocked up. |
| Yea the rifle really sucks as it only shoots MOA, has never had a malfunction in 3500rds, made National Riflemans "Gun of the Year"and out shoots my Colt CNM HBAR and Bushy M4, LOL. They warn you off of ammo that they feel will cause you problems, read above 3500 rds no problems of any kind and I put 1200 of those down range without a cleaning.Why would you pay good money for a rifle and then shoot crap through it? Before the price increases it ate LC, Argentine for Aussie, Port, and of course 155gr TAP. When I start reloading .308 I will be duplicating the Hornady ballistics for about what your paying for SA. What I'm saying is we are being ripped off. I'm not going to get into a high school argument "my rifles better than yours" but it is. |
so you've had good luck with this stuff ? |
And what I'm saying is that DPMS is full of Ca Ca if SA is somehow bad for their AR. It is not loaded hot by any means, has a light bullet, and the brass is good stuff. Malasian is good stuff also. What they are probably doing is trying to cover their ass in case there is a problem. They will then go "See, we told you not to shoot surplus". LC 308 is hotter then SA and so is most decent commercial stuff. |
| If it's not hot maybe that's why they're saying to stay away from it ,due to cycliing problems? I think the warning had to do with the ammo being off spec as you said maybe not hot enough to be reliable. I noticed you said "nary" so you must have had some issues with the SA? My rifle has a 16 inch barrel with a shortend gas system so it might not like a weak round, but so far it hasn't choked on anything I fed it. I know the first Springfield SOCOMs had problems with weak loads because of thier gas systems? I put some UMC and PMC through it, not many rds maybe 100 of each, these are kind of weak but it ate them up too. The TAP 155gr is cooking along at 2540-2560fps from this rifle so it is probably a litte hot although the pressures are well within spec for .308. 7.62 NATO is loaded to slightly higher pressures than .308, case thickness and dimensions are slightly differant too, just like 5.56x45 is hotter than .223. Let me ask you; if your car manual told you not to run ethanol would you use it anyway? They never told me not to shoot surplus by the way. In fact when I got this rifle last July I called DPMS and spoke to Bob Simpkins about the use of military surplus. He assured me that's what the rifle can shoot just no SA and the others, so they must have had issues with this ammo in thier rifles. I would not shoot the Malaysian or Paki as it is dirtier than even Wolf. I have seen quite a few fte and ftf with both of these ammos in AR10s and a DSA. The best surplus I shot was that Argentine for Assuie it grouped better than the LC! Can't find that stuff anymore either. |
Source for this? I'm checking my local gunshow on Saturday morning, and if I can't find the ammo I'm lookin' for there, I'll order from AIM. Case of their SA. 308 and a case of their Grade 2 Guat. |
I was told that on the phone today by a young lady named Linda. |
Just the 308 or is the guat going up too? |
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Nary means NO problems with it whatsoever. Has run GREAT in my rifles. It is NOT the most accurate surplus out there but it is fine for range shooting and is very dependable. I've had no misfires, squibs, FTEs, case cracks, nor anything else that would make me stop shooting it. Clean stuff and easy clean up. Bullets are lead/copper jacketed so it is OK to shoot at ranges that will not allow you to shoot steel jacketed, or steel core. It's not really downloaded, it is pretty close to what 7.62x51 is supposed to be loaded at. Unlike 5.56VS.223 7.62x51 is loaded to a lower pressure then .308. Therefore it is fine to shoot 7.62 in a .308 but not vise versa in certain cases involving semi/F/A military/mil type weapons. In fluted chambers SA in certain years is supposed to cause sticking and problems due to the sealant on the bullet. I won't go further as I don't have any fluted chamber battle rifles/types so I don't have firsthand knowledge. Maybe someone with firsthand knowledge can chime in. |
We were talking about the SA 7.62 and the guat didn't come up, so I don't know. |
Hell yeah. I have been using it for over 10 years in all calibers that I own. I carry 9mm JHP +P or 45 JHP +P from them and trust it completely.  The above pictured group was just 150gr ballistic tip listed in "rifle ammo" not in "prescision plus". Yeah, I have had great service from their ammo and from the folks that work there. |
I stand corrected. You are absolutely right in regards to the higher pressures of .308 vs 7.62 it is caused by the thicker brass cases of the military brass not hold quite as much powder charge. I will still avoid the SA for now and get on with my reloading. Doesn't anyone enjoy reloading anymore? Guess by now my original point has been lost. Surplus Ammunition is quickly becoming a rip off boycot it and even your SA will go down in price, besides if the UN import ban ever goes through you'll all be asking me for my load data?
