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Posted: 12/1/2002 5:21:36 AM EDT
I just bought a case of .223 Sellier & Bellot Ammo. It was all the dealer had at the time. How good is this ammo? It looks decent, I just have not got the time to get to the range to fire some.
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 8:18:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/1/2002 8:19:08 AM EDT by Redbone]
There is a thread on it at the top of the page
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 8:21:06 AM EDT
sell it. it's crap. mike
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 9:04:52 AM EDT
Can you say "KaBoom"?
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 2:37:55 PM EDT
I took your advice, I took it back to the dealer and told him of the feedback I received and ordered Federal American Eagle 1000 rounds.
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 2:43:48 PM EDT
Ah, yes... good ole Smelly & Blowup...
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 3:34:54 PM EDT
I have been using .223 S&B ammo for years and have never had a problem with it. I just went through rifle school in early Nov. and I shot about 500 rounds of S&B without a problem.
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 3:49:22 PM EDT
I've fired up a couple thousand rounds of S&B and found it to be about what you would expect for the money. I had no misfires or stuck casings. The acuarcy is fair and predictable although not as consistent as US surplus. The major down side is that it is one dirty ammo and takes a little longer to clean out of the rifle.
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 3:58:40 PM EDT
not to mention case head seperations and exploding guns.
Link Posted: 12/1/2002 4:12:51 PM EDT
Those who dis' S&B are probably referring to the bad old days when S&B shipped reloads, steel-cased ammo, and other bad things. These days S&B is brand new, factory stuff. Without exaggeration, the guys I shoot with went through at least 50,000 rounds of it in the past year. I shot about 2500 rounds of it myself. It is extremely reliable. While not hyper-accurate, we have no problems getting A-zone hits on IDPA (man-size) targets at 200M. It shoots pretty clean, cleaner than the South African battle pack stuff, and a bit hotter than the SA, velocity-wise, as well. If you are looking for cheap, reliable and safe practice ammo, it's really hard to beat S&B. The nearest equivalent would be the SA stuff, which we also shoot a lot of, and I would describe it as pretty much the same as the S&B (except for the velocity). You should have no problems with either one, assuming your weapon is in good repair and you are shooting a NATO chamber (as opposed to a match .223 chamber).
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 8:48:30 AM EDT
I bought a couple the light green boxes a while back, no problem. Keeping what is left for special purpose, as the bullet' jacket is steel. Ran in my 11.5" SBR without a hic-up.
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 1:15:41 PM EDT
This about covers it: [url]www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=72155[/url] [flame]
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 2:18:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/2/2002 2:19:36 PM EDT by M4_Aiming_at_U]
You all need to list exactly what S&B your talking about. 55grain or 62grain SS109? I have shot a ton of the SS109 stuff with no problems
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 3:20:03 PM EDT
I have fired about 800 rounds of 55 grn. S&B from a three year old case with no problem. It is not terribly accurate however it runs reliably through three different rifles.
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 5:00:56 PM EDT
M4: we're shooting the 55 grain. I've got a case of it sitting in front of me right now. It's marked M193, FMJ (copper jacketed). Beautifully polished brass. Boxer primed. Head stamp is "S&B * .223 REM", where the "*" is some funny little maker's mark. It comes in glossy light green boxes of 20. Lot code is 303/3. Packaging is top notch, not amateurish. Grock: I saw that thread. I don't know where they got that crap from, or how old it was, but holy shit, firing dented cases! That's nuts! An interesting thread, but it must have been some old ammo, because it just doesn't jibe. It's not the same stuff we've been shooting, that's for sure. BTW, we also go through an even larger volume of S&B handgun ammo, all major calibers including .40. At least twice as much. For example, we just hosted the Farnam advanced course. 20 people shot over 14,000 rounds in two days, almost all of it S&B, and without a single problem. Most of it was .40. So sure, watch out for old, crappy, surplus S&B, but I wouldn't stand on ceremony and blow big bucks on Federal just because there used to be problems. It's good stuff these days. I hope it stays that way, because I can afford to shoot a lot more often with it.