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With me, I really just don't have the time right now in my life to reload. I have all the surp I need for quite some time as I saw what was starting to happen several years ago. Someday I might get into reloading but with being on call for work a lot I would get called off and I don't think thats a good thing. You are correct in that reloading will probably become more popular in the future if ammo cost trends continue. I probably would be trying it right now if I had to buy new factory ammo, especially .308 and Ought 6 as I would have a hard time buying what I shoot if it cost two or three times as much. And who the heck knows, I very well MIGHT be asking you for load data in the future. 
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Source I ordered 4 battle packs of 308 and a case of Grade 2 guat from them about two weeks ago. Good stuff. I think I am about done with SA308. Now I think I will store back brass, powder and primers as I reload. SA308 was up to $250 a 1260rd case at my last gun show. Getting too expensive for my taste. |
Which UN import ban would that be? |
Found the link: Looks like South African .308, 223 Radway, and 7.62x54R go up on Monday, nothing about guat mentioned. ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=217&t=151949 |
cool, I'm going to order some then |
In .308 - I have not had great luck with Georgia Arms ammo. It isnt totally their fault. I know they make good stuff. I ordered a thou of their match grade 168 BTHP ammo. Their .308 at the time (I imagine it still does) uses once fired .mil 7.62x51 LC brass. This brass, fired in machineguns with really long headspacing, stretches the crap out of the brass. I experienced many case head seperations with it... quite un-nerving. In a semi-auto FAL - we stuck a case neck/shoulder and it took a while to clear them (a 7.62x39 case jammed up in there usually does the trick) 
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I have been firing their .308 in AR10s and a Savage 10FP for over 2 years now with zero problems. |
| I have 1000 rds Hirtenberger and 1000 rds Portugese in battlepacks for sale!! Sold my HK-91 and have no need for .308 anymore. Any Washington State residents need some .308? I am in North Bend but can meet if within 40 miles or so. Sorry ...don't mean to hijack this thread ...bad form...but I have two crates of ammo I can't use! HELP! |
I'm looking to buy an M1A next month and am having a hard time finding ammo, I just ordered some of the SA but want to reload. So since the SA is berdan primed and I don't have any boxer primed brass yet, where is a good place to get some cheap .308 brass and what is a good price? |
You might want to check your headspace |
Nope. As I already stated - the brass was damaged before I fired it. I experienced case head seperations in a brand new Remington 700, an AR10 with a match LW barrel, and two different FAL's. All these weapons run flawlessly on any other ammo. I pulled several bullets, and used the paper clip feeler to check the web, and sure enough, many were very thin there. I dunno if this varies lot to lot with the brass they get in from the government.... but in the 1000 rounds I got... WAY too many case head seps. I will never purchase reloaded .308 again because of this. |
hmmm.....maybe more SA & a box of that IMI then |
Don't let that scare you off. I have had ZERO problems with their stuff in 9mm, .45 ACP, .40 S&W, .223, .30-06, and .308. Never, not one problem. If you do have a problem, they will either make good or refund your money. I have been to their facility several times and they are good people. They make the ammo that the state government uses. |
for the price I figure I have to at least give a 500rd case a try I'll have to provide a report after I get some & shoot it |
That isnt what I had. The stuff that kep seperating on me was G308M: G308M 168gr Sierra BT Hollow Pt. Match $245.00/500 The G308UM is twice as much... so it ought to be new components for that price. That is comparable in price to Fed GMM and Black Hills match... at $1 a shot. |
Your right everbody is trying to fuck you. Don't stand for it. Do not buy there ammo. Take a stand! Show them who is in charge. 
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I could not find the 308UM on their site and I could have sworn I ordered 308M. I was gonna call them this afternoon, but all hell broke loose at work for about 4 hours. Basically, a big SHTF emergency, so I did not get to call them. I will order some 308M tomorrow and do a comparison. I still say that they have good stuff and I trust it completely. Did you send or take your problem ammo back to them? |
Nope - but I talked to the owner when it happened. He explained the situation about the once fired military brass, and sometimes this happens with it. It doesnt blow up the gun or anything... just very unnerving especially if it stops up the weapon. He was willing to refund or replace... but I was about halfway thru it... I just shot it over time... had about 5 total out of 1000 split... but many fired casings I checked with the paper clip test showed really thin webs. It was all about their brass source, not their quality of loading. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Good Surplus .308 (Page 1 of 2)
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