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 6:19:39 PM EDT
I ran about 1K rounds of nice shiney new S&B through my AR with no problems except that I found several (say 1%) of the rounds had the primers in backwards... not a good sign. Overall, I would avoid it.
Link Posted: 12/2/2002 9:04:03 PM EDT
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: ...Grock: I saw that thread. I don't know where they got that crap from, or how old it was, but holy shit, firing dented cases! That's nuts!...
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Not a flame or anything, but the author states that the cases *were not* dented until *after* the kaboom and the mag blew out of the mag well. Gabe
Link Posted: 12/3/2002 3:42:01 AM EDT
Gman: oops, sorry, must have read it too fast. StealthyBlagga: out of curiosity, do have any boxes left you could get the lot number off of? 1% is a huge number. I know that we'd send the whole lot back to the distributor we get it from if that ever happened to us (we buy several cases at a time as a group).
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 3:21:44 AM EDT
aa777888-2 The Federals only cost $10.00 more. If I can get something made in the good old USA why not. I have a new Bushmaster, why not feed it good ammo. I do not know that much about S&B, but why chance it.
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 4:13:24 PM EDT
Eye catcher on Grock's refrence was the selector switch with full auto. Having bent a many a round in an M16 on full auto, my best guess would be the rifle was a bit too fast on rate most likely buffer spring rate. The quality of the ammo was definately a factor for the stronger the case in this senario the less chance of this happening. Most failures are combinations of things rather than one.
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 5:59:02 PM EDT
Redhawk, I'm paying $90 a case delivered. How much are you paying for Federal?
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 8:20:56 PM EDT
Sorry - none left and no boxes either. I just blasted away, and checked each primer before loading into the mag. 1% is only 10 occurances of backwards primers in the 1000rounds I bought... a QC problem for sure, but I put it down to experience and went on my way.
Link Posted: 12/6/2002 9:20:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: Redhawk, I'm paying $90 a case delivered. How much are you paying for Federal?
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Are you paying $90 a case for S&B?
Link Posted: 12/7/2002 9:00:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/7/2002 9:01:49 AM EDT by Dru]
I have another S & B ?....... I've got 100 rounds of the SS109 in the green boxes.....It's got the nato cross(headstamp: nato cross, zv 93) and has a green painted tip,primer sealed with green stuff and it's brass cased. I bought this in 1998, and have been hanging on to it as it's part of my 'Save for a rainy day' stash....Has this ammo givin anyone problems? Is it even true SS109? I'm considering just adding it to my range ammo and I'll probably just end up shooting it through my SAR3 and not my Ar's!
Link Posted: 12/7/2002 10:07:43 PM EDT
dru, i have found the S&B SS109 to be loaded hotter than any other european SS109 i can find. if i had a chrony i wouldnt be suprised if it clocked in within M855 specs WHERE CAN I GET THE 55gr FOR $90????????
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 8:38:18 AM EDT
I'm waiting from an email back from my supplier on the current price--will advise.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 10:06:32 AM EDT
aa777888-2, I got 1000 rounds of Federals for $170.00 delevered.
Link Posted: 12/8/2002 11:51:53 AM EDT
I've shot over 5k rounds of S&B and I think they're fine. Once in 300 rounds I might get a occasional misfire, but nothing stupid. Works for me.
Link Posted: 12/9/2002 12:10:33 PM EDT
I love my S&B SS109 loads. Have shot a bunch of those with no problems, and the velocity is quite consistent (the velocity is at around 3075-3085 fps out of my 20", well within M855 specs). They are the best load I have for shooting heavy steel plates at 200 yards.
Link Posted: 12/11/2002 12:10:34 PM EDT
I finally heard back from my supplier, and [shock] there isn't any to be had right now! I suspect that this will be indicative of a price increase [:(] SA stuff is available for 2.89 a box at Cheaper Than Dirt last time I looked. I'll try to post when it's available again.
Link Posted: 12/11/2002 3:48:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By aa777888-2: I finally heard back from my supplier, and [shock] there isn't any to be had right now! I suspect that this will be indicative of a price increase [:(] SA stuff is available for 2.89 a box at Cheaper Than Dirt last time I looked. I'll try to post when it's available again.
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If you don't mind, IM me when you hear from your supplier.
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